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A fellow Pelacanite
 
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The switch in the left hand timing chain cover triggers the cold start injector. This sprays extra fuel when trying to start the car when the weather is cold.
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

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Old 10-28-2007, 11:14 AM
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Thanks guys, slowly pieces falling into place. I seem to have a serious lack of wires to accomodate these bits. Without pulling the engine apart, they do not seem to be there.
Anyone know anything about throttle position sensor. I have two SC's of same era - 82-83, neither has a TPS. I cannot find any indication of it in wiring diagrams.
The engine No on the 930 is a 68H series - which I take to be US spec.
Is the TPS a pecularity of the US spec, or the 930. I just have the throttle body plug.
Trying to figure why it idles so fast - must be getting too much air or fuel or both.
Thx
Alan
Old 10-28-2007, 12:18 PM
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My euro car has no 02 sensor or tps.

That thermo switch you found with the hoses linked has something to do with the timing. You were correctly told that this is meant to be connected to your dizzy, the other end connect to the throttle body somehwere.
I wonder if this is causing your problem due to ignition timing.
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 10-28-2007, 12:53 PM
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My distributor only has one vac tak off as far as I can see. From other pics, it appears the second take off would be on the back of the vacuum box.
If so, then I can only assume this is not the original distributor either.
It also appears to be wound hard out on advance. About to check timing working off the specs for a US 68 type motor.
This is looking like a mission.
I do have a blanked- off fitting in the exhuast system near the turbo. I wonder if this was an oxygen sensor originally. Were they linked to the TPS?
Did cars of this era come out with them - I thought this system belonged to '84 onwards type engines?
Very confusing.
Alan
Old 10-28-2007, 02:24 PM
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Aux Air valve

Well the fast idle is solved - and possibly the reason for the original melt down in the engine.
The AAV was not working and rested in a half open position.
A combination of bent finger and detached thermo wire internally.
In exchange for all the info you guys have provided, for what it is worth, if useful, you can fix these beasts, and the WUR. This is the second AAV I have had apart now.
Just drill the 4 pins out - drill the heads off, and push the pins out.
Then you can do what is required, in my case I straightened the bimetallic finger - you can set the opening slot to where you want, and soldered one of the heating wires back on its terminal. (Only ponder whether solder is good enough. If it comes off again, the car will lean out again).
It is a different car and idles properly now.
Still working on my lack of wiring and surplus of sensors.
The probe blanked off in the exhaust it transpires was a temp probe - connected to a light on the dash - required for Japanese models apparently. Altho I am sure this car was not Japan new. Also disconnected/removed.
Regards
Alan
Old 10-28-2007, 09:55 PM
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fuel pump query

Have found more suspect wiring relating to the fuel pumps.
Both my pumps are on when I turn the key to ON. I suspect this is not right and the second pump should only kick in under load? The first pump should only kick in on starter motor?
If this is so, what is second pump driven off for sensing - the original tacho boost switch?
Any ideas.
Mine seem to be hot wired thru the heater relay in the engine bay.
This car is a real challenge.
Thx
Alan
Old 10-29-2007, 10:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan L View Post
Have found more suspect wiring relating to the fuel pumps.
Both my pumps are on when I turn the key to ON. I suspect this is not right and the second pump should only kick in under load? The first pump should only kick in on starter motor?
If this is so, what is second pump driven off for sensing - the original tacho boost switch?
Any ideas.
Mine seem to be hot wired thru the heater relay in the engine bay.
This car is a real challenge.
Thx
Alan
Nope. Both are online all the time, regardless of boost. Car will sometimes run with only one but it will go lean.
'
Both pumps are cut if boost switch goes open.
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Old 10-30-2007, 07:39 AM
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If you pull the switch connection loose at the top of the injection housing (where the paddle and fuel distributor lives) then the pumps will run when the ignition is on. This switch turns them off if the engine stalls, but the key is on. This keeps the pumps from running after an accident. Normally, the pumps come on with the ignition key gets to the "start" position and the air passing the paddle after start trips this switch to keep the pumps on. I have pulled the plug off when the yellow overboost relay was acting up and the car wasn't starting due to no fuel pumps. When that connection is open, you get pumps with ignition all the time.
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Old 10-30-2007, 08:15 AM
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Thanks guys - at least I know where to look for the suspect wiring - something has been altered. The heater relay in the engine compartment has been looped with a piece of wire. When I pull this wire I get no fuel pumps.
It looked from wiring diagram that the second pump was looped into some type of sensor switch.
"If you pull the switch connection loose at the top of the injection housing (where the paddle and fuel distributor lives)"

I shall have to look for this one - I don't think it is there.

