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wcc wcc is offline
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Full Throttle & Stumble on Shut Down

Just finished up a Valve adj with Wayne (Oh Haha) and removed the emissions stuff. Capping off and plugging what was left.

It starts right up but now it idles high, so we adjusted the idle adjustment screw.

But I still have a few burning questions cause it still isn't just quite right. I know, I know I'm picky!

So my issues now are:
1)It feels like the gas pedal isn't adjusted correctly cause it feels like there is a very short dead spot right at the top. In other words I have to push the pedal down just a touch before the engine registers anything.
First off where would I make the adjustment? At the trans, at that connector above the trans mount, or at the engine?
Secondly, how or where do I look to make sure the car is at full throttle?

2)Now when I shut down the engine it doesn't shut right down. It stumbles down. It takes a few revolutions before it actually stops. What would cause this? Timing off?

Lastly, just out of curiousity, would taking off the emissions stuff cause some of these problems? I wouldn't think so, but that's all that has changed and I wasn't having any of these problems before.
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Old 03-26-2007, 04:06 PM
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wcc wcc is offline
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Ok, I have the gas pedal all set now. WOW! What a difference! I set the idle then adjusted the linkage so now there isn't any dead spots.

But it still stumbles on shut down. Any ideas what may cause this?

Also, is there a good trouble shooting book I can pick up that shows possible solutions for problems for the 930? Something like the Bentley for a Carrera. Is there such a thing for a 930?
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Old 03-27-2007, 03:40 PM
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bro i got the same problems with mine . im gonna rebush my pedal cluster for the throttle deal because its hanging up on the swollen bushings (along with the clutch pedal hanging up)new cable as well. mine car would diesel on shut off as well ,after i adjusted the timing ,every1 said this was normal because the car will continue to burn the unburned fuel in the cyls. if you get something different let me know. how did you get the play out of the throttle?
pete
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Old 03-27-2007, 04:28 PM
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Hey Pete, thanks for the info! I wondered if it was normal. That's good news. Maybe I won't mess with it then. Cause it does shut down quick enough, but not like all my other computer controlled cars.

What I did to fix the linkage was to replace the accelerater cushion. Here's a couple of threads on that:
Throttle Cable Snapped....on my '68 911L....i think

http://www.pelicanparts.com/cgi-bin/ksearch/PEL_search.cgi?command=show_part_page&please_wait=N&make=POR&model=911M&section=Pcable&page=4&bookmark=10&part_number=911-423-081-02-M260

Next I unhooked the ball/socket connection at the transmission. Then I started the car (it was already at operating temp) and adjusted the idle speed to just under 1000 RPM.

Then, with the car still running I pulled on the part by the trans until the engine started to accel. So I adjusted the socket part to match this point. So now it's very easy to blip the throttle instead of pushing it down without anything happening.

Good Luck with your cluster rebuild.
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Old 03-27-2007, 04:51 PM
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bill
did you check your timing at idle and at higher rpm also? i think the spec for the idle is at 950.thanks for the info
pete
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1980 930 Turbo
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Old 03-27-2007, 05:01 PM
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Yup sure did...

Right from the book.....

900+50
and 1000+/-50 for USA and Japan models.

I'm guessing I'm about 975. So I'm WELL within spec.
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Old 03-27-2007, 06:37 PM
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You also need to check timing at the high RPM setting too.
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 03-31-2007, 12:45 AM
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Bill, I'm thinking that the delayed shut off that you are speaking of is somewhat normal. Although when I converted my old motor to an Msd Cd box, it seemed to have kicked the problem, along with saving me $1,500 from not buying another Porsche CD box. If you still want to check wide open throttle, the best way I could think of is to pull the inter-cooler and have someone mash the gas while you check it. I had the same problem with the gas pedal as well, I think I ended up catching the throttle rod that goes from trans. to motor on the driver's side axle when pulling the motor and think that I tweaked it. So it threw off the linkage adjustment.
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Last edited by 930gt-40r; 03-31-2007 at 04:53 AM..
Old 03-31-2007, 04:51 AM
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Thanks for the replys guys. Last night I set the timing at low and high RPM. I had an old timing light so I bought a new inductive advance timing light which made it WAY easier to set the timing. Anyways, it turns out that the timing was off by about 6 deg. So I set it at idle 10+/-2deg (with vac hose connected) and at 4000RPM at 26+/-4deg (with vac hose disconnected). Then I had to adjust the idle speed back up cause it slowed down too much, then I double checked the timing. It shuts down a lot better now.

