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Why wouldn't he just use 21/22/23mm solid fronts then? I'll find out. i'll mention the coilover helpers and get his thoughts on them.. uncensored.
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Old 03-18-2007, 02:07 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #41 (permalink)
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F350Lawman's Avatar
 
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Alright I am sold. The helper springs and beefed up 34 torsion bars in the rear sound like the best bet.

Is the Tarett setup the most economical way to ad helpers to the torsion bar setup?? If not where else should I look?
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1987 930 - K27 7200 / DAS Full Cage / Blownsix Intercooler / BB Headers / Zork Tube / Tial 46mm / Adjustable WUR / RPM Activated Solenoid / Open Element Air Intake / Smart Racing 27mm Sways / 24 and 33mm Torsion Bars / Adj. Spring Plates / Wevo Strut Brace / Monoballs / Tow Hooks / Oil Cooler Scoop / Brey Krauss Harness Truss / Race Seats / XD-16 AFR Guage/ 17" Kodiak Racing Whees and Nitto NT-01 255/315s
Old 03-18-2007, 02:25 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #42 (permalink)
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Craig 930 RS's Avatar
 
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Then you wouldn't have the proper spring rate up front.
---
I'd look to:
porsche@rennsportsystems.com
For a well done coilover shock. You'll get a properly valved shock absorber & spring setup that is done by a guy who knows his sheet.
Why screw around?

I guess I'm sold on the right way to do things - based upon what I use on track. I dunno maybe I don't know nothin'.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 03-18-2007, 02:33 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #43 (permalink)
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This is next up..so let me repose the question
How about he bars from what I see

1. Weltmeister- looks like it will work and is probably more than I will ever need...but quality no where near others $350. Sorry, I am no snoba nd have abudget, and I am sure they work..but they look like curtain rods with the color and hollow unsealed ends

2. Tarett Engineering- looks great price not bad @ $475 ea. Best bang for buck??

3. Elephant Racing looks like the Tarett bar but @ $525 ea. it is $100 more???

4. TRG- looks like a step up from Tarett/Elephant..but how much $$$??? and how much better???

5. Smart Racing- Damn they are pretty!! They look like art and look like they would work FOREVER. AT $525 rear and $675 front they are pricey?? Are they worth it, at $250 more than Tarett??

Any real world thoughts or experiences?? Right now the Smart Racings are calling me. MUST RESIST>>MUST RESIST>>URGE TO BUY>>>URGE TO BUY
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1987 930 - K27 7200 / DAS Full Cage / Blownsix Intercooler / BB Headers / Zork Tube / Tial 46mm / Adjustable WUR / RPM Activated Solenoid / Open Element Air Intake / Smart Racing 27mm Sways / 24 and 33mm Torsion Bars / Adj. Spring Plates / Wevo Strut Brace / Monoballs / Tow Hooks / Oil Cooler Scoop / Brey Krauss Harness Truss / Race Seats / XD-16 AFR Guage/ 17" Kodiak Racing Whees and Nitto NT-01 255/315s
Old 03-18-2007, 03:06 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #44 (permalink)
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Quote:

I guess I'm sold on the right way to do things - based upon what I use on track. I dunno maybe I don't know nothin'.
I wouldn't say that but I think I will go with someone that built/builds and supports 100's of very successful race and track cars. He built my SC G stock and I love it.

Be me, I don't know nothin'.
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Old 03-18-2007, 04:03 PM
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I'd buy the Smart Racing bars - I think they are the best available.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 03-18-2007, 05:41 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #46 (permalink)
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When you say Smart Racing, do you mean the Sanders hollow bars ?
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 03-19-2007, 01:02 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #47 (permalink)
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Smart Racing Products anti-roll (sway) bars
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Old 03-20-2007, 06:52 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #48 (permalink)
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If the bars are not plated, it might be a good idea to coat them in a marine grease.
The rust that forms without it isn't a protective rust.

(I coated my bars in 2000, they still rusted.)
I'd get them plated and end plugged = Elephant bars.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno

Last edited by Craig 930 RS; 03-20-2007 at 08:18 AM..
Old 03-20-2007, 07:34 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #49 (permalink)
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I thought we were talking about torsion bars, not sways.
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 03-20-2007, 02:49 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #50 (permalink)
Me like track days
 
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I am.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 03-20-2007, 02:52 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #51 (permalink)
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Thanks Craig, thought maybe I had drank too much Whiskey

I ask you again... When you say Smart Racing Torsion bars are the best, do you mean the Sanders hollow bars ? or do Smart Racing have their own product that is different ?

