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Porsche-Poor
 
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Join Date: Feb 2005
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Compulsive, when I say "stayed cool" meant 180-195 range

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Originally Posted by Compulsive View Post
When you say the temps "stayed cool", what kind of #s did you see? Is your engine stock or high HP?

Most modern water cooled cars running high quality oil have no issues with sustained temps in the 230-270F range. Do these old air cooled units not like this temp range?
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1979 911 RS clone hotrod
1983 930 turbo-sold, will be missed
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1980 911 SC Weissach-regrettably sold
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Old 08-18-2008, 08:55 PM
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240 Deg. F is OK on track. Also, a thicker oil will raise temperatures 10-20 deg. F on track.

After 20 laps or so, my track car (watercooled) will top out at 250 deg and stay there. Thinner oil will bring that down to 225 or so. Modern synthetic oil will be fine up to 270 deg F.

So frankly, I don't think you have to cool down the car when it tops out at 240 deg. F.
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Old 08-19-2008, 12:48 AM
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With high running oil temps by just adding more coolers you may be trying to treat the effects but not the cause. I have noticed that on cars with the same oil cooling capacity there is a difference. On cars that have been just modified externally the temps are higher than ones,even with higher HP output, if they were built with larger capacity oil pumps, less restrictive flow systems, and race tolerances, tend to run much cooler. Also a fuel management system that is not up to the engine mods can adversely affect operating temps. A racer I know even has a oil heater so no cold starts and runs oil temps at around 165-170 with 5w30. Claims he gets more hours that way between rebuilds as when they were over 200 and heavier oil. With lower oil temperatures ( less expansion/contraction ) the motor runs in less of a operating temperature range and the internal tolerances can be set with more certainty

Last edited by voitureltd; 08-19-2008 at 08:35 PM..
Old 08-19-2008, 06:38 AM
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240 oil temperature in an oil/air cooled 930 is too hot.
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Old 08-19-2008, 08:36 AM
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I agree that 240 in a air cooled turbo is getting scary. In a watercooled non turbo car the source of the heat build up is from a broader base. In the turbo air cooled cars the heat is generated from areas that the oil is subject to extreme temperatures. So the oil must circulate thru these areas quickly as the heat build up is intense. So the overall temp of the oil is not indicative of the temerature in these areas where the oil is actually subject to the extreme punishment. Remember the turbo timers ( popular with the twin turbo set mid 90s)for use when shut down?
Old 08-22-2008, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
240 Deg. F is OK on track. Also, a thicker oil will raise temperatures 10-20 deg. F on track.
And then...


Quote:
240 oil temperature in an oil/air cooled 930 is too hot.
I love the internet Since my car will not be raced I will not be lapping for more than 20mins so I would be comfortable with 220-230F oil temps.

The big question is where do I buy a front mount oil cooler kit?
Old 08-23-2008, 09:11 AM
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240 is NOT ok by any means, and the thicker oil theory, well...............ok.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 08-23-2008, 10:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Craig 930 RS View Post
240 is NOT ok by any means, and the thicker oil theory, well...............ok.
Without getting too far OT, it has been fairly well established that thicker oil can raise oil temps. I have seen this firsthand in BMW engines. You can spend hours reading here http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/

Can someone suggest a nice front mount oil cooler kit for my 930?
Old 08-23-2008, 10:43 AM
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By that much? And it applies in that amount to a 930?
Not busting your balls, but...

Your kit - which you will have to source parts yourself I suspect - Patrick Motorsports.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 08-23-2008, 12:32 PM
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Cylinder and head temperatures with 240 degree oil...holy cow they are gonna be damn hot.
These are the areas where water cooled turbos have it easy compared to our cars -
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 08-23-2008, 12:35 PM
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Another factor to consider when looking at oil temp is the rod bearings. I would put these at the top of the list of things that catch hell when oil temp goes up...

This is coming from someone who has witnessed several 930 rod bearing failures on hot track days with "elevated" oil temps.

I know there are many variable to consider when evaluating failure and one can't simply blame oil temp. But,
It seems like lower oil temp may have helped in these cases...
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Old 08-23-2008, 03:02 PM
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240* is way to hot. The cooler the better.

I'm at about 200* after 30 minutes with my modded engine.
Old 08-23-2008, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig 930 RS View Post
240 is NOT ok by any means, and the thicker oil theory, well...............ok.
Modern synthetic oil will work perfectly fine at 240 deg. F. Whether it's OK or not for engine itself depends on how much crud is accumulated on cooling fins, ambient air temperature, timing etc. There are limits on how hot heads can get and turbo heads will withstand a bit more heat than n/a ones (up to 993, when all heads were made of same heat-resistant alloy).

And yes, it's a well known fact that higher viscosity oil yields higher temperatures. also had opportunity to test this myself on the track this summer. Oil temp with 10W50 was 266 deg. F and after I changed it to 5W30 oil temp went down to roughly 240 deg. F. Same car, same oilcooler and same track. Ambient temperature was similar as well.
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Old 08-24-2008, 07:09 AM
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OK, have fun running 240 oil temperatures at the track then.
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- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 08-24-2008, 09:06 AM
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This is a nice front spoiler that fits a B&B center mount oil coooler very well
http://www.americaninternationalracing.com/gallerymore.asp?id=259246&page=14&galleryid=26007

I have one on my car and the oil never gets too hot.

High oil and cylinder head temperatures are the reason exhaust valve guides are short lived in 930 engines that are driven hard.
Old 08-24-2008, 09:41 AM
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