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930 Rookie
 
944S3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
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Stupid rookie 930 question......

How would one heel/toe a 930? Seems to be a great deal of distance between brake/throttle with not much room for an average size foot (10.5) to get in there.

Thanks,
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Current: 1982 Platinum Metallic 930, stock (P-CarOnline.com) / www.Type930.com
Former: 1989 Glacier Silver 944 "S3", 1987 Guards Red 924 S
Also in the family: 1992 Polar Silver 968 Cab, stock
Old 01-17-2008, 08:48 AM
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The only stupid question is a question you don't ask...

as for heal toe. many people buy a new accelerator pedal. I have size 12 feet and it still is not very comfortable.

This will be a future purchase of mine



Pelican sells a bunch of different kinds:

http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/shopcart/911M/POR_911M_Ppedal_pg1.htm#item0
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1979 Porsche 930: 3.4L, SC cams, Twin plug, Leask WUR, Custom SSI turbo exhaust, Tial WG, K27HFS, and we can't forget the Zork (short lived depending on my homeowners assoc.)
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Old 01-17-2008, 10:12 AM
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There are no stupid question...

IMHO Heel/toe just takes practice, one key factor is to have the sit position at the right distance to be able to strech the heel as required.
Old 01-17-2008, 12:39 PM
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well in my experience, I use the knife edge of my foot. I have fairly large feet size 13 and wide- When I wear my work boots it is easier to do heel and toe or in my case knife edge and toe.
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Old 01-17-2008, 01:24 PM
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Just very used to the 944 which was incredibly simple to heel toe. Tried to do it in the 930 and couldn't get my foot in there.

I think I'll stick to the stock setup given the ridiculous prices of those pedals.
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Current: 1982 Platinum Metallic 930, stock (P-CarOnline.com) / www.Type930.com
Former: 1989 Glacier Silver 944 "S3", 1987 Guards Red 924 S
Also in the family: 1992 Polar Silver 968 Cab, stock
Old 01-17-2008, 05:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 930gt-40r View Post
well in my experience, I use the knife edge of my foot. I have fairly large feet size 13 and wide- When I wear my work boots it is easier to do heel and toe or in my case knife edge and toe.
I wear a size 10 1/2 and I use the middle part of my foot ( under the ball ) for the brake this allows the heel to slide to the gas pedal.. Seems to work fine for me, does take practice and at first your foot seems to be pretty high on the brake,
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Old 01-17-2008, 05:34 PM
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I find it pretty hard to heel-toe on the street. I'm rarely stomping on the brakes hard enough to get that brake pedal low enough to allow my ankle to roll over and blip the throttle. However, for a cheap and easy brake pedal fix, I took an extra plastic gas pedal, trimmed off the little flange at the bottom, and just bolted it on top of the existing pedal. The gas pedal gets a little "thicker", and I find it a bit easier to heel-toe. I think this was recommended to me by Jeff Gamroth.
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Old 01-17-2008, 06:13 PM
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I hang the ball of the foot off the brake pedal, turn the foot sideways and use the edge of the heel on the throttle.

Learnt to do it on a 944, but now it's second-nature. First did it on the 911 without even thinking about it. I was doing it on a Peugot 407 diesel station wagon the other week...

I find it invaluable - and especially useful in traffic, like on entry to junctions where you might have to either stop or accelerate at any time, depending on how it goes when you get 10 ft from the white line.
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Old 01-17-2008, 06:57 PM
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IMO to add surface to the pedals becomes more on an interference (i.e. dangerous...) than an aid for the heel/toe.

If you realize, racing shoes are very narrow, precisely to have more room to play around. Somebody recommended to wear big shoes, I wouldn't.

Just practice, you'll get it.
Old 01-18-2008, 04:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miguel Antonett View Post
IMO to add surface to the pedals becomes more on an interference (i.e. dangerous...) than an aid for the heel/toe.

If you realize, racing shoes are very narrow, precisely to have more room to play around. Somebody recommended to wear big shoes, I wouldn't.

Just practice, you'll get it.
+1 above, if you are looking for a wider racing shoe, piloti has a shoe that have a wider heel than most of the other racing shoes. I actually prefer the narrower shoe. It's all about practice. I started auto-crossing on a 914, run a 912 in vintage, and fool around with my 930 on the street they all have similar pedal setups (if not the same). It's all about practice.
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Old 01-18-2008, 08:46 PM
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Guess I was spoiled with the 944 pedals. I only tried once and realized it probably wasn't going to happen on normal roads. Thanks for the input!
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Current: 1982 Platinum Metallic 930, stock (P-CarOnline.com) / www.Type930.com
Former: 1989 Glacier Silver 944 "S3", 1987 Guards Red 924 S
Also in the family: 1992 Polar Silver 968 Cab, stock
Old 01-19-2008, 06:11 AM
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I use the actual heel of my foot to push the loud pedal too. You just have to kick out your heel slightly. I too find it easier wearing my big safety shoes.
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Old 01-23-2008, 11:16 AM
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The height of the brake pedal is adjustable on the big threaded linkage rod going up to the master cylinder too. At least it is on my '87.
Set it so the brake pedal is at an even height to the gas pedal when you're braking and that helps.
You can buy or make a gas pedal with a side extension which makes it more comfortable for some peoples ankles too.

