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Tilikum Turbo's Avatar
 
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12-14 MPG for a 3.3L Turbo

Is that about right for a 3.3L Turbo(1986 US version)?

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1983 911 3.3L Turbo(YES, I know the turbo badge is on the right...had to be different!)
1996 Toyota Corolla(der 'clapper')
Old 09-14-2010, 10:19 AM
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Crotchety Old Bastard
 
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With a worn out WUR, yes. With an adjustable WUR 21-23mpg.
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RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
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Old 09-14-2010, 10:28 AM
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I'm running too fat and I get 16-17.
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Scott - 1987 930: 3.45L Supertec engine w/GT3 crank, California Motor Sports upgraded 930 trans, modified suspension, Zuffenhaus 9's and 11's, black on black..."The Black (Financial) Hole"
Old 09-14-2010, 10:39 AM
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Got 22+ mpg on my last long run thanks to high 14s AFR in cruise. Could probably do even better on the highway if I leaned it out a little more, but that would mess up my other AFRs.

Short trips around town on and off boost its a different story; 13 -14 mpg is normal.
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1982 930, K27-7200, Ruf wheels, Leask WUR, Tial WG, WEGO IV AFR, RarlyL8 headers & single out muffler, TK I/C
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Old 09-14-2010, 11:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RarlyL8 View Post
With a worn out WUR, yes. With an adjustable WUR 21-23mpg.
How can you say that without knowing his driving conditions/habits? Or are you saying that a properly tuned 930 should be getting over 20 mpg, regardless of the heaviness of the driver's right foot?

FWIW, I get that 14-16 mpg in mixed street driving, but about 20 mpg on the highway.
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Old 09-14-2010, 12:18 PM
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4th gear 70mph steady cruise. Yes a properly tuned stock geared CIS 930 should get 21-23mpg on the highway and ~15mpg in town. Boost is not figured in as you don't do that if you want good mileage. These figures are good for power levels from stock to 400WHP. I don't have any data above that point.
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RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 09-14-2010, 01:00 PM
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If i converted miles to km and gallons to liters correctly i got about 8 MPG on a mixed 300km roudtrip this summer. About 2 liters on every 10 km.

It has a few mods though but i thought that was not very good. Costs to have a smile on my face.
Old 09-14-2010, 01:36 PM
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Damn, I'm getting 11-12.
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Old 09-14-2010, 02:15 PM
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I get 20-something just mellow cruising (not boosting). For those of you that are sucking big wind in that regard, well....you're just running a lot richer than you need to be. 14.0-14.2 AFR at cruise/14.4'ish at idle is where I've settled at (I used to run stoichiometric 14.7, but found she runs better a bit richer than that).
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Mark H. 1987 930, GP White, Wevo shifter, Borla exhaust, stock everything else. The result of a massive Pelicanite good will fire recovery effort. Truely an open book, ready for the slippery slopes to modification.
Old 09-14-2010, 02:27 PM
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Mark, you are running open loop? I'm still trying to find the sweet spot, I've got my idle at 13.9 now. Cruise are around 14.0ish, On boost is well...rich. I have no idea what the mpg is! Can't keep my foot out of the boost since I installed Brian's headers!!!
Old 09-15-2010, 07:57 AM
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Mid 13's at idle is fine as that translates to ~3% CO. Cruise is where you pick up the mileage of course and mid-14's seem to work best. Boost is like 5-6 mpg in the high 11's:1 so that is probably what you are getting! I find myself driving the car at higher RPM's to hear that tuned song, really sounds cool.
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RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 09-15-2010, 08:10 AM
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I think it depends on the parameters, individual cars, modifications, enviormental conditions that be, amongest other things. Tuning as well.

So is the issue that you want better fuel econ?
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Old 09-15-2010, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwarzeritter View Post
I think it depends on the parameters, individual cars, modifications, enviormental conditions that be, amongest other things. Tuning as well.

