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Wo ist die Rennstrecke?
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmatera View Post
Dyno posts do have their place but because of the differences in dynos (output) and physical locations on this planet you have to take everybodies results with a grain of salt. The best representation of a vehicles power is measuring speed over a distance vs. vehicle weight.

[snip]
Completely agree.

I would rather do a rolling start from 2nd gear (4sp) at 1500 rpm and see who gets to 6500 rpm first. As I said in the past, I am more interested in torque than big HP numbers. Ideally, both.
Old 01-18-2010, 06:36 PM
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Don, do you have any acceleration data?
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Jonathan.
87 930, 993 turbo engine, RS Tuning 520PS/515lbf-ft, Arrow Rods, ARP hardware, Solid lifters, G50-50, RS Flywheel, 890nm Sachs clutch, RSR coil overs all round, 993 C4 calipers front, 930 fronts on the rear, Ruf Speedlines.....
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Old 01-19-2010, 06:28 AM
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Greetings:

JBL---How is your car running these days......I know u did tons of work!!$$$$$

congrats!

P.S.-- I would like to see a dyno/60-130mph combined log...

Walt
Old 01-19-2010, 06:38 AM
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My 1976 none IC, 315 Bhp, 389 Nm:

YouTube - JDAMM_930

Best Regards
Jesper
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1976 930 "The Phantom" RarlyL8

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Old 01-19-2010, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wjfk32 View Post
Greetings:

JBL---How is your car running these days......I know u did tons of work!!$$$$$

congrats!

P.S.-- I would like to see a dyno/60-130mph combined log...

Walt
I only have the dyno sheet from before the engine rebuild, which was a smidgen over 500fwbhp with around 530lbft, and it's best 60-130mph was a little over 7.5 seconds, but regularly did it in under 8 seconds. I did go to a dyno after the rebuild but the engine developed a misfire on the way there and was useless on the rollers, the coil was shot and as soon as it came on boost it was blowing the spark out.
Since then i've had a new coil fitted and it posted just under 7.5 seconds 60-130 so it's obviously a little better than before.
As Don mentions, it's all about torque really, and mine is developing 500lbft around 3700rpm, and is still developing 400lbft at 6600rpm, which i guess is why i'm getting quite good acceleration numbers.

I've only done about 300 miles since the rebuild and the car is back in the garage now with the engine out again as they are fitting the new gearbox, cutting the torsion tube out, fitting the peddle cluster and 5 speed gear linkages and slave and master cylinders etc out of the 89 turbo that the gearbox came out of.... my engine has been in and out of my car more times than anyone i know

It's all worth it though....right?
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87 930, 993 turbo engine, RS Tuning 520PS/515lbf-ft, Arrow Rods, ARP hardware, Solid lifters, G50-50, RS Flywheel, 890nm Sachs clutch, RSR coil overs all round, 993 C4 calipers front, 930 fronts on the rear, Ruf Speedlines.....
Old 540 BMW, XB12S Modified, for being a total hooligan
Old 01-19-2010, 10:59 AM
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JESUS!!!! WELL DONE JOHNATHAN.

I get nuts just trying to tune my car with the CO'S and plugs...........boring...

But you-have your hands full...Great to hear its 99% there.....
Question...What kind of coil r using??? why not twin plug...???

Sounds great so far!

thnnxs

Walt

OH000-----YESSSSSSSSSSS IIIITTTTTTTTTTTTSSSSSSSSSS WWWOOOOOOORRTHHH IIIITTTTT!!!!!!!!!
Old 01-19-2010, 12:14 PM
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Hey I want to play.....993 VRAM Turbo conversion. 6PSI boost, Stock compression, 100 oct fuel.

I figured this could be helpful showing a high compression low boost power curve. I had a 993tt running 20PSI before this one. This car is much more fun to drive.

This is the before dyno. We are changing the rods, cams (to DC21) and head work. Going to run 10 PSI of boost. I expect close to 500WHP at that boost level with similar power curve.



Last edited by K24madness; 01-19-2010 at 04:01 PM..
Old 01-19-2010, 03:39 PM
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here are my whimpy dyno sheets... . must make more boost

Old 01-19-2010, 03:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBL930 View Post
I did go to a dyno after the rebuild but the engine developed a misfire on the way there and was useless on the rollers, the coil was shot and as soon as it came on boost it was blowing the spark out.

It's all worth it though....right?
I fought that problem when I hit the 600hp mark. The solution was a CDI ignition and the right plugs with a 25-27 thousands gap.

The more air/fuel you pack into the cylinder the more resistance there is to driving the spark across the plug gap. Depending on the strength of your coil the gap may need to be as little as 17-19 thousands. I bet you will find that is the source of the problem.
Old 01-19-2010, 05:56 PM
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Wo ist die Rennstrecke?
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBL930 View Post
Don, do you have any acceleration data?
When I get the motor back together, I'll do an accel test. I like this better than a dyno for proving power, but the dyno is one of the best ways to lay a baseline from which to tune.
Old 01-19-2010, 06:20 PM
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Think you've all seen my 3 Dyno Sheets before.