It kind of depends on how flexible your ankles are on how you do it.
Old 01-27-2008, 09:10 AM
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Old 01-27-2008, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 944S3 View Post
Guess I was spoiled with the 944 pedals. I only tried once and realized it probably wasn't going to happen on normal roads. Thanks for the input!
Hayabusa's right - seat time. If you can already heel'n'toe, it'll come when you've adjusted to the car and feel more comfortable with it.
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Old 01-27-2008, 11:49 AM
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Adjust the pedal height. Makes a HUGE difference.
Brake with the ball of your foot and blip gas with outer right rear of your heel.

I do it all the time on the street when driving "sportily"
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Old 01-27-2008, 12:14 PM
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I'm so glad I checked this I thought it'd be another heel/toe debate thing - and then I find this <<>> about lowering the brake pedal!??!

***JUST*** what the doctor ordered, thanks so much for that tip. In my infinite noobness I was unaware of that capability (schwing!) and do verymuch find the stop pedal quite high in relation to the go.

After piling on more miles lately (another CT to Maine WOT trip and some winter commuting sprinkled in) I'm realizing how much I don't even really need to heel / toe it. I'm looking forward to being better able to with lowering said pedal but have been finding mesself instead double clutching and being VERY deliberate with my shifts and technique instead (this in my 39k car with new center sprung clutch and rebuilt 3rd).

One thing for me I found essential to master is the rolling 'shift into 1st'. Takes finesse "asking" for the engagement, and much technique with the throttle etc. H/T'ing aint gonna work for me there. But the reward, oh momma yeah.

Oh, when I do H / T, I too have found the "blade" edge of my foot is where the contact works.

Shifting Gears for a moment (baaaaaaaaaaaaad pun)...

As I thinking about this thread while rowing my way along the road via the 4gang the other night, I started thinking about another recent (common) thread either about buyers insisting on an '89 for the G50, or threads about the G50 swap.

Then I began to absorb "what" the 4spd embodies and enables in its bespoke application. The deliberate (er, charming) shifts. The loooooooooooooong legs. The few gearshifts. The straight-cut whine. Stirs the soul, and enhances the experience. And then there was someone else's also recent quote "anytime spent shifting is time not spent accelerating". Man that's good stuff. I finally "got it".

I know the G50 provides other attributes of improvement, I was just suddenly reveling in the uniqueness the 4gang brings to the exercise - what a goof / hoot when mastered. I enjoy the rawness to that part of the experience, it matches the rest of it exuding from the car. I've only driven a G50'd Carrera 3.2, have to try a 930 mit one sometime then I guess - oh darn!

ANYwho I digress... I socannotwait to lower das pedal. Thanks again, I'm psyched to address this fax pax on her heh heh...
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Old 01-28-2008, 05:41 AM
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Just don't adjust it too low or you'll go over center on the linkage rod and that is not good.
The transmission gearsets aren't straight cut either. They're helical cut .
Old 01-28-2008, 07:28 AM
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Thanks for that tip - are there any how-to's I should search on this, or is it pathetically self-evident. I seem to have the fecal touch however. And will it be clear that I have or have not gone "over center" on the adjustment? Yes my ignorance is in fact my bliss 8-).

Sorry, they 'sound' straight cut, again my igorance thanks.
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past:

| '01 ///M5 | '96 993 C2 cab | '05 S600 Sport - biturbo V12@Just Not Right 495rwhp / 612rwtq |
| '58 TR3A | '01 //S8 | '95 //S6 6gang | '88 ///M5 | '87 190E 2.3-16 |
Old 01-28-2008, 08:11 AM
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Think about making a wider base for the gas pedal using 1/4 inch plywood. I cut one to a shape that extends the left side of the pedal quite a way along the bottom section. You can copy the shape from the myriad of photos on the web of these $400 pedal set-ups. The photo at the top of this posting is an example. Bolt this to the plastic gas pedal and then lower the brake pedal via the linkage to be level with it at maximum braking loads. NOTE: This may be a little lower than the height you will be able to get by pushing on it with your hand while under the dash.
All this costs only a few bucks plus your time......and can be customized to your foot size too. If you don't like the first pattern of the gas pedal after trying it a few times make another one up.
And as everyone says, practice all the time makes perfect. Even driving on the street I do it to get it to be second nature, so at the track when things are happening alot more quickley it is easier.
You will learn to appreciate the beauty and foresight of Porsches design of the pedals and the floor hinged gas pedal especially for the ability to heel and toe. Modern cars mostly have top hinged pedals which suck for heel and toe.
Fred
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Old 01-28-2008, 10:38 AM
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