Pelican Parts
Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   Pelican Parts Forums > 1- Porsche Technical Forums > 911 / 930 Turbo & Super Charging Forum


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Reply
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Boca Raton/Atlanta
Posts: 544
What? Are you stupid? Turbo on a 911SC

Hello all,

I am in the process of purchasing a turbo set-up for my 911SC. That said, to help me install the thing, I called a local Florida garage, Richard Danvers Porsche here in Hollywood, FL.

Wow, what a shocking response. I told Mr. Danvers I planned to run this thing at minimum boost, just for a little kick and he basically told me I might as well throw my car away.

He said that the compression etc. wasn't made to handle a turbo and I would blow my engine just attempting to install it.

So, my question is, after hearing so much positive feedback and success stories, is this a stupid undertaking?

I am not wanting 400+hp, I am just looking for a little kick in the pants now and again out of the old girl.

As for safe-guarding engine problems while installing it, what should I do to protect myself and the engine?

Guys, thanks so much. This board has proven invaluable and I would be (even more) lost without it.

Rob
robertludwick@hotmail.com
__________________
Rob L.
Currently have too many cars
to properly care for
Old 03-04-2008, 05:51 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #1 (permalink)
Registered User
 
turboteener's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 301
He is a dumb ass. It can and has been done. Tune carefully and you will be fine. Also make sure the engine is in good condition.
__________________
Brett
Old 03-04-2008, 06:12 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Boca Raton/Atlanta
Posts: 544
Yeah, the engine runs like a top...really good motor. I will have it tuned accordingly after installation.

I even told this guy I am not some hot dogging horsepower freak...I just want a little more performance...he basically called me a dumbass -- I wouldn't recommend this prick if you live in South Florida...very arrogant and only open to his own opinion obviously...isn't the SC based on the original 930 mill anyway? gotta be safe ways to boost it...hell, it is an ironclad motor...thanks for your input

Richard Danvers, you lost my business and my referrals, so who's the dumbass now, huh, huh?
__________________
Rob L.
Currently have too many cars
to properly care for
Old 03-04-2008, 06:16 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
copbait73's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Chesterfield IN
Posts: 1,314
Garage
As a Porsche professional and assuming he is also a good business man his response is entirely predictable.
While I've often done what you are planning to do I've never expected buy in on the idea, paid or otherwise. I think you should seek out a like mind Porsche enthusiast with the skills to help you accomplish this.
Along these lines, IMO if you wish to continue owning Porsches you will be much more satisfied in the long run and have more money in you pockets, if you learn to do many things on your own.
Don't get me wrong, I have high regard for these independent shops and their owners. In my area they are few but invaluable to me when I'm stumped on a problem or need a rare part in a hurry. Most are just trying to make an honest living. But, to make a living they need to charge you a rate that will be hard to recover once you want to move on to other Porsches and projects.
I might add his experience probably is that these rarely work because BOOST is addicting and you will lose your self control, maybe even try to sue him. I repeat, my local guy says "ALL turbo motors now need or will need some level of repair on an ongoing basis, factory included"....it's been his experience - 36 years.

Last edited by copbait73; 03-04-2008 at 06:42 AM..
Old 03-04-2008, 06:28 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Burlington, Wisconsin
Posts: 9,199
it has been done/it can be done/ and yes you can blow em up. I did! However a stupid mistake.. Search my name and you will find tons of turbocharging info.. Best of luck
__________________
Ben

Current project 73 914-6 Gt project rusteration 2.4
Reproduction 914-6 oil tanks, 1-5/8" 914-6 heat exchangers source call 2623647426 or email mbconsulting21 @gmail.com
Old 03-04-2008, 06:48 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #5 (permalink)
Registered User
 
copbait73's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Chesterfield IN
Posts: 1,314
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by mb911 View Post
it has been done/it can be done/ and yes you can blow em up. I did! However a stupid mistake.. Search my name and you will find tons of turbocharging info.. Best of luck
Thanks Ben, I've followed your build and it's good information. Obviously, he just needs to find someone who is more supportive.
Old 03-04-2008, 07:41 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #6 (permalink)
 
Macht Schnell
 
les_garten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: PSL, FL
Posts: 861
Hi,
Put yourself in his position. You are taking an engine and tranny not designed for what you are trying to do to it. You also are taking a Great car(according to you), and putting a time bomb in it. If he has not done it before, you don't want to be his first convertion. He doesn't want the headache. It's not worth it to him from a financial standpoint. You blow it up, and you blame him anyhow. Presently, the worst you can say about him now is he pissed you off and refused to hand you a loaded gun.

