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So what is better, Royal Purple or Redline?
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Location: Kirkland, WA
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Redline. Objecive tests bear it out - but at $9.99 per quart?
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ - "930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe Movie: 930 on the dyno |
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There was a similar thread on the engine building forum. I believe Charles at LNEngineering has done extensive oil testing and had some interesting results.......
Cheers
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Turn3 Autosport- Full Service and Race Prep jeff@turn3autosport.com 997 S 4.0, Boxster 2.7 Race Car, Cayman S 3.8, 958 Cayenne TT, VW GTI 2.1 TSI, Mini Cooper S JCW, Cannondale Supersix EVO SRAM RED E-tap, Cannondale Slice SRAM RED E-tap, Giant Roam Hardtail- to ride with the wife. |
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Mobil Delvac1. I have read that Porsche ok the use of diesel oils ( not sure about new cars) , correct me if I'm wrong. Email from chemical engineer.
Hi Scott, firstly BB is a topic I prefer not to comment on except to say that how some people survive in business truely amazes me Firstly is Delvac 1 5w-40 better than Mobil 1 (say 5w-50) well, yes it is. (In some applications M1 0w-40 may be a better choice - I use it in my new CLK Benz) The biggest advantage Delvac 1 has is that it has around 25% sophisticated ester content - this is beneficial at high/low temps, for engine cleanliness, for viscosity retention and for protecting oil seal integrity. It also has a very high TBN which protects low use engines from camshaft corrosion and etc due to rising acidity from combustion processes. Its ester content is especially good at minimising journal bearing, valve drive components (lobes/chains/gears/sprockets) and thrust washer wear Delvac 1 5w-40 will do an excellent job in your car. It conforms with the viscosity requirements for your car and exceeds the specifications required by a substantial margin. As well it conforms with Porsche's Approved Oils List (911 D 1701 1) of 29/12/2000 and then later superceded in 2004 with only synthetic oils being Approved The 911 first came out with a "mixed fleet" diesel oil as the factory fill. This continued Porsche's use of diesel oils from the 356 onwards. This was later changed to include multigrade oils but still with dual petrol/diesel ratings. It is still the same today! I have used Delvac 1 5w-40 since 1997 in a wide variety of engine types. In a 911 such an oil has some desirable attributes. It is very robust at high temperatures - great with turbochargers- and it is especially forumlated to resist foaming and losing/gaining viscosity over long periods You may notice a slight drop in oil pressure at idle due to the oils (all synthetics but especially Mobil 1) superior flow characteristics. Flow of course remains the same but better flow charcteristics of the synthetic lubricant tends to reduce pressure. (Pressure is simply the resistance to Flow of course). It should help the engine run cooler than a mineral oil does - if you are using one now What oil do you currently use? NOTE - I do not work for any Oil Company - I did for some years - Caltex-Chevron in Copenhagen, Denmark in the 1960s. I first worked on Porsches then! I am retired!! Regards Doug
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In Heaven… the mechanics are German, the chefs are French, the police are British, the lovers are Italian and everything is organized by the Swiss. In Hell…the mechanics are French, the police are German, the chefs are British, the lovers are Swiss and everything is organized by the Italians. |
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What are thoughts on AMSOIL? I used M1 15/50, but have considered switching to AMSOIL 20/50 synth racing. Thoughts?
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Tim 1986 930 Gone:71,2,4 914's, 70T, 71T(RS),77S |
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I did a fairly long stint in the motorcycle endurance racing world, where nothing but synth oil is used. All of the boutique brands (Redline, Motul, Amsoil, Royal Purple, etc.) were well represented, and a few (even at the F1 500cc 2-cycle level) used Mobile 1. IMO these guys beat the living you-know-what out of oils - some motors were air/oil cooled when I was there (all are water cooled now, but the Suzuki 4-cycles were oil cooled until the mid 90's), running very high temps @ 9,000 - 15,000 RPM for 6 hours. I saw no oil breakdown related failures with any of these - granted formulations may have changed a bit since then, but IMO any of these oils are more than up to the task of use in even very modified 930's.
