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The cylinderss kit, cam shafts, cylinders heads and gasket kit is ordered. I'll get it on Tuesday. YES

Now i need an EFI kit with ignition control.

I also need the muffler

Kjell
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Old 10-10-2008, 10:57 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #61 (permalink)
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Megasquirt?
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg
Old 10-11-2008, 03:52 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #62 (permalink)
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well now i'n not sure if i go for megasquirt, most of the people in my area knows the haltech system and therefore it will be easier for me to tune the engine with this system. I need to find out more about it, the correct type is: Haltech E6X

http://www.haltech.com/e6x.htm
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Old 10-12-2008, 04:43 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #63 (permalink)
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If they are familair with Haltech and 911 then your decision is already made!

If not Idiots guide to installing a cheap EMS such as the MSII aka MS2 or Megasquirt2
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
Fitting - New service kit.
Needs Fitting - Innovate XD-16 Kit, Kokeln IC. Stephen's K27 HFS, EVO Intake Assy & his Modded USA Fuel Head.

1983 UK 911 3.2 Carrera Sport Coupe. Black, Black Leather with Red Piping, Black Alloy Gear Knob, K&N Air Filter Element, Turbo Tie rods.
Needs Fitting - K&N CO Sensor, Round A/F Dial Gauge, Factory Short Shift Kit.

http://www.danasoft.com/sig/Iamnotanumber.jpg

Last edited by NathanUK; 10-12-2008 at 07:43 AM..
Old 10-12-2008, 07:40 AM
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Nice car you have there, I have an M&W ignition setup and Olli, OMS930 here has he right cams for you, they are a combination of the SC 330 and Gruppe B cams as made by Ruf. Please PM for the details.
Old 10-12-2008, 11:44 PM
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Last sunday i took out the engine and started to strip it down.









I now can see why there was a sound of free exhaust, the engine was leaking in two of the cyllinders

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Old 10-27-2008, 02:20 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #66 (permalink)
 
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I have now stripped down the engine totaly and dismantled the crankcase.

a machine workshop will polish and check the crank and all the bearing's will be replaced.

Just ordered the injectors for the Haltech system, i chose to use size 630cc. I now in the need for a triger and trigger wheel that can be used for the ignition system.





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Old 11-10-2008, 08:26 AM
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Are you planning on doing any crankcase porting/windage? Stronger rods etc? How far are you going power wise now you're going over to EFI?

Also if you're aiming high you want to think about shuffle pinning the case, i'm told the whole engine moves and breathes when under high stress and pinning the case together is a great way of keeping it all together

Last edited by JBL930; 11-10-2008 at 08:48 AM..
Old 11-10-2008, 08:45 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #68 (permalink)
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Plan is to use original rods, they should be strong enough as i have been informed. Goal is only 550hp, it will not be need for more power (for now) since the car weight is only around 1100kg. It should be possible to get more than 740 hp from this setup if the turbocharger is replaced to a larger one.

I was told that someone that did a similar conversion as me, made a extra crankcase ventilation hose from where the distributor used to be, the guy who told me was not sure that there should be any advantage in making more ventilation.
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Old 11-10-2008, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thechiller View Post
Plan is to use original rods, they should be strong enough as i have been informed. Goal is only 550hp, it will not be need for more power (for now) since the car weight is only around 1100kg. It should be possible to get more than 740 hp from this setup if the turbocharger is replaced to a larger one.

I was told that someone that did a similar conversion as me, made a extra crankcase ventilation hose from where the distributor used to be, the guy who told me was not sure that there should be any advantage in making more ventilation.

I doubt you need more ventilation. I've been told some of the crankcase gases are pulled out by the scavenge pump, either through aerated oil or simply the scavenge pump outrunning the feed pump at higher RPM, just a though...

I don't know what type of crank trigger you need for the Haltech, but here is a guy in the states who is very friendly and competent and makes many various sensor and trigger wheels for Electromotive EFI, but he can do custom work as well...

http://www.clewett.com/

Good luck
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Old 11-10-2008, 11:05 AM
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The only reason i mentioned porting out the crankcase/windage or whatever you call it, plus using stronger rods and shuffle pinning is that while you have it torn down you may as well build a totally bomb proof bottom end, then you can go higher up the power ladder in the future without having to totally tear it apart again. That is what i would do if i had my engine totally split, i'd have a high performance oil pump in there too, GT3 or something like that, and definitely fit stronger rods.

