Tippy's harebrained idea....A2W intercoooler conversion Carrera 3.2

[quattrorunner]

Heater hose and rubber screw hole clamps really made that job easy. brrrt! brrt! done. I did use the rocker area as well.

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by quattrorunner

Heater hose and rubber screw hole clamps really made that job easy. brrrt! brrt! done. I did use the rocker area as well.

Very convenient

[Tippy]

Some initial data points. Remote inline filler came in, but the fittings were too small in the ID. Was not going to restrict circulation, so did not install for this evening.

But, made an effort to fill system with water and probably got it 90% filled if I had to guess and did some driving to start seeing how this thing works.

___________________________________

61F ambient temp outside this evening.

Ice cold start and the air temp on the software was showing 75F.

Let it idle for a few minutes and the temp stayed dead steady at 75F. Hmmmm, is my IAT sensor dying? Drove through neighborhood and still showed 75F MAT.

That is weird. Motor is already over 200F head temp but MAT is showing 75F.

As I was driving outside the neighborhood on a 45 MPH road, I see it show 74..........73..........72..........71, etc. Interesting. Guess the air over the wing started to make the system get cooler even though the engine was getting warmer.

After about 5 minutes max of driving, engine is fully warm, it is reading 65F!

I noticed that if I downshifted and got the RPM up, the MAT would go down, too. The engine was pulling some air through the heat exchanger after all (remember, I do not have an electric fan on the heat exchanger right now).

Ok, this was pretty cool.

Now it's time for boost. Nailed 2nd to redline and see IIRC 71F. Not bad, but not great. Get into boost here and there and it's hitting the 80's. Hmmmmm, not sure the A2A would be 20+F over ambient at this point. Can't remember.

Drive some more and really tried a 3rd gear pull where it's in boost for a longer duration by doing 2nd to redline, then 3rd to redline. After I let off, I see 94F with a slow taper down to the 80's and then 70's.

So now that is 33F over ambient. Again, don't think I have any datalogs of the A2A ever coming close to that large of a differential.

Take it home, put in garage, and immediately open wing and test temps all over by hand. The heat exchanger, the intercooler, and the hoses were all very cool to the touch. That was pretty amazing.

Hmmmm, not sure what to think at this point. It ran like a raped ape, but it did before too with the A2A in similar ambient temps. Felt like the midrange may be better, but peak HP I can't tell if impacted or not.

Until I get into boost on a really hot TX day in the 100's, I am going to hold judgement.........

[Tippy]

Check this out. "Coolant" temp is head temp showing 240F.

61F ambient outside temps, engine fully warm, no electric fan on heat exchanger, and seeing 65F manifold air temps doing 45 MPH down a road.

Not going to lie, kind of geeking out on that.....

[quattrorunner]

What is iirc again?
I’d be more curious of the water temperature after Intercooler and after the radiator.
Keep in mind that the turbocharged air is much hotter than ambient. I don’t remember what and it probably depends on many things but it’s a lot more than 30 degrees difference. From the turbo it’s pretty hot. I’d have to do some research to re familiarize myself with these things
Your rad probably won’t need a fan till hot summer and maybe not ever where it is at.
I am currently wondering about speed of water flow and whether slower might actually help or at least not be a problem in a system like this? Low form compared to higher flow rate? My water pump isn’t a high flow rate.

[WonkoTheSane]

Is there even room for a slim fan on the radiator? Hard to get a idea and see from just the pictures. It would be interesting though to see if a fan even makes a difference or not when driving.

Wish DFW was closer to Austin, would love to be able to see the car in person. Maybe one of these days I'll finally finish collecting the parts I need for my efi/turbo swap on my '83 SC and have to make a road trip around the state in it with a Austin stop.

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by quattrorunner

What is iirc again?
I’d be more curious of the water temperature after Intercooler and after the radiator.
Keep in mind that the turbocharged air is much hotter than ambient. I don’t remember what and it probably depends on many things but it’s a lot more than 30 degrees difference. From the turbo it’s pretty hot. I’d have to do some research to re familiarize myself with these things
Your rad probably won’t need a fan till hot summer and maybe not ever where it is at.
I am currently wondering about speed of water flow and whether slower might actually help or at least not be a problem in a system like this? Low form compared to higher flow rate? My water pump isn’t a high flow rate.