But I did pull the cable off my overboost switch (which is working at about 1 bar). It did not cut the pumps. According to my reckoning - if working right , it should?

They seem to be hot wired.
More hunting for dodgy bits.
Thx
Alan
Old 10-30-2007, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan L View Post
My distributor only has one vac tak off as far as I can see. From other pics, it appears the second take off would be on the back of the vacuum box.
If so, then I can only assume this is not the original distributor either.
We had a thread about this recently. Basically, all the 3.3 distributors had an extra nipple for boost retard, except the 78-79 non-CA versions.

All the distributor types have a vacuum advance. I'd be inclined to check the part #'s on the distributor - US and RoW dizzies had different part #'s, probably different advance springs (this is a guess).

Quote:
Were they linked to the TPS?
No TPS I'm aware of. That said, my car has little plug connectors emerging from the harness at various points in the engine bay with nothing there for them to plug into...
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Old 10-30-2007, 11:15 AM
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No TPS I'm aware of. That said, my car has little plug connectors emerging from the harness at various points in the engine bay with nothing there for them to plug into...[/QUOTE]

I've got the sensors (with no plugs) if you've got the plugs. Maybe you have accidently ended up with my wiring harness.

I will check my dizzy further. Maybe they have had to put a single nipple one in with the removal of the control valves.

Thx
Alan
Old 10-30-2007, 11:38 AM
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[QUOTE=spuggy;3560458]We had a thread about this recently. Basically, all the 3.3 distributors had an extra nipple for boost retard, except the 78-79 non-CA versions.

It is definitely a single nipple dizzy. So, if I post the engine No, is it possible to tell if it is one of the 78-79 CA engines, or a later engine with another dizzy?
The car (Chassis) is an '82. Engine No 68H 01352.
Alan
Old 10-30-2007, 11:52 AM
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[QUOTE=Alan L;3560534]
Quote:
Originally Posted by spuggy View Post
We had a thread about this recently. Basically, all the 3.3 distributors had an extra nipple for boost retard, except the 78-79 non-CA versions.

It is definitely a single nipple dizzy. So, if I post the engine No, is it possible to tell if it is one of the 78-79 CA engines, or a later engine with another dizzy?
The car (Chassis) is an '82. Engine No 68H 01352.
Alan
You should probably check the part # on the distributor, I suspect the single and dual nipple vacuum cans will interchange... Uhhm, you can buy the twin-nipple vacuum can from Pelican for $120 US or thereabouts. I know Steve Weiner has a distributor machine...

Pretty sure it's not a 78-79 engine number, because Porsche used numbers for year codes 78-81. However, Porsche standardised the VINs (to SAE J272, J218, J1044 and J1229), using letter codes for years, starting with 'B' for 81, 'C' for '82 etc. (they skip 'I' and 'O').

Looks like they went to letter codes in the engine number as well.

Which would make that year code an '87, by my reckoning, and my guess would be it's a USA 930/68 motor, (in which case you might well have some junk from a Lamba system kicking about) because the type digit '8' (second position) would indicate a USA/California type for a 78-79 motor ('7' would be RoW/Japan for 78-80, or RoW/Canada for '81).

Assuming they kept the same convention for the years my booklets don't cover. You should check to be sure.

What's your chassis number? Are 'ZZZ' the 4, 5, 6 digits? This would indicate a RoW (everything except USA/Canada) VIN. Other digits here would designate body type/destination for USA/Canada cars.