I did this about 4-5 times yesterday and night. With the O2 sensor hooked up I would experience a slight but noticeable surging at cruising speed. When I disconnect the O2 sensor it's smoooooth. So I left the O2 unhooked and made sure the timing is correct. Now I just want to make sure my AFR is correct. Is there a way I can check this without an LM1? I still have the OEM exhaust, with the CAT, hooked up.
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Old 03-31-2007, 07:29 AM
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You can tune out the shut down issues. A change in timing will allow the turbo to spin longer after shutdown and end in a subtle "pop". You will know your timing is right when that quirk goes away.

The idle A/F ratio can be checked and adjusted using a Gunson Gas Tester that calculates CO%. They go for $100 used typically and are very easy to use with a little patience.
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Old 03-31-2007, 07:54 AM
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Are you sure you can use one of those sophisticated timing lights on our cars. I have a hunch that you cannot (by that I mean it is inaccurate using the facility on it).
I hope someone can comment that knows. I am sure I read it somewhere.
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 03-31-2007, 08:18 AM
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RarlyL8 - I'll keep my eye open for one. Ebay had this that I thought would work.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&viewitem=&ru=http%3A%2F%2Fsearch.ebay.com%3A80%2Fsearch%2Fse arch.dll%3Ffrom%3DR40%26satitle%3D150107795484%2B% 2B%26fvi%3D1&item=150107795484

Otherwise both Eastwood and northertool carry them for $200.

Also, I didn't notice any subtle pop at shut down. But now I'm curious so I'll check that out sometime today.

NathanUK - I don't know why you couldn't use one. I mean if you don't want to advance it in then you can just leave it set to zero. But with the advance it really helps to actually know what deg it is set at.
If anyone really knows yes or no please set us straight....
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Old 03-31-2007, 09:20 AM
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i used the inductive timing light on my car worked no problem. they are nice if they have the increase or decrease on the gun for the higher timing setting
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Old 03-31-2007, 10:39 AM
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AFR question now...

I ordered up that Gunson Gastester, and I'm wondering about the CO%. The book says unhook the O2 and set it at .6+/-.2 then hook up the O2 again. But my plan is leaving the O2 disconnected so do I still want to adjust my CO to the .6 or something else?
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Old 04-03-2007, 08:45 AM
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If you don't have a cat then 3% is nice and healthy for your engine with the 02 disconnected.
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 04-03-2007, 02:07 PM
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Unfortunatley, I do have a CAT. I know, I know, it's on my 'to do' list.

So with having a CAT and No O2 sensor is .6 still the way to go?
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Old 04-03-2007, 02:19 PM
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I have no idea, sorry. I hope someone can answer that knows.

I know that running rich will kill the cat.
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 04-03-2007, 02:31 PM
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NathanUK - Thanks anyways. I did write your 3% number down though so when I actually get around to removing it I'll know where to set it.

Ok, well according to the book it's .6+/-.2 %CO, but then they say to hook the O2 back up. Will that somehow alter the mix or will it maintain what was set? I guess that's a little more direct question.
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Old 04-03-2007, 02:36 PM
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I don't know, my car is a euro ROW ZZZ car so I don't know much (anything) about emission equipped cars. Sorry.
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 04-03-2007, 02:57 PM
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OK, according to my factory manual. If your engine is a 930/68 the air pump has to be disconnected, measured in front of the cat & sensor disconnected then you are correct with 0.6 +-.02 CO%
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 04-03-2007, 03:05 PM
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