There's no question it can be done, lots here have done it with good success. I think most recommendations would be, get a 930, it's been DETUNED for the street. There's lots of headroom in the engine, tranny, half shafts, etc.

FLAME on McDuff!!
__________________
---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 03-04-2008, 08:02 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #7 (permalink)
Crotchety Old Bastard
 
RarlyL8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 13,423
Garage
Quote:
"ALL turbo motors now need or will need some level of repair on an ongoing basis, factory included"....it's been his experience - 36 years.
Ha, that's like saying "100% of all health nuts die". What a cop out.
I can see it from their point of view though and would never warrant a turbo conversion. With the ricer craze as it is turbos are being strapped unto anything with a piston, often with disasterous results.
__________________
RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 03-04-2008, 08:05 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
turboteener's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 301
I have seen this attitude in a lot of places. It like everyone forgot the spirit of creativity and hot rodding that got us into cars to begin with. Personally I like to do things that "can't be done". Its fun that way. If you want a reliable econobox, buy a Honda. If you want a fast car build something cool and just work through the small issues that come up.
__________________
Brett
Old 03-04-2008, 08:06 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #9 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Boca Raton/Atlanta
Posts: 544
Ben, I need your help. I am the guy buying Rick's set-up and my normal mechanic is asking how the system Rick is offering delivers the air into the intercooler etc. from the SC motor....this is all greek to me, hence the need to get a mechanic involved. Can you help me out? It'd be much appreciated.

Rob
__________________
Rob L.
Currently have too many cars
to properly care for
Old 03-04-2008, 08:13 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #10 (permalink)
Adrenaline Junkie
 
Hayabusa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Mukilteo by the Sea
Posts: 876
Garage
I actually ran with scissors yesterday! AND,,, I wasn't hurt! No cuts! NOTHING!


Don't tell anyone!
Old 03-04-2008, 10:40 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #11 (permalink)
Registered User
 
full quack's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Seattle-ish
Posts: 1,134
Send a message via Yahoo to full quack
Ah come on folks, it all just comes down to internal cylinder pressures. Don't exceed the maximum, and you won't blow it up!
930's run 8:1 comp. & up to 1 bar boost. So if you have 10:1 comp., only run .4 bar or so.
Pressure is pressure, it does not matter how you get it, either thru comp. or turbo boost, or supercharger or nitrous.
Just do some research, find the limit, and don't exceed it! Remember it is just a machine, no black magic or smoke & mirrors.

Thats just my 2 cents worth.
Mark
Old 03-04-2008, 11:22 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #12 (permalink)
Macht Schnell
 
les_garten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: PSL, FL
Posts: 861
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayabusa View Post
I actually ran with scissors yesterday! AND,,, I wasn't hurt! No cuts! NOTHING!


Don't tell anyone!
Uhh Huh! Yeah!!

Let's see ya do it again tomorrow!!

I double Dawg dare ya!!

I triple Dawg dare Ya!!

You must think your mama was stupid when she said, "You'll put your eye out with that"!!

I'll be she told ya not to run with scissors also.
__________________
---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 03-04-2008, 11:38 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #13 (permalink)
Registered User
 
e p slick's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Tucson
Posts: 1,289
Garage
my 2 cents

My experience and observations over a pretty fair number of years is that you would be considerably better off and much happier at the end of the day if you were to back off a notch and figure a way to buy a "real" 930. Save time, money and headaches. Sure the conversion can be done - that is how the Porsche company ended up producing the 911 Turbo (see 930). I have a few conversions under my belt and did enjoy the process. However - Time, money, results and resale value add up to a significant total and the question is: Is it really, truly worth it?

