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-   -   JET HOT 2000 Coatings? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-930-turbo-super-charging-forum/312774-jet-hot-2000-coatings.html)

WydRyd 11-01-2006 09:29 PM

JET HOT 2000 Coatings?
 
Fellow turbo junkies, what do you guys think about the JET HOT 2000 header coatings?

Is it worth spending the extra cash on this process to reduce engine bay temps?

I presume the actual spool-up improvement would be minimal, but it may be worthwhile just to have a cooler engine bay and reduce heat soak in our intercoolers?

I've heard from certain tuners that it may accelerate cracking in the joints around the header? Is this more prevalent in track cars, or street cars?

I've also been told NOT to coat the inside of the headers, as the coating could potentially flake off and ruin the turbo's turbine?

What do you guys think? Worth the effort or not?

I've got a set of GSF S.S headers (no heater boxes) which I'm intending to use with a Garrett GT35RBB turbo and free flowing Magnaflow single in/out muffler.

Craig 930 RS 11-01-2006 09:38 PM

Why would you *ever* want to contain heat in headers?
To add more heat to an already taxed turbo?

Skip that stuff -

mb911 11-02-2006 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Craig911
Why would you *ever* want to contain heat in headers?
To add more heat to an already taxed turbo?

Skip that stuff -


Because heat drives the turbo charger not pressure like so many think.. Look at allot of tuners the wrap their headers and wastegates to keep as much heat as possible in there. it does result in faster spool ups and is a proven factor in many dyno runs

mb911 11-02-2006 06:45 AM

oh but to answer the question this is very common on Hi porformance applications but there is some risk that it could flake off

Craig 930 RS 11-02-2006 07:29 AM

Heat driving turbos etc - great in theory and partially true in practice - but really......skip it on our cars. The downsides are numerous.

mb911 11-02-2006 08:08 AM

its not theory it is proven. I will search more I did find one picture but not the best..http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1162483730.jpg

mb911 11-02-2006 08:16 AM

here is another not of a porsche but same principlehttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1162484213.jpg

Craig 930 RS 11-02-2006 08:43 AM

Let's hear some success stories form actual turbocharged Porsche 911 chassis cars - with quantifiable results.......Bueler? Anyone?

Zeroclearance 11-02-2006 08:48 AM

Actually if one coats the headers and turbine housing of the turbocharger you will contain the maximum latent energy available. As a result the rotating assy (turbine wheel) will start spinning sooner-hence lag reduction. Typically with good coatings one can see 200 RPM reductions in lag.

As stated before, NEVER coat the inside of the headers or turbine housings. You will destroy your turbo in a short period of time. Please have this instruction in writing. Many times the coating company fails to heed the verbal instructions....

Kevin

Craig 930 RS 11-02-2006 09:01 AM

Cool to see Kevin on this board now. He makes THE turbos for our 930s.

Kevin - What is your take on wraps?
Coatings on stainless headers (such as B&B) ......?

A few local guys have horror stories about the coating stuff flaking off. The wraps also hide the inevitable header cracks -

Wonder if it is worth 200 rpms, Kevin would know.

Zeroclearance 11-02-2006 09:22 AM

Wrap are not good in climates like the Pacific NW where we have rain.. Any condition where water will hit and soak the wrap will cause corrosion. Welds will fail. I have seen my share of turbine housings that have been wrapped, and most of the time I just toss the housings into the scrap bin.. However, for a race prepped only car, wraps have done well. Provided that there is no rain.. All in all, ceramic coatings by a well known company, Swain, JetCoat.. are cheaper and if the headers and turbine housings are prepped good, you have good results..

Results are less than favorable if one uses used parts vs new stainless and high nickle turbine housings.. It also doesn't warrant one coating just the headers, and not the turbine housing.. It is the turbine housing that we want the concentration of heated energy.

Another side note... Wrapping turbine housings do cut the life-span out of the turbine side sealing rings.. The heat tends to prolong the heat soak. It is minimalized if one had water cooled bearing housing, but that out of the picture in our application.. Heat radiating into the turbine shaft and bearings from the insulated wrap is NOT good and can suck out 50% of the life of your turbocharger..

Kevin

Craig 930 RS 11-02-2006 09:26 AM

Excellent. Thanks a ton, Kevin.

mb911 11-02-2006 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Craig911
Excellent. Thanks a ton, Kevin.
You say that like a "told you so" when in reality we were both were answer it correctly just variations.

Don't know what that was all about But The answer was Yes and No flat and simple

Craig 930 RS 11-02-2006 09:35 AM

You have a great internet imagination, mb...

I just appreciate the truth and especially the complete no-bull***** answer from Kevin.

You started with:
"Look at allot of tuners the wrap their headers and wastegates to keep as much heat as possible in there etc"

Kevin simply gave us a well rounded answer, take it for what it is.

mb911 11-02-2006 09:42 AM

No imagination Maybe Just a perception I see from the posts..

I can tell You that the heat energy is what drives the turbo but of course more heat will end its useful life much quicker it still is the driving factor none the less. This is the reason so many want as short of exhaust track as possible to keep the heat in there before it has a chance to dissipate threw the metal. So sometimes these tuners are using wraps etc. I for one am not but the question was can it be done YES it can. Is there potential problems yes just like using aluminum rods in dragsters but benefits.

None the less craig No hard feelings just trying to answer as completly as possible as I do have something to share on the subject.. ;)

Craig 930 RS 11-02-2006 09:46 AM

Right on.
I wanted to clear up misconceptions about "coatings and wrap = good"

When in fact there are varying degees tha Kevin helped us out on.

Peace out!

mb911 11-02-2006 09:47 AM

yup same page !!!!!!!

Jim2 11-02-2006 11:44 AM

I've been around. Never heard this before:

Quote:

NEVER coat the inside of the headers or turbine housings. You will destroy your turbo in a short period of time
Can you elaborate on this Kevin? What damage occurs in a short period of time? (Flaking, eroded turbine tips...?)

Jim

Craig 930 RS 11-02-2006 11:51 AM

This.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1162497099.jpg

Zeroclearance 11-02-2006 11:54 AM

The "coating company" can not etch every nick and cranny inside the header.. Nor can they clean/etch the interior of a turbine housing. You have to have a mechanical bond on every surface. The ceramic coating flakes off and makes contact with the turbine wheel. With a wheel that can turn 140-160K RPM it doesn't take much to incure FOD (foreign object damage) to the turbine blades. The removal of metal from impact will greatly effect the balance of the rotating assy. Accelerated bearing wear will occur.. After this, you get contact between the rotating wheel assy and the housing on both sides of the turbocharger.. And yes, I have seen this happen many times..


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