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Sounds like you have a solid plan. Best of luck with it.

JK
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Big Gun: 1988 928S4 Twin Turbo, 5-SPD/LSD 572 RWHP, 579 RW ft-lbs, 12 psig manifold pressure. Stock Internals, 93 octane.
Little Gun: 1981 928 Competition Package Twin Turbo, 375 RWHP, 415 RW ft-lbs, 10psig manifold pressure. Nikasil Block, JE2618 Pistons, 93 octane.
Old 03-07-2008, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by les_garten View Post
It's easy, it's been done. People have Blown up 930's doing it. You are working on the car and miss the control line when hooking things back up. Not everybody is perfect, are you?? You Gonna see a whole lot more than 10PSI quick.

So, you redline a 930 in 3rd Gear at 7:1 compression and hit 30-45 pounds boost. You MAY live to tell the tale.

You redline a high Compression SC motor at 30-45 pounds. KABOOM!!

I'm willing to bet you do that one time and you get to pull the motor to figure out what's making the weird noises.

Did this exact thing well the line was rubber/silicone and melted without me knowing on a stock CR sc engine.. well we all know what happened there..look at my sig
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Old 03-07-2008, 02:20 PM
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Also remember this

If to do this all again I would do the following

930 induction
930 exhaust
fab your own oil drain into the sump
t off the idiot light switch for oil supply

This the cheapest (2.5K)and easiest setup.
also almost monkey proof so this would be great for a shop that is not real excited about the project.. Useing stock parts makes easy to upgrade and identify parts.

You will be able to lay down about 300hp at .5 bar approx the 915 will hold up fine


Now if you are going to pay another 2.5k to have someone do the install think real hard about buying a 930.. I chose this route (build off a 3.0 sc engine)cause everyone told me don't do it, it won't work well it does and can work well.

oh and with the 3.0 you start with better rod set up and journels. now if building a crazy engine that does not factor in as the misgivings of the 3.2/3.3 rods are taken care of right away
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Old 03-07-2008, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mb911 View Post
Did this exact thing well the line was rubber/silicone and melted without me knowing on a stock CR sc engine.. well we all know what happened there..look at my sig
What structure melted the line? How much damage?

Never mind, I looked at the thread and saw that piston.

YIKES!!
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---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT

Last edited by les_garten; 03-07-2008 at 02:51 PM..
Old 03-07-2008, 02:45 PM
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A little to close to the header oops don't make that mistake again
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Old 03-07-2008, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germaniac View Post
I will only run 5 bars and will only be "enjoying" that little extra power now and again on quick turnpike sprints.
Rob
WOOOHHOOOOO, you will really enjoy that kick in the pants at 73lbs of boost. That will be a hell of a ride for a very short time. Better run some 150 leaded, just in case. Might want to pull a little timing out just for the first run to make sure its OK.
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Old 03-07-2008, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turboteener View Post
WOOOHHOOOOO, you will really enjoy that kick in the pants at 73lbs of boost. That will be a hell of a ride for a very short time. Better run some 150 leaded, just in case. Might want to pull a little timing out just for the first run to make sure its OK.
Hi Brett,
Guess you learn kinda slow, ehhh? How many more like this you gotta hear?
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---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 03-07-2008, 07:59 PM
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It was a joke dumbass.
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Old 03-08-2008, 07:10 AM
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Guys,

I really appreciate all the feedback, constructively against and those for the little project. That said, I'll post the outcome, both good and bad after the project is finished. Ben, I appreciate your weigh-in on this greatly. I have only heard great things about your assistance and product -- I hope I can tap into that if I need it.

Thanks again.

Oh, and to add to my little project, I just bought a brembo mono upgrade with '88 Carrera rears for 600 bucks. I felt it was a great deal...1,500 miles o the whole kit.