TIA
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 03-20-2007, 03:01 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #52 (permalink)
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Smart Racing sells Sanders hollow bars..
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Old 03-20-2007, 03:27 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #53 (permalink)
Me like track days
 
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What I said above :
"I'd buy the Smart Racing bars - I think they are the best available."
Sway bars - the Smart Racing sways.

Then we switched topic to torsions, where I mentioned the marine grease coating.
The Elephant torsion bars are plated and plugged - keeps the rust away.

Following the bouncing topic ball....(it isn't easy)
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 03-20-2007, 03:57 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #54 (permalink)
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Well I haven't posted in a few day because my mechanic (Rik from CIM in Central Valley)is on vacation. I only ordered the non-suspension parts.. Blownsix IC, AFR gauge/sender and RPM solenoid from Brian. The suspension stuff I am going to go over with my mechanic.

He knows his stuff and I figure we'll talk it over and then figure out what to order and if his supplier's prices are better than the prices I've researched. I am going to print out everything I have envisioned adding to the car and compare it to what my mechanic has planned. After we share opinions, I hope to have everything oreered by the end of the week
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1987 930 - K27 7200 / DAS Full Cage / Blownsix Intercooler / BB Headers / Zork Tube / Tial 46mm / Adjustable WUR / RPM Activated Solenoid / Open Element Air Intake / Smart Racing 27mm Sways / 24 and 33mm Torsion Bars / Adj. Spring Plates / Wevo Strut Brace / Monoballs / Tow Hooks / Oil Cooler Scoop / Brey Krauss Harness Truss / Race Seats / XD-16 AFR Guage/ 17" Kodiak Racing Whees and Nitto NT-01 255/315s
Old 03-25-2007, 05:01 PM
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I stand corrected, my 33mm Elephant Racing bars ARE hollow and have rubber plugs in them.. not sure why I have a mix of ER and Sanders but they are both hollow, thats for sure..
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Old 03-25-2007, 05:06 PM
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Question Source for T Bars

I am having trouble sourcing the 33mm hollow rear bars for my 87 930. Elephant and Smart Racing are on back order. Everyone has the 24mm fronts but not the 33mm for the rear.

Anyone have another source?????

Thanks
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1987 930 - K27 7200 / DAS Full Cage / Blownsix Intercooler / BB Headers / Zork Tube / Tial 46mm / Adjustable WUR / RPM Activated Solenoid / Open Element Air Intake / Smart Racing 27mm Sways / 24 and 33mm Torsion Bars / Adj. Spring Plates / Wevo Strut Brace / Monoballs / Tow Hooks / Oil Cooler Scoop / Brey Krauss Harness Truss / Race Seats / XD-16 AFR Guage/ 17" Kodiak Racing Whees and Nitto NT-01 255/315s
Old 04-05-2007, 10:15 AM
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F350, not to change the subject, but did you get your blown six inter cooler? If so, how do you like it? It seems to be of high quality.
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Old 04-05-2007, 12:22 PM
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F350Lawman, as I understand it your main focus (in terms of $$) is handling. IIRC you are sticking with the stock Fuchs 16's. Have you considered wider wheels and tires?

Also, several folks have suggested raised front spindles. If you lower the car significantly you should consider this route (with a bump steer kit like ERP) to keep the front geometry from getting too far out of whack.

Doing the suspension right will be damn close to your whole budget so it might be wise to stay out of the engine for the time being. The problem with half measures is that it's pretty labor intensive to go back later and do it right. You'll know what I mean when you see the bill for the lower/align/corner balance if you get it done right.

