Pelican Parts
Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   Pelican Parts Forums > Porsche Forums > 911 / 930 Turbo & Super Charging Forum


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Reply
Registered User
 
Garrison's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Denver
Posts: 729
Garage
930 suspension

OK, got a few bucks coming back from tax return, and am looking at improving the suspension on my 83' 930.

So I am thinking, shocks, then possibly torsion bars.

What sizes do you guys recommend front and rear for our cars? This car will be 85-90% street driven with the other % being on the track for DE's, etc. I have no issues with rattling of teeth when you hit a bump at all, but would like to know what most of you are running and would recommend.

Also, do bigger sway bars, or through body sway help on these cars just like the SC's and Carreras?

Of course this will include putting the car at least to Euro ride height, and a alignment and balance.....

Any suggestions would be great. Thanks.

__________________
1996 Porsche 911
2013 BMW 335xi - Wifes car
2007 4Runner - 4x4 for Colorado snow
Past: 1988 Venetian Blue 911 Targa, 1983 Black 930, 1984 Black 911 Coupe
Old 02-13-2009, 03:56 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #1 (permalink)
Porsche-Poor
 
bcoats's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Seattle, WA
Posts: 463
Garage
Garrison - cool car, I have the same year as well. I did Bilstein sport shocks all around, 22/28 tubular torsion bars, front strut brace and lowered slightly under euro ride height and had it corner balanced, etc. car is rock solid at track events and not too harsh at all on the street, I'm sure there will be many more variations from others but that's what I did and no complaints at all
__________________
1979 911 RS clone hotrod
1983 930 turbo-sold, will be missed
1992 964 C2 Coupe-regrettably sold
1980 911 SC Weissach-regrettably sold
1975 911S-sold but not forgotten
Old 02-13-2009, 06:56 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Garrison's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Denver
Posts: 729
Garage
22/28 seems to be a common way to go in the SC's and such. Just figured in the 930's people would be going with 30 or 31 in the rear. Have thought about full coil over, but for mostly street driving it doesn't seem worth the $$$$$.
__________________
1996 Porsche 911
2013 BMW 335xi - Wifes car
2007 4Runner - 4x4 for Colorado snow
Past: 1988 Venetian Blue 911 Targa, 1983 Black 930, 1984 Black 911 Coupe
Old 02-13-2009, 07:48 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Posts: 170
I run 22/31 Elephant hollow + Bilstein sports, 22 sways front and rear. Perfectly balanced and for me a perfect street/track combo. Runs surprisingly smooth on the street.
Old 02-14-2009, 06:22 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #4 (permalink)
Registered
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,079
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrison View Post
22/28 seems to be a common way to go in the SC's and such. Just figured in the 930's people would be going with 30 or 31 in the rear. Have thought about full coil over, but for mostly street driving it doesn't seem worth the $$$$$.
I have 23mm and 30mm, which is great until you hit a deep pothole and then it is really jarring, but part of that is that Bilstein sports have inferior dampening to the fox shocks or motons or JRZ. On big hits, the bilstein is not able to release pressure because it does not have a relief valve like the more expensive shocks.

If you really want to start right than you need bilsteins custom valved by somebody like Steve at Rennsportsystems.com to your car's weight and torsion bar rate (it is not much more expensive because they sell you the shock at the same time and just fiddle with it) or the next step up is Fox Shocks by smart racing, which cut about two seconds a lap off of Bilsteins. Excellence magazine did a comparison and the results are at the smart racing website. Two seconds a lap is the equivalent of 75 extra horsepower in their comparison, massive difference from shocks alone.

Another advantage of custom bilsteins is that they sell them to you with lowered front spindles that will let you lower your car very low. The fancy shocks already have this feature.

Smart racing makes a adjustable ERP bump steer kit that will keep your bump steering straight if you go really low in ride height. Having proper bump steer is the most important overlooked thing in lowering a 930.

Sway bars make your ride choppy if you overdo it. You are better off getting your stiffness from your torsion bars and shocks and use the anti-roll bars only if you want to tune in some extra over/understeer. You can add sway bars later to fine tune what you do initially if it needs something extra.

Long story short, your shocks are very important and it does not cost much more to get them custom valved from day one to your car's weight and torsion bar rates.
Old 02-14-2009, 06:22 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #5 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Ponca City OK.
Posts: 283
930 stuff

I have a few items for sale you may be interested in?
Race car
Fox gas coilovers F/S
and maybe..
Rear...
ERP 935 rear spring plates...