Thought i'd add some pics from Micke Svens site showing some shots of porting out the case



Old 11-10-2008, 11:19 AM
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I agree w/ you JBL, I hope you didn't interpret my post as a contradiction to yours, I simply meant I wouldn't bother creating another vent through the dizzy hole...

Shuffle pins, stronger rods, bigger oil pump, always a good idea if the budget allows for it...

I've been told by Ollies, boattailing the mains and "mooning" the cylinder bottoms is only good for about 7-10hp, not surewhat other benefits it may have unless it cuts down on oil aerating, ultimately increasing the efficiency of the front oil coolers...
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Old 11-10-2008, 11:37 AM
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Not at all, i was just saying that it would make sense to do everything to the bottom end while it's apart, even if it's over kill for your initial needs. If you're anything like me you'll almost certainly want more power later down the line, if you've done the major internal stuff right from the start then you know the engine is ready for whatever you may throw at it in the future.
Like you said though it all depends on budget, the OP mentioned a 700+bhp engine on a similar set up, that wouldn't last long on stock rods and i bet you a pound to a penny he'll be dreaming about that power level once he's had a few months with 550bhp. I wouldn't trust stock rods at 550bhp either but that's just me.


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Originally Posted by rsrmike View Post
I agree w/ you JBL, I hope you didn't interpret my post as a contradiction to yours, I simply meant I wouldn't bother creating another vent through the dizzy hole...

Shuffle pins, stronger rods, bigger oil pump, always a good idea if the budget allows for it...

I've been told by Ollies, boattailing the mains and "mooning" the cylinder bottoms is only good for about 7-10hp, not surewhat other benefits it may have unless it cuts down on oil aerating, ultimately increasing the efficiency of the front oil coolers...
Old 11-10-2008, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBL930 View Post
The only reason i mentioned porting out the crankcase/windage or whatever you call it, plus using stronger rods and shuffle pinning is that while you have it torn down you may as well build a totally bomb proof bottom end, then you can go higher up the power ladder in the future without having to totally tear it apart again. That is what i would do if i had my engine totally split, i'd have a high performance oil pump in there too, GT3 or something like that, and definitely fit stronger rods.

Thought i'd add some pics from Micke Svens site showing some shots of porting out the case
Thank folks for the feedback.

Please i do not understand what is the advantage to port the block? When you port it, you do it only on one side? is there any recommendations where and how much to port?

I have spent so much money on this engine and car so it would be wrong to just go half the way in the bottom end, i have to check the cost first, please:

- What rods are recommended, where to buy?
- Shuffle pinning i don't understand what you mean, replace all the studs and bolts that keep the crankcase together, where to buy?
- where do i buy the GT3 oil pump?

RSRmike, thanks for the tip I will checkout clewett.com
Thanks

Kjell
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Old 11-10-2008, 11:24 PM
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To be honest i'm not qualified enough to tell you what to do, i'm just repeating what i've heard. My understanding of shuffle pinning is basically adding locating pins/sleeves around the case so that it cannot shift under stress, somebody may be able to post pictures of it but i don't have any.
My understanding is that the stock rods are very strong, but the bolts are only 9mm and even if you add uprated bolts they do not give a good enough safety margin when really upping the power level, there are lots of different after market rods available and i've heard good things about Carrillo's and Pauter.
The case should really be gas flowed, again i'm not sure about the process but this advise comes from the best tuner we have here in the UK, he also advises that the crank should be crack tested and balanced, but knife edging and lightening it is pretty pointless, you will need to make your own mind up about that.
It is also a good idea to check the oil squirters and modify them if necessary, again this is above my head but someone more knowledgeable may chime in.
The oil pump is also something to consider while you have the thing apart, which one and where to purchase it from is another question, there will be people reading this that will know exactly what to use and where to get it, hopefully they will say something and we can both learn something.
I will e-mail the chap I am talking about and see what he says.

The pics i posted earlier were from this site http://www.spezialmotorer.com/start/top.html if you look in the projects list and click on 935 Gr. 5 Engine you will see them, i don't know the benefits of porting out the case, maybe it's for oil flow or better breathing? It probably isn't necessary for your build but as i said to start with while you have it apart do everything you can to it so that it never has to come apart again. If you are like me you will no doubt want more power at some point, it would be nice to know that the heart of your engine can take whatever you throw at it.



Quote:
Originally Posted by thechiller View Post
Thank folks for the feedback.

Please i do not understand what is the advantage to port the block? When you port it, you do it only on one side? is there any recommendations where and how much to port?