Go to http://yarchive.net/car/vin.html and scroll to the end of the page.
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Old 10-30-2007, 02:29 PM
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Hmm, thanks. I thought after 7 yrs of owning 911's I knew something about them, but 930's are a different world.I am sure the car was imported into Japan 2 nd hand. But do not know from where.

The chassis No is zzz (RoW) 93ZCS000328. So I can assume the wiring harness is an '82 RoW. (this might xplain why I seem to have a surplus of sensors/wiring terminals). If the engine is a US '87, then that might explain the TPS - and nowhere to hook it in to. In which case I have been chasing the wrong engine wiring diagram - because I have not found a TPS in the diagrams.
This does not explain the single nipple vac box tho - if I have read the earlier thread on this right. All cars changed to 2 nipple boxes after early 80's? Is it possible the vac box has been changed to single?
If I posted the distributor part No would that help?
Thx
Alan
Old 10-30-2007, 03:52 PM
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pressurizing system

Quote:
Originally Posted by beepbeep View Post
Hello!

Much better way of checking overboost switch functionality is by doing it in-car. We do it often in the shop in dealership I work for. We have a big cylinder with a nipple that we connect to some rubber hose near the intake (on other side of rubber hose going to turbo-intake for example). Then we pressurize the whole intake to 0.8 bar (or what the typical boost is for the car).

.
How do you pressurise the whole system - I tried that via the boost control hose off the intercooler. I could not get any pressure - my gas was venting as fast as I put it in. My guess is I am loosing it via the CIS air plate? You must need to block this off? But with what - it is pretty large, and needs to hold 1 bar boost.
Alan
Old 11-01-2007, 07:02 PM
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I haven't read this entire thread but I saw where you have a single pot distributor.
That is likely an early Euro unit and has a more agressive curve. I use one in my 930/63 CA engine. You simply block off the hoses no longer needed.
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Old 11-01-2007, 08:31 PM
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[QUOTE=RarlyL8;3565017]I haven't read this entire thread but I saw where you have a single pot distributor.
That is likely an early Euro unit and has a more agressive curve. I use one in my 930/63 CA engine. [QUOTE]
Thanks - that sounds like an aftermarket performance addition then? On a type 68 engine.
This would fit with many other aspects -
defunct overboost switch, EBC, headers etc.
In which case , what timing specs? I have timed it to 26 deg adv at 4000 rpm, no vac. It was more advanced than that when I got it.
Alan
Old 11-01-2007, 10:32 PM
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oil breather system

I have posted a pic of my breather system - which is obviously not exactly standard. I am assuming the after market bit of hose would normally have plumbed in to the air box?
In which case, not having one, I suspect I should really have a catch tank for this bit.
But just to the left of the filler tube is a blanked off hole to the oil tank. On my SC this line would come from the crankcase breather. The 930 seems to have an additional piece of apparatus (left of filler cap) , and is different.
Should I have something going in to this blanked piece.
If I plumbed my loose line into here would i just risk pressurising the oil tank?
Alan
Old 11-13-2007, 12:32 PM
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wastegate

I have tried testing my wastegate - the best I know how. I suspect something is wrong. I put gas pressure thru the pipe in the middle of pic - ie the one on the lower body of the housing, near the exhaust tube. Gas came out the other small tube in the center upper boby. I blocked that off with my finger. Pressure rose but as it did, gas came out the exhaust tube. I continued to pressurise to 1.5 bar expecting the valve to open, or something. But nothing happened. Should it open? (I suspect so).
Does this mean a broken diaphragm or something?
What are the consequences for the engine, running it like this?
Alan
Old 11-14-2007, 09:06 PM
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That WG has blown diaphragm, dissassemble and replace it. Car will overboost otherwise.

Some air will always go past the valve stem and into exhaust tube, no problem. But no gas should go between top vent and the bottom vent. There is a membrane in-between, probably ruptured.

Be careful when dissassembling, there is substantial spring-force involved. Use vice or something else to prevent the bell flying once last bolt has been undone.
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Last edited by beepbeep; 11-15-2007 at 03:11 AM..
Old 11-14-2007, 11:38 PM
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