The important part is to completely heat cycle the car when you use it (moisture is a killer no matter what oil you use so you need to get the WHOLE motor over 212 deg F EVERY time you drive to 'boil' out condensation), and to change oil and filters routinely. If you want good outhouse reading, check out many of the oil filter articles - these are definately not the place to skimp (filter), as many will pass dirt straight thru once an internal pressure is exceeded. Also, as with the motor itself, moisture really screws up paper pleatings in a filter, which in turn could let a lot of shavings and dirt straight into your bearing journals the next time you fire that motor up..... ![]() |
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I found a Mahle (used in a majority of Porsche oil changes):
http://www.frankhunt.com/FRANK/corvette/articles/oilfilterstudy/oilfilterstudy-german.html#oc49
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ - "930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe Movie: 930 on the dyno |
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Quote:
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Me like track days
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Heard of crankcase ventilation?
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ - "930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe Movie: 930 on the dyno |
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Quote:
Look around the forums on www.bobistheoilguy.com this is where i read a lot of that information. Of course if you want to run a genuine PAO class synthetic oil, then these days your limited to online oils such as ams, redline, motul, ect. For the record, there's nothing wrong with group III base oils, however, while they are close in performance to a PAO these days, there viscosity index still isn't as good which is why that 5W-40 you mentioned thinned out to a 5w-30. A 15w40 oil only needs enough additives to become 1.5 times higher in viscosity at operating temperature, where as that 5-40 needs enough to go 8 times so when those additives break down, guess what happens to that 40 weight oil at temperature.......... it goes down. Oh by the way, if you need to know why i picked those three oils mentioned above, go to that bobistheoilguy website and check the motorcylce section and see what the aircooled bikes and atvs run. That stuff even works through there gearbox (for the ones that share motor oil with the trans) and that will generally destroy most automotive oils but these seem to hold up very well.
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Quote:
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Me like track days
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Perhaps this is just common sense, IMO, using *a* synthetic of any brand as well as changing it often will get you 99% of the way towards any hard-researched and $$ spent for a top oils ultimate performance gain.
3 of our 4 cars are turbocharged, and they have all received Ye Olde Mobil 1 and a good filter - often - from Day One.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ - "930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe Movie: 930 on the dyno |
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have many or any of you all seen oil related and or caused failures at all?
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Quote:
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An e-mail reply from Mobil One said they do use PAO stocks.
I think I posted that on the first page? From what I've seen from that oil site - as well as from the friend who is a chem engineer - you are correct about the Delvac and Rotella T - they appear to be a better choice than M1. Apparently M1 is somewhat of a joke anymore amongst the people who are professionals that deal with this type of thing.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ - "930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe Movie: 930 on the dyno |
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They do use PAO, but only a small amount and it's used more as an additive to keep the oil viscous stable.
See here's the problem, and i don't know the specifics so bear with me here, but the story as i understand it goes something like this. Sometime in the 90's castrol came out with an oil claming to be synthetic called syntec that was cheaper than M1 synthetic. Appearantly castrol was buying there oil from shell from there group III base stock. Exxon mobil sued castrol for falsely labeling there product as synthetic (synthetic being man made or Group IV and V, not from petroleum). They lost the case and the court ruled that the term "synthetic" was a marketing term and nothing more. Therefore now here in the US, manufacturers throw around the term synthetic all the time while using group III base oils. As far as what mobil 1 uses now, i could be wrong but i believe they switched to mostly using group III base with a small mix of PAO to compete with the other brands who are marketing synthetics. However they were previously using PAO as there base stock, with a small mix of group III and additives mixed in but i could be wrong.
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Nice. Any other information you have would be appreciated -
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ - "930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe Movie: 930 on the dyno |
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Quote:
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Me like track days
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Yep, that's the site I posted at the middle of the first page of this discussion.
Like pretty much any other internet discussion deal, lots of BS and some true brilliance ![]()
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ - "930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe Movie: 930 on the dyno |
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