Smart racing anti roll bar kit...

Erp monoballs rear control arms ...

Thanks Randy
Old 02-14-2009, 08:38 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #6 (permalink)
 
Me like track days
 
Craig 930 RS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Kirkland, WA
Posts: 10,205
22/28 IMO is not nearly enough out back - the "standard" for a 911SC is 22/*29* and you definitely want to go larger out back with a 930.
In fact, it's said it is very difficult to get *enough* spring rate in the back of a 930 -

For a combo setup like yours, I'd do 23/31. FWIW, my car has 23/33 but it's a street legal track 930.
~~~~~~~~~~~~
If I were spending your money - and I don't know how much you'll be getting back as part of the "930 aftermarket stimulus package" :

1) Raised spindles up front - when the car is lowered you still retain full suspension travel.
2) 23/31 torsions
3) Polybronze bushings to replace the squished-out worn-out OEM bushings you have
4) Bilstein HD front and Sport rear shcoks
__________________
- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 02-14-2009, 09:29 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #7 (permalink)
Registered
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,079
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lensart View Post
I have a few items for sale you may be interested in?
Race car
Fox gas coilovers F/S
and maybe..
Rear...
ERP 935 rear spring plates...

Smart racing anti roll bar kit...

Erp monoballs rear control arms ...

Thanks Randy
I checked out all this guys stuff and none of it runs without monoballs and coil overs. Not a single item is applicable to your situation, Garrison, including the shocks because his cost more used than the ones smart racing sells brand new for a non-monoball/non coilover suspension.
Old 02-14-2009, 10:59 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Garrison's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Denver
Posts: 729
Garage
Craig, 23/33's.... that is a big difference front to rear. I was under the thought that you wanted to stay within a certain range front to rear.

I think going 23/31 is about right for what I want. Good to hear that sways are not something I will need to do upfront...more down the road if needed.

As for the Fox Shocks that were recommended, I have heard of them but always thought that Koni's or Bilsteins were the way to go in Porsches. I will check them out and see if the extra cost is worth it.
__________________
1996 Porsche 911
2013 BMW 335xi - Wifes car
2007 4Runner - 4x4 for Colorado snow
Past: 1988 Venetian Blue 911 Targa, 1983 Black 930, 1984 Black 911 Coupe
Old 02-14-2009, 11:49 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #9 (permalink)
OFF THE BOOST PIPE NOW...
 
A930Rocket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Mount Pleasant, South Carolina
Posts: 8,416
Am I wrong in thinking that once you go over 23/30 you are going to hollow bars? What size bar do you have to go with in order to have an effective rate higher than the largest solid bar?

This was my thought when I did my suspension years ago with 23/30 IIRC.
Old 02-14-2009, 04:09 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #10 (permalink)
Registered
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,079
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrison View Post
Craig, 23/33's.... that is a big difference front to rear. I was under the thought that you wanted to stay within a certain range front to rear.

I think going 23/31 is about right for what I want. Good to hear that sways are not something I will need to do upfront...more down the road if needed.

As for the Fox Shocks that were recommended, I have heard of them but always thought that Koni's or Bilsteins were the way to go in Porsches. I will check them out and see if the extra cost is worth it.
Re-valved Bilsteins are pretty good for the street and cost about the same as regular Bilsteins.

Fox Shocks will make a difference over bad pavement. They are good for track days because they are adjustable. I am not sure they are needed in regular street use however.
Old 02-14-2009, 04:24 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #11 (permalink)
Registered
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,079
Quote:
Originally Posted by A930Rocket View Post
Am I wrong in thinking that once you go over 23/30 you are going to hollow bars? What size bar do you have to go with in order to have an effective rate higher than the largest solid bar?

This was my thought when I did my suspension years ago with 23/30 IIRC.
31mm might be the cut off, not positive, but when you are talking 33mm you are definitely hollow.
Old 02-14-2009, 04:26 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #12 (permalink)
Registered
 
gumba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 4,248
I run adjustable koni fronts and adjustable Wevo rears on my vw crewcab. I notice the difference with a 2 click adjustment.
If your on a budget and want to keep it simple, I would go with the S/R f 10 street set up. if you want front adjustable you have a couple of choices. Have Koni convert your Bilstein struts to an adjustable wet shock for around $1500, or the S/R Fox shocks.