So is the issue that you want better fuel econ?
The real issue is waste...even if someone gave me a 50,000 gallon rig in my backyard for free with 100 octane fuel, I still would be concerned with MPG. Engineers can never leave well enough alone when it comes to efficiency.

My car is also completely gutted of all A/C stuff from stern to stern, rear seats, spare tire, radio/electric antenna, and soon to go will be the fog-lights(which basically are useless in a semi-desert), and some lightweight seats.

I'll keep at it!
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1983 911 3.3L Turbo(YES, I know the turbo badge is on the right...had to be different!)
1996 Toyota Corolla(der 'clapper')
Old 09-15-2010, 02:04 PM
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What about some pictures of the car?
Old 09-15-2010, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miguel Antonett View Post
What about some pictures of the car?




Here's a few...
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Old 09-15-2010, 08:39 PM
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10 mpg

My 1987 turbocab with 84k miles appears basically stock with the exception of a 1 bar spring and a RUF muffler and generally get about 10 mpg average around town with somewhat of a lead foot. Thanks for the tip regarding the WUR. I do need to purchase a decent air/fuel gauge, any ideas?

thanks,
John G
Old 09-16-2010, 08:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by e170drvr View Post
Mark, you are running open loop? I'm still trying to find the sweet spot, I've got my idle at 13.9 now. Cruise are around 14.0ish, On boost is well...rich. I have no idea what the mpg is! Can't keep my foot out of the boost since I installed Brian's headers!!!
Yep, open loop. One of the first things I did was to unplug the O2 sensor and tune the engine around it.
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Old 09-16-2010, 09:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 930cabman View Post
My 1987 turbocab with 84k miles appears basically stock with the exception of a 1 bar spring and a RUF muffler and generally get about 10 mpg average around town with somewhat of a lead foot. Thanks for the tip regarding the WUR. I do need to purchase a decent air/fuel gauge, any ideas?

thanks,
John G
Holy cripes...and I thought I was getting low MPG!

That RUF muffler...is that with or without a CAT?

And is it signficantly louder than stock?
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1983 911 3.3L Turbo(YES, I know the turbo badge is on the right...had to be different!)
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Old 09-16-2010, 11:55 AM
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I suspect the best opportunity for improvement is not on the fuel side!

However, a good working lambda system with the AFR's / CO adjusted to a working range that the lambda can adjust around should keep the AFR's near 14.7 at cruse which would be a good place to start in search of better MPG.

To improve on this look to the ignition for the best gain in MPG!

Most US 911's do not have anywhere enough timing advance at cruse. Usually it is something like 25 deg total advance by about 2500 to 3000rpm. In many cases we are not even going to see our total advance on the freeway at legal cruse speed to run efficiently.

Get total advance to around 33 deg at lite cruse and there will be a measurable improvement. The motor should also run cooler.

A low restriction exhaust for less pumping loss and stock light weight wheels with the right tires for lower rolling resistance can also help.


Last edited by 911st; 09-18-2010 at 10:52 AM.. Reason: spelling
Old 09-18-2010, 07:29 AM
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Crotchety Old Bastard
 
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EFI 930's with engine management control of ignition typically don't do much better than low to mid 20's mpg from what I have seen. I think Don gets 28mpg with his which is exceptional. That is off-topic though as stock equipment is CIS with a distributor.
There are gains to be made on the ignition side but it is diminishing returns after you repair or replace the rich worn out WUR's that are on a lot of cars. Going from low to mid-teens to low 20's mpg is pretty huge for just replacing one component.

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RarlyL8 Motorsports / M&K Exhaust - 911/930 Exhaust Systems, Turbos, TiAL, CIS Mods/Rebuilds
'78 911SC Widebody, 930 engine, 915 Tranny, K27, SC Cams, RL8 Headers & GT3 Muffler. 350whp @ 0.75bar
Brian B. (256)536-9977 Service@MKExhaust Brian@RarlyL8
Old 09-18-2010, 09:09 AM
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