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Safe Turbo Upgrade?

I've searched and came up with a lot of different info. I have a 86 930 with just a GHL exhaust (muffler) on it and I'm thinking of upgrading the stock turbo. Which way do I go? I'm not looking to get crazy here. If all possible I would like to just change the turbo and not have to modify anything to install it.
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16 VW Touareg
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84 VW Rabbit GTI
Old 06-12-2007, 04:38 PM
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Crotchety Old Bastard
 
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I honestly don't think there is a "stock replacement" turbo on the market. The K27 family are advertised as "stock replacement" but let me tell you they are not. The alignment is wrong and the bracket will no longer fit without modification.

Lots of folks will chime in with there favorite turbo. All require some tweeking to install. Up side is it is well worth the effort.
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RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 06-12-2007, 05:01 PM
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Chime!

Perhaps a K27 7200 Hyflow Turbocharger from:
http://www.ultimatemotorwerks.com/products.html#930

Run it at stock boost, no track use and I suspect you will be fine.
Just check that all fuel and ignition everything is working correctly -

A HUGE improvement over stock - but Brian is correct, tinkering with the mounting will be required.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 06-12-2007, 06:33 PM
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+1 for the K27-7200-S or K27-HFS for a more "drop in" replacement compared to the Garrett or Turbonetics alternatives.
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Old 06-12-2007, 09:18 PM
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Crotchety Old Bastard
 
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I received a few e-mails asking me to explain why the K27 isn't a drop in.

My verbiage may have been a little strong. They may not simply "bolt on" but at the same time the mods needed to make them fit correctly are not that big of a deal.

The point I would like to make is that you should not expect to simply un-bolt your existing 3DLZ and bolt-up a K27 in an hours time. The alignment of the turbo outlet to the intercooler up-pipe is a little off requiring an adapter or you can cut the up-pipe and add a silicon hose. The turbo bracket will need the holes elongated or cut and re-welded.
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RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 06-13-2007, 05:09 AM
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I will have the machined K-27 outlet adapter (~$100 new) available in a few days if needed. I'm swapping to a longneck intercooler and won't need the adapter anymore.

Pat K
87 930
Old 06-13-2007, 06:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig 930 RS View Post
Chime!

Perhaps a K27 7200 Hyflow Turbocharger from:
http://www.ultimatemotorwerks.com/products.html#930

Run it at stock boost, no track use and I suspect you will be fine.
Just check that all fuel and ignition everything is working correctly -

A HUGE improvement over stock - but Brian is correct, tinkering with the mounting will be required.

Whats advantage of this turbo against the stock yurbo on a 1986 930, does any one have performance curves?

Kjell
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:08 PM
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Earlier boost, much better response -
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 11-09-2007, 01:15 PM
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I just got done installing a k-27S with GSF headers on my 79 930. Used to have the stock 3LDZ and US exhaust.
Night and day difference. The boost comes in very early and is more linear. I am making boost around 2200-2400rpm (meaning coming towards the positive side of the bosst gage) and the boost is all in alot faster.
It has transformed the car. Now it is alot easier to modulate, but the kick of the old turbo at high revs is more subdued.....the only downside, as I used to like that feeling though it is not as powerful as the new set-up.
It was not an easy drop in install.
I had posted a long description of what I went thru if you search the forum. I do not think Rarlyl8 wording was too strong.......you should be aware of whats involved because the sellers of these kits will not tell you.
Worht the trouble definitely.
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:16 PM
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Hello

I found this on e-bay:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/New-K27-7200-Turbo-for-930-or-965-replace-your-KKK-3LDZ_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ33742QQihZ015QQite mZ250185686652QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW




Is this the same turbo? any good?

Kjell R
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Old 11-09-2007, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thechiller View Post
Hello

Is this the same turbo? any good?

Kjell R
That's Kevin (who also posts on this board). He manufactures the hybrid turbos that Imagine Auto sell.

That is, however, a K27-7200, as fitted stock to a 965. Still an upgrade from a 3DLZ, but not the best you can possibly do with a K27.

The K27-7200, K27-7006, K27/S, K27/HF (no longer made), K27/HFS & K27/HF2 are all different turbos, with different characteristics.

See: http://www.imagineauto.com/turbos.htm
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Old 11-09-2007, 02:20 PM
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Whats advantage of this turbo against the stock yurbo on a 1986 930, does any one have performance curves?

Kjell
I've never seen compressor maps for the K27 family, although they exist for the GT series.

Here's a mild 1978 RoW 930, 8:1, SC cams, stock headers, stock wastegate/spring, stock 3DLZ, stock airbox & filter, stock intercooler, open pipe.



Here's the same motor after the spun rod bearing. 8:1, SC cams, GHL headers, stock wastegate/spring, K27/HF, EVO Motorsports intake, Kokeln intercooler, factory muffler.



It makes .5 bar @ 2500 RPM on the rollers. Both setups with open wastegate dump pipes.

Note that the K27/HF setup makes more power at the rear wheels than the factory 3DLZ setup did at the crank. And comparing the power curves should clarify a few things, too..

Like kellcats says, you'd put money on the factory setup being more powerful, because it just feels insanely brutal. But the more modern setup is much, much faster - and progressive, civilized, predictable and controllable. You have to pay attention, because you could be going much faster than you realise.
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'77 S with '78 930 power and a few other things.

Last edited by spuggy; 11-09-2007 at 02:44 PM..
Old 11-09-2007, 02:38 PM
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Spuggy

Are you using CIS on your car?

Kjell R
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Old 11-09-2007, 10:56 PM
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Quote:
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Are you using CIS on your car?

Kjell R
Yessir. Brian Leaske adjustable WUR fitted during the rebuild, otherwise stock 1978 RoW CIS.

Had the RPM solenoid fitted and ready to go (not plumbed), but there was no need to use it.
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'77 S with '78 930 power and a few other things.
Old 11-10-2007, 12:44 AM
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turbo upgrade

I too put a K27-7200 in my 79' 930 and it isn't just a "drop in" mod. The adapter to the intercooler hits the air intake tube so I had to heat the tube and slightly bend it. The sheet metal needs to be trimmed and the oil sump line needs to have two different threads connector (one to the sump and one to the hard line that goes to the pump). I also put a MSD, put Clewett's ignition wires, put a 1.0 bar string, and GHL exhaust while I was there. Runs great now and lots of boost and worth the time.
Old 11-10-2007, 09:17 AM
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