IIRC = if I remember correctly

Yeah, would take lots of testing see what flow rate is ideal, and even then, it would take PWM to regulate pump power and I’m not investing into another failure point.

It’s either going to fit the bill or not since my A2A is ready to go back on if needed.

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by WonkoTheSane

Is there even room for a slim fan on the radiator? Hard to get a idea and see from just the pictures. It would be interesting though to see if a fan even makes a difference or not when driving.

Wish DFW was closer to Austin, would love to be able to see the car in person. Maybe one of these days I'll finally finish collecting the parts I need for my efi/turbo swap on my '83 SC and have to make a road trip around the state in it with a Austin stop.

Unfortunately, the slim one I bought won’t clear. But, I could build a shroud and offset it to the side to fit no problem.

But, I wanted to see how it performed being near the cooling fan to see if it was even needed at all

[Tippy]

Ok, got a few days of data.

Remember, there is NO cooling fan on the heat exchanger.

The inlet air temps (IAT) have been dead consistently 20F over ambient at fully warm at cruise. All 3 days the same.

Boost is generally another 10F over that to around 13F.

So total is 30-33F over ambient temps (under 1.4 bar boost).

I have lots of datalogs from the air-to-air (good to 1300hp) but I don’t know what ambient temps the days were to do a direct comparo.

I do know I was only seeing 5F to 10F over cruise IAT in each log.

With that said, until I get a fan on this heat exchanger, I’ll hold judgement.

Stay tuned if you care ………………………. or not

[gsmith660]

Good job being analytical about this good data

[quattrorunner]

Does it feel different or same as before with the power delivery?

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by quattrorunner

Does it feel different or same as before with the power delivery?

It’s hard to know by the butt dyno.

If I had to guess, it feels punchier in the midrange (possibly due to supposed lower core restriction and cleaner bends) but may be a little less up top (rated for 600 HP but we know how that can go…..).

Overall, car still feels quick but I don’t have a Dyno sheet or the drag strip to compare.

[quattrorunner]

Your latest data has me relearning (watching YouTube videos) on the subject. I still think it’s a better charge cooler for my situation. I live in a hot climate. And my need to remove the turbo tail.
It does seem odd the overall temp is higher than you saw with air2air. Maybe a system capacity thing? Do you have a tank you’re using? You might need to add more liquid capacity to the system.

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by gsmith660

Good job being analytical about this good data

Thanks

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by quattrorunner

Your latest data has me relearning (watching YouTube videos) on the subject. I still think it’s a better charge cooler for my situation. I live in a hot climate. And my need to remove the turbo tail.
It does seem odd the overall temp is higher than you saw with air2air. Maybe a system capacity thing? Do you have a tank you’re using? You might need to add more liquid capacity to the system.

Yes, 3 things can be improved:

1. Mount heat exchanger in driver fender with an electric fan
2. Keep config now and add the cooling fan
3. Add a reservoir

The system currently only has ~1 gallon with no reservoir.

[gsxrken]

20f over ambient at cruise sounds high and 30f under boost sounds low! I’m sure my TK long neck runs hotter than that - it can be uncomfortable to touch at times after a shut down.
Sorry no hard data

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by gsxrken

20f over ambient at cruise sounds high and 30f under boost sounds low! I’m sure my TK long neck runs hotter than that - it can be uncomfortable to touch at times after a shut down.
Sorry no hard data

4th day. 18-20F over ambient cruise, then 26F over ambient at 1.4 bar doing a longer 3rd gear pull.

The A2A would scalding hot to the touch too after a longer drive and shutdown.

I programmed to pull timing when it gets over I think like 150F and I’ve experienced that plenty. Takes awhile to get it cooled back off.

[quattrorunner]

Originally Posted by Tippy

I programmed to pull timing when it gets over I think like 150F and I’ve experienced that plenty.

You saw that today with the liquid cooler?

[Tippy]

Originally Posted by quattrorunner

You saw that today with the liquid cooler?

No, was referring to the air-to-air getting heat saturated after shutdown.

Car loses a lot of power on a super hot day restart. Takes awhile for the IC to get back to normal.

[quattrorunner]

Got it