Have a great weekend,

Rob
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Old 03-08-2008, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turboteener View Post
WOOOHHOOOOO, you will really enjoy that kick in the pants at 73lbs of boost. That will be a hell of a ride for a very short time. Better run some 150 leaded, just in case. Might want to pull a little timing out just for the first run to make sure its OK.
Wow, tough crowd......... just an oversight of a decimal point. Yes, we I know it's a joke.
Old 03-08-2008, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turboteener View Post
It was a joke dumbass.
I'm sure he was real amused when he suffered the issue I warned about and you basically said couldn't happen. I'm sure he thought that fist sized hole in his piston was a JOKE. Thanx for lowering yourself to profanity and demonstrating that you can't learn anything or admit when you are wrong.
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---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 03-08-2008, 08:04 AM
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Apparently not everyone knew it was a joke. NOt sure what he is referring to.
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Old 03-08-2008, 08:15 AM
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You gotta watch your jokes around here. Check out the LED gage thread for an example.

Les, I don't know what point you are trying to make unless it is that everyone should be scared of turbochargers.

What you and Ben did was a self admitted mistake that cost an engine. That could just as easily happened to a 930. A waste gate failure is a waste gate failure nomatter what brought it on.

The original poster is wanting advice on how to do it right, not don't do it or you'll blow your engine. Turbocharged SCs are common on this board so it is proven that you can do it right.

My suggestion would be to directly e-mail the folks who have successfully done this conversion. They will be more likely to open up to any pitfalls and helpful hints off-forum rather than open themselves to ridicule. I know many extremely knowledgeable folks who simply will not post due to the BS on these forums. It's a damn shame and hurts us all.
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Old 03-08-2008, 10:49 AM
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You gotta watch your jokes around here. Check out the LED gage thread for an example.

Les, I don't know what POINT you are trying to make unless it is that everyone should be scared of turbochargers.

What you and Ben did was a self admitted mistake that cost an engine. That could just as easily happened to a 930. A waste gate failure is a waste gate failure nomatter what brought it on.

NOT TRUE I don't know why this point is so hard to get across. No this wouldn't have happened on my car or on a production 930. At least not to the extent it has happened to some of these conversions. My car has over-boost cut. The 930 has ovrerboost cut. That is safety engineering designed to save the motor. The POINT is high compression + Turbocharger + no safety engineering = beware. Porsche put in a lot of safety engineering to make a Turbocharged car safe. These are absent on most if not all of these "Kit" conversions.

The mistake didn't cost me my engine, the overboost cut off caught it.

The original poster is wanting advice on how to do it right, not don't do it or you'll blow your engine. Turbocharged SCs are common on this board so it is proven that you can do it right.

That's correct. But a lot if not most of these were torn down and converted. They are for all practical purposes 930's now. Notice I did not say ALL. So don't paste a thread in here of a Bolt on.

Keep in mind how this thread started out. He went to a Professional Porsche Wrench and the guy basically told him he was nutz! Maybe that wrench thought that if you are going to Turbocharge 1950/1960's engine technology, it should be prepped for it. Because that's what a 911 motor is.

My suggestion would be to directly e-mail the folks who have successfully done this conversion. They will be more likely to open up to any pitfalls and helpful hints off-forum rather than open themselves to ridicule. I know many extremely knowledgeable folks who simply will not post due to the BS on these forums. It's a damn shame and hurts us all.

I'm Glad you can just brand a difference of opinion as BS. And by the way, the opinions of this thread I am SURE have helped the poster in that he will be cautious and ask better informed questions. He can also look at a thread that shows direct evidence of a similiar conversion that had an untoward event(FIST SIZED HOLE IN PISTON). So saying that it's a shame and it hurts us all to discuss is BS. This is a discussion and sharing forum. There will be differences of opinion. I never said he couldn't do it. I said, it's not prudent. Turbocharging a 911 motor is a sliding scale.

