Pelican Parts
Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   Pelican Parts Forums > Porsche Forums > 911 / 930 Turbo & Super Charging Forum


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Reply
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Auburn,In. U.S.A.
Posts: 2,449
Jesper,

You might consider asking around your area and see if any of the shops there have an old Sun distributor machine. They can spin your distributor and tell you if every thing is functioning properly and also tell you what the timing curve is. I sent mine out to Jerry Woods and he cleaned, shimmed, and ran mine for me. If I remember correctly he charged me like $100. Well worth it to know it is functioning correctly and what the timing curve was set at.

Cole
__________________
Cole - 80 930 "The Old Sled"
Mods: TurboKraft Custom IC, 934 Headers, GSX 61, Zork, Port Work, SC Cams, Air Mod Fuel Dist Relocated, Water Meth Injection, BL WUR, MSD 6530, Greddy EBC, Synapse Bov, Short 2nd & 3rd with 8:37 R&P, Wevo Shifter, Coupling, and Mounts, MTX-L SSI-4, Big Brakes, Rebel Coilovers, Bilstein Sports.

Last edited by cole930; 07-24-2011 at 03:27 AM..
Old 05-15-2011, 01:51 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #21 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
Cole, I just started reading (for the second time ) "TheUltimate 930 Distributor, advance, retard, timing, Turbo lag, MSD, mod, thread."

Though most of it is far more advanced than what I am looking at right now. I remember you mentioning Jerry Woods and Smart Racing.

If I could find a shop near by, I'd def. do it.

Right now I need some advice on what I am supposed to see with my timing light when I am cranking the car.
Where should the "Z" mark be at 250RPM?
__________________
Jesper
Carrera 3.0 1975
930 1978 OEM Matte Schwartz, ANDIAL IC, BL WUR, SC cams. LMA-3 w. XD-16 and CP transducer
www.stauningwhisky.dk
Old 05-15-2011, 02:48 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #22 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Auburn,In. U.S.A.
Posts: 2,449
Jesper,

Your not really going to be able to tell anything with the timing light using just the starter.

I would suggest you pull the plugs on #1 and #4 cylinders and check the crank Z1 mark relationship to the case split with #1 as it comes to TDC on the compression stroke and then do the same 360* later for #4. This will give you a indication if you have a cam timing issue.

Put a hose into #1 head and over the plug hole and put your thumb on the end of the hose. As you rotate the crank pulley clockwise you will feel pressure against your thumb when #1 starts coming to TDC on the compression stroke. As soon as you feel the pressure build on your thumb stop and look at where the Z1 mark is in relationship to the case split. You may be a little off before or after but it should be relatively close.

I DON'T KNOW HOW FAILURE YOU ARE WITH IGNITION AND CAM TIMING SO I'm ADDING THIS POST I DID. IT MAY BE OF HELP TO YOU AS FAR AS UNDERSTANDING TIMING IS CONCERNED.


Cam Timing:


Crankshaft to Camshaft Relationship:

Always rotate the crank in a clockwise direction. All ignition and cam timing operations will reference Z1. Z1 is the designation used for the position of the number one piston in relation to the rotation of the crankshaft. Z1 is stamped and marked on the face of the crankshaft pulley. There is also a corresponding marking (just above the crankshaft pulley) located on the bottom edge of the fan housing and directly in line with the case split where the right and left engine case halves come together. If the Z1 mark on the crank pulley is directly aligned with the case split or fan housing marking it indicates that the No.1 piston is at the very top of its stroke (TDC or Top Dead Center). This gives us an accurate and consistent reference point for timing and assembly of any engine components referenced off crankshaft rotation.

The Z1 mark alignment with the case split indicates piston No.1 is at Top Dead Center. To complete one full 4 stroke combustion cycle the crankshaft must be rotated clockwise 2 complete revolutions or a total of 720*. If you start at Z1 (Top Dead Center) and rotate the crankshaft clockwise 360* back to Z1 you have completed the first 360* of the 720* combustion cycle. Then, again, rotating clockwise from Z1 (Top Dead Center) another 360* back to Z1 (Top Dead Center) we have completed the 720* combustion cycle and the Z1 mark is aligned with the case split, for the second time, indicating piston No.1 is at Top Dead Center again. As demonstrated there are two distinctly different positions in that 720* combustion cycle where the Z1 marking on the crank pulley will be directly aligned with the split in the engine case. One Z1 (TDC) position is at the end of the compression stroke or (TDC compression point) this is also the point where the ignition is timed and the distributor is installed. The second Z1 (TDC) position is 360* later at the end of the exhaust stroke/start of the intake stroke or (TDC the crossover point) this is the point where cam timing is set.


