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View Poll Results: Where should I look next
Fuel System 1 12.50%
Ignition System 4 50.00%
Air System 1 12.50%
Cam Timing 1 12.50%
Valve Timing 0 0%
Pull the heads off and start measuring 0 0%
Turbo 0 0%
Find an expert 2 25.00%
For a new owner 0 0%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 8. You may not vote on this poll

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Ok, crazy question,, but how does it roll with the clutch in ? that will eliminate problems from there back.. , then how does it back drive ( meaning is the tranny working well ?).
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"Todd"
98 Tahoe ,2007 Saturn Vue
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Old 11-11-2007, 11:41 AM
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The engine seems to rev up and down OK, I can push the car easily in nuetral.

here is a link to a post with more background info on this problem
Dyno results - my 930 Sucks!
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Old 11-11-2007, 11:57 AM
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I've been thinking about all your comments and one thing I remember is when I put the K27-7200 on it it felt like a downgrade from the 3DLZ not an improvement. Boost starts to build around 2600 but doesn't rise to .8bar until 3500 and power drops off sharply above 5500.

I remember thinking I must have needed a better exhaust system or cams to take advantage of the K27. But when I had the exhaust replaced there was no difference.
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Old 11-11-2007, 12:11 PM
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What exhaust do you have currently installed? Do you still have the catalytic converter?
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Old 11-11-2007, 12:52 PM
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Read you old thread.

One thing I think you may have overlooked is the ignition timing. I mean have you checked it at idle & high rpm? Are the cans working properly? Have the plates seized up in the dizzy?

Or is your EFI actually DME?

I can vote now
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1981 UK 930. G50/01 shortened, 964 3.8RS Fibreglass Body Kit, 18" Alloys 8.5" F & 10" R, 225's F & 285's R, Special Colour Metallic Blue Paint, FIA Sparco Evo's, A/C and Air Pump removed, Electronic Boost Controller, GHL Headers, Tial46 WG.
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Last edited by NathanUK; 11-11-2007 at 01:23 PM..
Old 11-11-2007, 01:06 PM
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The waste gate dump flame seems suspicious. Like Nathan, I'm suspecting ignition timing.

Is the exhaust also very hot? If so, these are signs of timing issues.

Have you checked the crank pulley marks?
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Old 11-11-2007, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanUK View Post
I can vote now
I'm still waiting .
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Old 11-11-2007, 03:03 PM
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[QUOTE=125shifter;3582341]The waste gate dump flame seems suspicious. Like Nathan, I'm suspecting ignition timing.

Is the exhaust also very hot?QUOTE]

yes the exhaust get very hot.

My wrench said he checked the ignition timing with a timing light, I have not done it personally. I will drop into the shop this afternoon and get them to do it again.

The car does not have a distributer anymore it has a 36-1 toothed wheel and a sensor installed. The ignition timing is entirely handled by the ECU


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Last edited by rotorhead; 11-11-2007 at 04:13 PM..
Old 11-11-2007, 04:03 PM
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Since I'm not familiar with your software I can't be sure, but the timing looks too advanced when you're making boost. It doesn't look crazy advanced like would cause your problems.

I had an issue when I first started my engine with EFI. I had it super advanced without realizing it because I checked the timing as I was starting it but didn't keep checking it once it was actually running. I melted the front of my garage A/C unit before I realized the problem .

You can advance the timing as you're coming off idle to help with the low compression. Once the boost starts to build you need to retard the timing. Your programming may be doing that with boost compensation, but once again I don't know your system.
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Last edited by David; 11-11-2007 at 04:57 PM..
Old 11-11-2007, 04:50 PM
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Just a quick update, I got the shop today to check the turbo and the ignition timing with a timing light and compare it with the ecu.

The turbo is fine, but they found a blown O ring seal at the adapter for the intercooler pipe.

The timing was confirmed as correct.

The car drives a little punchier but not a lot.
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Old 11-12-2007, 12:06 AM
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If I read your timing map correctly you are running 20 degs advance at full boost and 6000 rpm? That is too retarded. Try 26 degs. That is stock advance. I would also put a good boost gauge at the intake manifold after the throttle. I would also remove that airfilter during the test.
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Old 11-12-2007, 03:27 AM
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Thanks Dean
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Old 11-12-2007, 03:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dean View Post
If I read your timing map correctly you are running 20 degs advance at full boost and 6000 rpm? That is too retarded. Try 26 degs. That is stock advance. I would also put a good boost gauge at the intake manifold after the throttle. I would also remove that airfilter during the test.
I believe it's 26 BTDC with the vacuum hose disconnected. With the vacuum retard working it would retard timing about 10.
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Old 11-12-2007, 03:57 AM
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Hey David,

On my Euro motor and most 930's with dists. The vacume retard only retards on vacume. So on boost it doesn't effect the timing. The timing is 26 degs on boost. I think only one year had vacume retard and boost retard.
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Old 11-12-2007, 01:49 PM
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Dean, you're right. There's one vacuum retard curve that shows some retard under pressure but it doesn't retard much and it appears to be for 78 Cali and Japan cars (?).

I glanced at my curve last night and saw 17 BTDC. I just looked closer and realized it's 17 at 8000 RPM where I never plan to go. Mines right around 26 at 6000 RPM.
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Old 11-12-2007, 02:02 PM
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What kind of cams are you running? have you re-checked your cam timing to the values of your cams?

It sounds like your making boost, so the issue is after the boost sensor.

also, are you running the special heat resistant gaskets on those billet injector blocks? Probably doesnt have anything to do with your issue, but I couldnt see any, and that will great issues later on with heat sink.
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Old 11-12-2007, 02:22 PM
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Steve, You may want to just fly Dean over and have him take a look at it.. I know from experience that free food and good looking women are an easy enticement. My understanding is there are some exceptional women down under.....
Hey Dean, I'm going to be back next weekend,, feel free to stop in by they way,, Chris and Janus are coming over for TG.... I'm sure I'll have one or two of the fairer gender hanging out most of the week..
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"Todd"
98 Tahoe ,2007 Saturn Vue
86 930 black and stock, 80 930 blue tracdog
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Old 11-12-2007, 02:31 PM
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PS,, you may need to get permission from his wife however
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"Todd"
98 Tahoe ,2007 Saturn Vue
86 930 black and stock, 80 930 blue tracdog
91 Spec Miata (yeah I race a chick car)
"life"ll kill ya" Warren Zevon
Old 11-12-2007, 02:31 PM
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Has the exhaust system been ruled out as a restriction?
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Old 11-12-2007, 02:44 PM
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Have you checked the crank pulley? The cam and ignition timing are both good, but since both the cam and ignition timing are set off the pulley, I'm a little suspicious.

For the record, my vote is ignition timing. Yes they've checked and rechecked it but something is wrong.

Try setting the whole ignition table 10 degree retarded and then 10 degrees advanced if that doesn't work. If you see an improvement try 20 degrees. One quick acceleration on boost shouldn't hurt if this does throw off timing.
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Last edited by David; 11-12-2007 at 04:22 PM..
Old 11-12-2007, 03:10 PM
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