I have spent so much money on this engine and car so it would be wrong to just go half the way in the bottom end, i have to check the cost first, please:

- What rods are recommended, where to buy?
- Shuffle pinning i don't understand what you mean, replace all the studs and bolts that keep the crankcase together, where to buy?
- where do i buy the GT3 oil pump?

RSRmike, thanks for the tip I will checkout clewett.com
Thanks

Kjell
Old 11-11-2008, 12:59 AM
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Shuffle pinning = putting a steel "sleeve" or "tube" into the case where the studs are that hold the case halves together. This sleeve is concentric around the stud and takes some of the shear load away from the stud, allowing it to focus on clamping and stand up to high performance stresses.

Oil modifications:

Oil-bypass modification = bypassing the excess scavenged oil into the pressure side of the pump rather than the sump, leaving less oil in the sump.

Cross-drilled cranks = (important for high rpms and power) The crankshaft oil passages are drilled out through the crank throws, on the bearing journals. This allows more oil to the connecting rods' big-end bearings.

Windage modifications:

"Mooning" = cutting a semi-circular or "half-moon" shape into the bottom of the cylinder spigot (the "skirt" inserted into the case). The relieved area allows gas to flow out of the cylinder easier when pushed by the piston on the downstroke.

"Boat-tailing" = Smoothing the crankcase main webs (or any other webs) which hold the main bearings. This allows gases to flow easier around the webs and cause less drag resistance for the piston when it moves all that air around while running.

"Knife-edging" = Sharpening the crankshaft shoulders between the throws, where the counter-weights are. This causes less drag as the crankshaft rotates through air/oil.
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Old 11-11-2008, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flieger View Post
Shuffle pinning = putting a steel "sleeve" or "tube" into the case where the studs are that hold the case halves together. This sleeve is concentric around the stud and takes some of the shear load away from the stud, allowing it to focus on clamping and stand up to high performance stresses.

Oil modifications:

Oil-bypass modification = bypassing the excess scavenged oil into the pressure side of the pump rather than the sump, leaving less oil in the sump.

Cross-drilled cranks = (important for high rpms and power) The crankshaft oil passages are drilled out through the crank throws, on the bearing journals. This allows more oil to the connecting rods' big-end bearings.

Windage modifications:

"Mooning" = cutting a semi-circular or "half-moon" shape into the bottom of the cylinder spigot (the "skirt" inserted into the case). The relieved area allows gas to flow out of the cylinder easier when pushed by the piston on the downstroke.

"Boat-tailing" = Smoothing the crankcase main webs (or any other webs) which hold the main bearings. This allows gases to flow easier around the webs and cause less drag resistance for the piston when it moves all that air around while running.

"Knife-edging" = Sharpening the crankshaft shoulders between the throws, where the counter-weights are. This causes less drag as the crankshaft rotates through air/oil.
Couple things just from my experience, and other smart folks here too:

"Boat tailing" webs.....has not proven itself greatly, at least in my opinion. Some say it does wonders, others nay. I tend to side on the later....

"Mooning" case reinforcements.....I'm warry on this are well. They're in there for a reason. If I we concerned greatly about windage that much I'd run a vacuum pump on the case to an air/oil separator...Now I know it's probably not a huge issue currently, but it would be a lingering though in my head had I done this to one of my motors.

"Knife edging crank"......this is good, and typically I find that smooth rounded radii vs sharp edges on leading edge of throws helps even more for low windage.(same principle behind why rounded submarine nose is more efficient than a sharp pointed one in the water)

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Old 11-11-2008, 08:44 PM
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I lost track of this thread.

The muffler pictured was made for a 930/RSR-Look so it will likely not fit your bumper. You may wish to use the basic design though for a more stealthy look.







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Old 11-11-2008, 09:08 PM
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I do like that look on the car I must ask, did you make or source your tips? I've always made mine but if there's an outside source I'm all ears(or eyes in this case)


Quote:
Originally Posted by RarlyL8 View Post
I lost track of this thread.

The muffler pictured was made for a 930/RSR-Look so it will likely not fit your bumper. You may wish to use the basic design though for a more stealthy look.







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Old 11-11-2008, 09:40 PM
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It would be interesting to make a muffler like that, please where can i buy the end piece?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RarlyL8 View Post
I lost track of this thread.

The muffler pictured was made for a 930/RSR-Look so it will likely not fit your bumper. You may wish to use the basic design though for a more stealthy look.
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Old 11-11-2008, 11:32 PM
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