Here's what I have on my 911 RSR Look (turbo flares):

1. 23F, 29R bars (obviously this would be different for a Turbo)
2. Bilsteins custom-valved to match the bars, raised front spindles
3. ERP bump-steer kit
4. Elephant front camber plate/monoballs and strut brace
5. rear monoballs
6. Elephant bushings front and rear
7. Sway-a-way adjustable spring plates
8. Smart Racing sway bars F/R with Wevo rear mounts.
9. Lindsey Racing 9x17 F, 11x17R wheels, 255F and 275R Toyo RA1's

I love the Smart Racing sway bars for their extreme quality and ajustablility, but if I were to skimp on one thing it would be sway bars, because you can upgrade them later without disturbing the alignment and corner balance, assuming they are properly ajusted for zero preload.
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Old 04-05-2007, 10:43 PM
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F350, not to change the subject, but did you get your blown six inter cooler? If so, how do you like it? It seems to be of high quality

Problems at Customs at the U.S./Canadian border seems to have delayed delivery, it now should be here on Monday. If so, I will put it on myself (provided it is plug and play) and post my thoughts.

F350Lawman, as I understand it your main focus (in terms of $$) is handling. IIRC you are sticking with the stock Fuchs 16's. Have you considered wider wheels and tires?

Also, several folks have suggested raised front spindles. If you lower the car significantly you should consider this route (with a bump steer kit like ERP) to keep the front geometry from getting too far out of whack.

Doing the suspension right will be damn close to your whole budget so it might be wise to stay out of the engine for the time being. The problem with half measures is that it's pretty labor intensive to go back later and do it right. You'll know what I mean when you see the bill for the lower/align/corner balance if you get it done right.

Here's what I have on my 911 RSR Look (turbo flares):

1. 23F, 29R bars (obviously this would be different for a Turbo)
2. Bilsteins custom-valved to match the bars, raised front spindles
3. ERP bump-steer kit
4. Elephant front camber plate/monoballs and strut brace
5. rear monoballs
6. Elephant bushings front and rear
7. Sway-a-way adjustable spring plates
8. Smart Racing sway bars F/R with Wevo rear mounts.
9. Lindsey Racing 9x17 F, 11x17R wheels, 255F and 275R Toyo RA1's


I love the Smart Racing sway bars for their extreme quality and ajustablility, but if I were to skimp on one thing it would be sway bars, because you can upgrade them later without disturbing the alignment and corner balance, assuming they are properly ajusted for zero preload.


Tires are brand new so the will stay for now, and when they go, I will move up to 17s or 18s and new rubber.

I went with most things as planned, I have on order or already have.

1. Smart racing adj. sways (27mm front and rear)
2. Sanders hollow torsion bars from ERP (24mm front, 33mm rear)
3. Bilsteins all around to match the new bars
4. Rear monoballs
5. new urethane bushings throughout (he swears by a brand he gets and says when he fits them and puts the correct "stuff" he said it's not grease...they work great and stay that way. He has them in his C4 so that tells me he believes in them)
6. Wevo Camberking w/ carbon fiber bar (mechanic thought it was cost affective and a good performer rather than ordering the monoball, plate and bar seperately)
7. Sway-Away adj spring plates ( my mechanic sugested these so I added them to my list)
8. New reinforced mounts for the rear sway bar
9. Bump steer
10. Ball joints
11.Blownsix 1/2 bay cooler
12. XD-14 and LC1 AFR gauge and probe
12. Brian Leask RPM activated Solenoid
14. New Weltmeister tow hooks front and rear (one of mine was bent by PO and besides those red ones look cool )
15. And of course... corner balance and allignment


The only thing I didn't get was the rear slip over helper coil setup. My mechanic felt it wasn't needed and said we could add them easy enough if I really wanted them later. I trust him and we agreed on everything else, so deferred on this. We will see.

The T-bars are on back order so work should start in 3-weeks when they come in.
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1987 930 - K27 7200 / DAS Full Cage / Blownsix Intercooler / BB Headers / Zork Tube / Tial 46mm / Adjustable WUR / RPM Activated Solenoid / Open Element Air Intake / Smart Racing 27mm Sways / 24 and 33mm Torsion Bars / Adj. Spring Plates / Wevo Strut Brace / Monoballs / Tow Hooks / Oil Cooler Scoop / Brey Krauss Harness Truss / Race Seats / XD-16 AFR Guage/ 17" Kodiak Racing Whees and Nitto NT-01 255/315s

Last edited by F350Lawman; 04-06-2007 at 01:49 PM..
Old 04-06-2007, 01:43 PM
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