This conversion is on one end of the scale and the 930 is on the Polar opposite end of the scale. Somewhere in between is a proper converted SC motor. This is MY opinion, not BS. YMMV
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---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 03-08-2008, 11:30 AM
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My SC has a BAE "kit". The words "bolt on" and "BAE" should absolutely never be used in the same sentence. I have found that there is a tremendous amount of reverse engineering involved in doing what I did. Also, I take mine to the track, so I had to engineer in some other stuff to assure it could stand being on boost for a much longer time duration than a street car. A search of my user name and BAE will provide a lot of questions and answers. I didn't actually have the benefit of seeing a 930 engine on a stand until after I finished mine, so I looked at it in wonder for a while, counting up all of the wheels I reinvented for this conversion.

So, Rob, I would suggest you familiarize yourself with some of the quirks involved with doing this before you start plunking down money for someone to install the "kit" for you, mostly for your own benefit. I can guarantee that the mechanic will come back to you afterwards and say "well, this needs this, and that needs that, so it will cost you an extra $xxx".

BTW, I'm hoping you don't have a RAJAY turbo, as they present their own challenges, specifically oil feed and drain, and availability of refurb parts. That being said, the SC running at 6 PSI will make a big difference in performance over a stock SC.

I don't really have any true, positive overboost protection, but after reading this thread, I think it would probably be a wise idea to wire in a pressure switch to my fuel pump circuit. I do have a degree of overboost protection via different means.

Lastly, everyone on this board brings something to the table, and I couldn't have done mine without everyone's help. There is a vast accumulation of turbo knowledge here. Anyway, have fun!
Pat
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Old 03-08-2008, 01:00 PM
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[COLOR=Red]I'm Glad you can just brand a difference of opinion as BS. And by the way, the opinions of this thread I am SURE have helped the poster in that he will be cautious and ask better informed questions. He can also look at a thread that shows direct evidence of a similiar conversion that had an untoward event(FIST SIZED HOLE IN PISTON). So saying that it's a shame and it hurts us all to discuss is BS. This is a discussion and sharing forum. There will be differences of opinion. I never said he couldn't do it. I said, it's not prudent. Turbocharging a 911 motor is a sliding scale.

The hole is from a hole saw to make a pencil holder
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Old 03-08-2008, 02:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mb911 View Post
[color=Red]I'm Glad you can just brand a difference of opinion as BS. And by the way, the opinions of this thread I am SURE have helped the poster in that he will be cautious and ask better informed questions. He can also look at a thread that shows direct evidence of a similiar conversion that had an untoward event(FIST SIZED HOLE IN PISTON). So saying that it's a shame and it hurts us all to discuss is BS. This is a discussion and sharing forum. There will be differences of opinion. I never said he couldn't do it. I said, it's not prudent. Turbocharging a 911 motor is a sliding scale.

The hole is from a hole saw to make a pencil holder
MY bad, the Overboost smashed all the ring lands out! A fine distinction, but a distinction nonetheless!

How much ya want for that Pencil holder by the way??

$10,000??

Les
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---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 03-08-2008, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by patkeefe View Post
My SC has a BAE "kit". The words "bolt on" and "BAE" should absolutely never be used in the same sentence. I have found that there is a tremendous amount of reverse engineering involved in doing what I did. Also, I take mine to the track, so I had to engineer in some other stuff to assure it could stand being on boost for a much longer time duration than a street car. A search of my user name and BAE will provide a lot of questions and answers. I didn't actually have the benefit of seeing a 930 engine on a stand until after I finished mine, so I looked at it in wonder for a while, counting up all of the wheels I reinvented for this conversion.

So, Rob, I would suggest you familiarize yourself with some of the quirks involved with doing this before you start plunking down money for someone to install the "kit" for you, mostly for your own benefit. I can guarantee that the mechanic will come back to you afterwards and say "well, this needs this, and that needs that, so it will cost you an extra $xxx".