I installed the Fox shocks on the front of our race car but haven't tried them yet. The only draw back with any shock with remote cannisters is mounting the cannisters. You also will need to check the nitrogen pressure and have access to a nitrogen bottle and gauge.
__________________
Harold
'79 930/DP935
'68 VW 3.3 Turbo Crewcab
Old 02-14-2009, 06:22 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #13 (permalink)
OFF THE BOOST PIPE NOW...
 
A930Rocket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Mount Pleasant, South Carolina
Posts: 8,416
i checked our host and its 30 mm. my thinking is your going to need 33 mm or so hollow to get the same as 30 mm solid. Correct me if I'm wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DDDD View Post
31mm might be the cut off, not positive, but when you are talking 33mm you are definitely hollow.
Old 02-14-2009, 06:28 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #14 (permalink)
Me like track days
 
Craig 930 RS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Kirkland, WA
Posts: 10,205
It's right *in* range.
Rears increase proprotionately / at a higher ratio to fronts. Also, a slightly higher rate for the rear of a 930 is virtually a must - thus the helper springs many are now using.

The Rebel racing coilover is a setup I'd be looking if I were shopping in 2009 -
__________________
- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 02-14-2009, 08:59 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #15 (permalink)
Registered
 
Jeff Alton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Langley,B.C.
Posts: 10,576
Hollow and solid bars are sold as the same mm number even thought the diameter is different.

A 23mm solid bar is 23mm in diameter and has "X" spring rate. At 23mm hollow bar is larger in diameter but retains the "X" spring rate. The OD increased on the hollow bar to compensate for the material that has been drilled out so that it can retain the same spring rate as the solid bar....

Cheers
__________________
Turn3 Autosport- Full Service and Race Prep
jeff@turn3autosport.com
997 S 4.0, Boxster 2.7 Race Car, Cayman S 3.8, 958 Cayenne TT, VW GTI 2.1 TSI, Mini Cooper S JCW, Cannondale Supersix EVO SRAM RED E-tap, Cannondale Slice SRAM RED E-tap, Giant Roam Hardtail- to ride with the wife.
Old 02-14-2009, 09:05 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #16 (permalink)
Forced Induction Junkie
 
WERK I's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 3,316
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig 930 RS View Post
.................................................. ...........
3) Polybronze bushings to replace the squished-out worn-out OEM bushings you have
+1 Replace every suspension bushing in these cars. OEM-like or polybronze or whatever. Just replace 'em.
__________________
Dave
'85 930 Factory Special Wishes Flachbau
Werk I Zuffenhausen 3.3l/330BHP Engine with Sonderwunsch Cams, FabSpeed Headers, Kokeln IC, Twin Plugged Electromotive Crankfire, Tial Wastegate(0.8 Bar), K27 Hybrid Turbo, Ruf Twin-tip Muffler, Fikse FM-5's 8&10x17, 8:41 R&P
Old 02-15-2009, 06:21 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #17 (permalink)
Infidel
 
JBL930's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 1,172
If you are fitting coil overs why would you keep the torsion bars? I'm a bit green on the suspension side of things and i'm in the middle of fitting coil overs, sway bars etc. I've got all the Rebel Racing stuff, ordered through Imagine Auto, I was told i could pull the torsion bars and save weight
__________________
Jonathan.
87 930, 993 turbo engine, RS Tuning 520PS/515lbf-ft, Arrow Rods, ARP hardware, Solid lifters, G50-50, RS Flywheel, 890nm Sachs clutch, RSR coil overs all round, 993 C4 calipers front, 930 fronts on the rear, Ruf Speedlines.....
Old 540 BMW, XB12S Modified, for being a total hooligan
Old 02-15-2009, 03:17 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #18 (permalink)
 
Me like track days
 
Craig 930 RS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Kirkland, WA
Posts: 10,205
Torsions do a fine job - and coilovers only in the rear have full pressure on the shock towers.
__________________
- Craig 3.4L, SC heads, 964 cams, B&B headers, K27 HF ZC turbo, Ruf IC. WUR & RPM switch, IA fuel head, Zork, G50/50 5 speed. 438 RWHP / 413 RWTQ -
"930 is the wild slut you sleep with who tries to kill you every time you "get it on" - Quote by Gabe
Movie: 930 on the dyno
Old 02-15-2009, 03:29 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #19 (permalink)
Registered
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Back in B'ham, AL
Posts: 3,451
I'm very happy with:
22mm up front and 29mm on back TBs
22mm fron and rear sway bars
Adjust red Konis all around
Polybronze bushings

Old 02-15-2009, 03:42 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #20 (permalink)
Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

 


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 12:09 PM.


 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2020 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page
 

DTO Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.