I'll post up on here once
i) put my BOV back together with new rubber-O rings / spring.
ii) get my reconditioned Distributor back and reattach it.
iii) get UTCIS mapped

....Soooo don't hold your breath!
Old 01-21-2010, 04:59 AM
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well, i have an update of sorts. Not more dyno figures but I did go back to the 1/4 mile track.

on 15psi with 20* total timing I ran 12.96 @ 113 mph 10.9 a/f
up from a 13.27 @ 111 on 13psi 11.6 a/f

question: do you guys that tune on a dyno see the same a/f on the street? So far that has not been the case for me. I had to pull fuel out to get my a/f in the 10.9/11.0 at WOT going down the track compared to the dyno runs. This further reinforces why i do not like dynos with turbo cars. With all the datalogging devices available I see no better tuning tool than a flat straight stretch of road with no cops on it. But then i see that as a good thing while tuning or not
Old 01-21-2010, 08:23 AM
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I used both and do not recall much difference but we used a load dyno for tuning. I used 4th gear on my G50/50. Gear choice can make some difference if it blows through the run to fast or to slow.

Air temp makes a difference.

Nothing beats what we have now.

If one is going to use acceleration data to rolling start in a gear is going to take some of the technique out of it. 930's are quite sensitive to launch technique.

Any testing is better than the butt-dyno.
Old 01-21-2010, 08:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmatera View Post
here are my whimpy dyno sheets... . must make more boost
Are those calculated rear wheel or flywheel HP?

Can you monitor your pressure and temp drop through your custom intercooler?

On a low restriction EFI your K27-7200 should be good for up to around 400-425fwhp.

I have seen 430rwhp with CIS through stock intake ports but with a honed 930 manfold and the blocks as a transition.

SC cams would move the TQ to a higher rpm for more HP. If you can make 280# at 61500rpm that would bump you to about 330hp.
Old 01-21-2010, 09:09 AM
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'84 ROW
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Billy Boat headers/muffler
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K27

Was around 89F during test, measured on a Mustang MD-500 (reads about 20% lower than a 248C)



Cut the test short once the AFR's starting to point towards lean..
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Last edited by B18CXr; 01-22-2010 at 02:40 PM..
Old 01-21-2010, 12:25 PM
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Wo ist die Rennstrecke?
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmatera View Post
well, i have an update of sorts. Not more dyno figures but I did go back to the 1/4 mile track.

on 15psi with 20* total timing I ran 12.96 @ 113 mph 10.9 a/f
up from a 13.27 @ 111 on 13psi 11.6 a/f

question: do you guys that tune on a dyno see the same a/f on the street? So far that has not been the case for me. I had to pull fuel out to get my a/f in the 10.9/11.0 at WOT going down the track compared to the dyno runs. This further reinforces why i do not like dynos with turbo cars. With all the datalogging devices available I see no better tuning tool than a flat straight stretch of road with no cops on it. But then i see that as a good thing while tuning or not
If the temps and altitude are the same, then yes I see the same AFR on dyno and street. But then again, I do not use a dynojunk, sorry, dynojet dyno - they do not put a load on the engine so its impossible to tune most of the important fuel cells simulating real world driving. Being one cell off with fuel can mess with the AFR when the ECU interpolates between the two. You must find a dyno that applies a load for any given RPM and manifold pressure/throttle position/or whatever your ECU uses as the X or Y axis. Using a proper dyno also allows you set one of the most important items - total timing. Without a dyno, you are shooting in the dark trying to get peak torque, and without managing the torque, you're leaving money on the table.
Old 01-21-2010, 04:51 PM
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Jack,

Good stuff!

It is great to see someone actually monitor boost with there dyno run.

A lot of dyno's can do this. It is more if the owner has bought the sensor and or just asking ahead of time and kind of pushing for it.
Old 01-22-2010, 08:46 AM
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I don't see the point in a dyno run that Doesn't show boost, how on earth are you supposed to check you're fuel curve if you can't plot it against boost? Seams pretty pointless to me...
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87 930, 993 turbo engine, RS Tuning 520PS/515lbf-ft, Arrow Rods, ARP hardware, Solid lifters, G50-50, RS Flywheel, 890nm Sachs clutch, RSR coil overs all round, 993 C4 calipers front, 930 fronts on the rear, Ruf Speedlines.....
Old 540 BMW, XB12S Modified, for being a total hooligan
Old 01-22-2010, 09:57 AM
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'87 USA
80K
Fabspeed exhaust
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Customer wanted to continue to redline even with the AFR's the way they were heading...
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The Original Hatchcrap
2002 East Coast Honda Challenge H1 Champion
'92 CX right hand shift, 1.8L 440bhp
'93 SI left hand shift, 1.6L 120bhp

Last edited by B18CXr; 01-22-2010 at 02:40 PM..
Old 01-22-2010, 11:44 AM
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10.76@139-1/4 mile
0-1 mile 193MPH
Old 01-22-2010, 12:51 PM
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