BTW, I'm hoping you don't have a RAJAY turbo, as they present their own challenges, specifically oil feed and drain, and availability of refurb parts. That being said, the SC running at 6 PSI will make a big difference in performance over a stock SC.

I don't really have any true, positive overboost protection, but after reading this thread, I think it would probably be a wise idea to wire in a pressure switch to my fuel pump circuit. I do have a degree of overboost protection via different means.

Lastly, everyone on this board brings something to the table, and I couldn't have done mine without everyone's help. There is a vast accumulation of turbo knowledge here. Anyway, have fun!
Pat
Hi,
Your post brings us back around full circle. The conversion, if you do it substandard is expensive and in my opinion dangerous. If you do it right, it is REALLY expensive and nowhere near as dangerous. The end of the day shows, Geez, I could've got a 930 for that. However, a 930 is not a Turbocharged SC. If you want a Turbo'd SC(Narrow body) then you can do a bolt-on, and watch a lot of Clint Eastwood movies. Do ya feel lucky PUNK! You can tear your SC motor apart and prep if for a Turbo, as has been done by tons of folks here. You can get a 930 motor and Transplant it. Or you can buy a 930 and get all the goodies that go along with it, ie tranny, brakes, body, suspension, etc.

This brings me back to the sliding scale. One end of the scale is expensive and dangerous, the other end is more expensive and a whole lot less dangerous.

If I were doing this project, I would be running all this in a spreadsheet to consider all the options.

There is a guy selling a 930 on the forum who has a $100,000 plus car that you could pick up in the 40's. If it were me I would sell my SC and watch for deal. They happen all the time here.

I certainly understand the "yearning" for a blown SC. High compression, Turbo, YEAH BABY!
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---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 03-08-2008, 03:16 PM
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Originally Posted by les_garten View Post
MY bad, the Overboost smashed all the ring lands out! A fine distinction, but a distinction nonetheless!

How much ya want for that Pencil holder by the way??

$10,000??

Les

It was for the better turned out to be better with the new P&C setup but still running low boost .5 bar @ 8.5-1 CR runs great and feel a ton safer ..
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Old 03-08-2008, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by les_garten View Post
Hi,
Your post brings us back around full circle. The conversion, if you do it substandard is expensive and in my opinion dangerous. If you do it right, it is REALLY expensive and nowhere near as dangerous. The end of the day shows, Geez, I could've got a 930 for that. However, a 930 is not a Turbocharged SC. If you want a Turbo'd SC(Narrow body) then you can do a bolt-on, and watch a lot of Clint Eastwood movies. Do ya feel lucky PUNK! You can tear your SC motor apart and prep if for a Turbo, as has been done by tons of folks here. You can get a 930 motor and Transplant it. Or you can buy a 930 and get all the goodies that go along with it, ie tranny, brakes, body, suspension, etc.

This brings me back to the sliding scale. One end of the scale is expensive and dangerous, the other end is more expensive and a whole lot less dangerous.

If I were doing this project, I would be running all this in a spreadsheet to consider all the options.

There is a guy selling a 930 on the forum who has a $100,000 plus car that you could pick up in the 40's. If it were me I would sell my SC and watch for deal. They happen all the time here.

I certainly understand the "yearning" for a blown SC. High compression, Turbo, YEAH BABY!

for me it really honestly was about the challange so please understand that .. I did however love the 930 look so that(turbo body) just went along with everything else..

also there was no way I was going to be abale to sell my johnny cash (50,51,52,53 caddy) 77 911 with a 78 sc tranny,with an 81 sc engine it and come out ahead so why not make what I wanted myself. you guys also need to take what I say with a grain of salt because I am uber DIY guy.. I build my own engines/weld my own flares/paint my own car/weld my own exhaust/build my own pressure piping/ built my own IC (scrapped it for a better off the shelf unit as I experiemented to much) polish my own fuchs/put my own glass in kind of guy so much cheaper then most.. here is the final product
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Old 03-08-2008, 03:49 PM
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