EPS Tucson
__________________
AMG V8 SL55 Mercedes, 993 C2, 86' Carrera 3.6 hot rod, Purple 1998 993 that didn't make the cut, 3 very old 930s, A/Fuel Dragster CH3NO2 (R.I.P.), Blown Alcohol TAD, AA/AA, 360 Maxim wingless, Cummins Turbo Diesel. Amateur Welder, Painter and sculptor sort of. -
Old 03-04-2008, 02:18 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #14 (permalink)
Macht Schnell
 
les_garten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: PSL, FL
Posts: 861
Quote:
Originally Posted by full quack View Post
Ah come on folks, it all just comes down to internal cylinder pressures. Don't exceed the maximum, and you won't blow it up!
930's run 8:1 comp. & up to 1 bar boost. So if you have 10:1 comp., only run .4 bar or so.
Pressure is pressure, it does not matter how you get it, either thru comp. or turbo boost, or supercharger or nitrous.
Just do some research, find the limit, and don't exceed it! Remember it is just a machine, no black magic or smoke & mirrors.

Thats just my 2 cents worth.
Mark
Ahhhh, 930's never came with 8:1. Let's establish that baseline first. How about 6.5:1 and then 7:1. The distributer also compensated for positive pressure in the manifold by retarding the ignition curve. Moral to the story is there are a lot of pitfalls here that Porsche thought abought when they wanted to Homologate the 930 for RACING and then DETUNE it for the street market.

Of course this can be pulled off. It's just with that compression, one bad move and his engine is history and he gets to spend $15,000 or more fixing it on top of what he's doing now. Let's say he forgets to hook up his wastegate control line ONE time. That's it, Toast!!

As my sainted Father said to me many a time, "Of course one must be willing to underwrite the cost of the experiment"

This was usually his way of telling me I was crawling out on a limb.
__________________
---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT

Last edited by les_garten; 03-04-2008 at 05:38 PM..
Old 03-04-2008, 03:01 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #15 (permalink)
Crotchety Old Bastard
 
RarlyL8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Huntsville, AL
Posts: 13,423
Garage
You bought the kit, put it on. If you don't like it or find it's too much fuss take it off and sell it.
Ben will help you get 'er going without scattering parts.
__________________
RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 03-04-2008, 05:13 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #16 (permalink)
Macht Schnell
 
les_garten's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: PSL, FL
Posts: 861
Quote:
Originally Posted by RarlyL8 View Post
You bought the kit, put it on. If you don't like it or find it's too much fuss take it off and sell it.
Ben will help you get 'er going without scattering parts.


"without scattering parts"

The Operative Phrase here!!
__________________
---Les Garten---85 930, Andial IC, GHL Headers, Fabspeed Dual, K-27 HF2, 3.4 JE Full Finned 7.5:1 CR, 964 CAM'd, Carerra 3.2 Manifold Cut/Flipped, Tec3r, Siemans 55#, GSF Fuel Rails, Clewett Crank Trigger, Clewett Cam Trigger,Dual Plugged, ARP Head Studs/Rod Bolts, Clewett Wires.Tial 46mm WG, Tial 50mm BOV, WEVO Shifter,934 Boost Gauge, Wideband EGO Sensor/Gauge, C2T Head Gaskets, '88 MB 300TE,BMW R100RT
Old 03-04-2008, 05:36 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #17 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 4,941
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hayabusa View Post
I actually ran with scissors yesterday! AND,,, I wasn't hurt! No cuts! NOTHING!


Don't tell anyone!
Old 03-04-2008, 06:46 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #18 (permalink)
Certifiable
 
Quicksilver77's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Folsom, CA
Posts: 194
Send a message via Yahoo to Quicksilver77
I feel I have to add a reply here. I have spoken to Richard Danvers a few times, as I was going to purchase a car which he serviced for 12 years. I have never spoken to a mechanic who was more straight forward, upfront and honest. If I lived in Florida I would not hesitate to take my car to him.
He is probably just looking out for your best interest, I am also sure he is worried about the liability of the possible detonation.
I have no affiliation FYI...
Old 03-04-2008, 09:24 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #19 (permalink)
Registered User
 
turboteener's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 301
Quote:
Originally Posted by les_garten View Post
Let's say he forgets to hook up his wastegate control line ONE time. That's it, Toast!!
How do you forget to hook up the wastegate line? You could do the same thing to a regular 930. You can kill anything with ineptitude and carelessness. The engine will not blow up the instant it sees too much boost or a slight bit of detonation especially at less than 10psi.

The biggest difference in a regular turbo designed engine and a NA engine outfitted with a turbo is the window for error. A factory turbo engine will be slightly more forgiving of abuse.
__________________
Brett
Old 03-04-2008, 10:55 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #20 (permalink)
Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

 


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 02:18 PM.


 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page
 

DTO Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.