Setting Up for Cam Timing:

To understand the set up sequence and timing cams you must first understand that this entire process is nothing other than connecting the crankshaft to the camshafts. The crankshaft will turn as much as you want and it does not care where itís at and the cam shafts will do the same because they are not connected to the crankshaft in any way until you insert two little retaining pins through the chain sprockets and into the cam sprockets. Once those two retaining pins are in, the crankshaft drives the camshafts through the intermediate shaft, chains, and sprockets. Your task is to connect the crankshaft to the camshafts by inserting the retaining pins in the correct orientation so the valves open and close in correct unison with the rotation of the crankshaft, thatís cam timing.
In order to connect the crankshaft to the camshafts in the correct orientation there has to be some reference to use as a starting point to position the crankshaft and camshafts correctly before inserting the retaining pins. For the crankshaft we have a known reference it is Z1 TDC. For the camshafts we use the cam markings on the snout of the camshafts. For most Porsche cams you will see a punch point or dot and a SC or a 930 stamping.
Starting at No.1 cylinder (left bank first cylinder on the crank pulley end of the engine) Turn the crankshaft clockwise to the Z1 TDC (crankshaft reference point) and turn both camshafts, using a 17mm open end wrench on the flats of the cam snout, so the dot/stamping/930 marks are straight up (camshafts reference point). Insert retaining pins into each camshaft sprocket in whichever hole will allow insertion. On No. 1 install the large cam washer and nut and snug the nut. Using vice grips or hand clamp, securely clamp idler arm to the case to apply firm tension on the chain. Now adjust No.1 intake valve to .1mm /.0039 in. spec. After the valve lash is set install your Z block on the valve cover stud just above the No.1 intake valve. Insert the dial gage into the Z block and pre load the dial gage about 1 inch. And then secure it with the stem resting on the outer edge of the intake valve retainer. Rotate the outer rim of the dial indicator face to zero, your good to go.


Recheck everything:

Crankshaft is set at Z1TDC, make sure sprockets, chains, chain ramps, and idlers are installed correctly. Chain tensioners removed, cam dot/930 stamp pointing up, sprocket retaining pins inserted, cam washer, bolts and/or nuts installed and snugged, and idlers clamped. No.1 valve lash adjusted to .1mm /.0039 in. Z block and dial indicator positioned, secured, preloaded, and dial set to zero. Write down your particular cam spec range, do it in both millimeters and inches and keep it in your work area for quick reference.


Ok Time to Get Er Done !!!!

With your recheck done your starting point is Left side No. 1 camshaft ( youíve just finished setting the No.1 cylinder valve lash, the markings/ dots on the camshafts are pointing up, your dial indicator is loaded on No.1 intake valve spring retainer and the indicator dial is set at zero, and the crankshaft is sitting at Z1 TDC; this is the compression point for No.1, you should be able to reach up and very slightly move the intake rocker arm on No.1 up and down this is telling you are at the compression point and both No.1 intake and exhaust valves are closed so you are feeling the valve lash you adjusted between the rocker arm and the end of the intake valve and there is no load on the valve stem. ) Now slowly start rotating the crankshaft 360* clockwise around to Z1 TDC again. Just as you start coming up on Z1 TDC again the intake valve will be starting to open at about 30 or 40 degrees before you reach Z1 TDC and you will see the dial on the indicator moving. Watch the dial indicator and the upcoming Z1, when you about to reach Z1 stop just short of Z1. Now bump the wrench with the heel of your hand to ease it into exactly Z1 lining up with the case split. ( you are now at the No.1 overlap point, notice the camshaft markings/dots are pointing down, if you reach up and try to move the No.1 rocker arm up and down it will not move because it is in the process of opening the No.1 intake valve so the valve spring pressure has taken up all the valve lash slack that was previously there) this is the point where we measure the valve opening and set the valve timing. If you look at the reading on your dial indicator it is telling you how far the No.1 intake valve has opened. It will be on or near the setting your spec. calls for.
If the reading is not at your spec. you need to remove the snugged cam nut/ bolt and washer and pull the sprocket retaining pin. Then using a 17mm open end wrench, adjust the camshaft to set the correct setting on your dial indicator, reinstall the sprocket retaining pin, reassemble the washer and snug the cam nut/bolt. Now rotate the crankshaft 2 complete revolutions, 720*,( this 720* takes you one complete cycle and back to your overlap point) and recheck your setting. Your setting should repeat as long as you had the cam nut/ bolt snugged enough to eliminate any creep. If you setting is not repeating, using the 17mm open end wrench, adjust the camshaft to set the correct setting on your dial indicator, reinstall the sprocket retaining pin, reassemble the washer and snug the cam nut/bolt, rotate another 2 complete revolutions, 720*, and recheck your setting again. Once you have repeatability, hold the cam snout and tighten the cam nut/bolt tightly but do not torque yet, after you tighten the nut rotate 720* to make sure you didnít lose your setting. Unfortunately it may take several attempts before you get the cam to fall into spec correctly but donít give up. As you repeat the procedure you can make adjustments when readjusting the camshaft that will offset the creep when torqueing the Cam nut/bolt.
Once you have completed the left bank cam setting set #1 to Z1 TDC on the compression point (your dial indicator will be back at 0 at this point and you should be able to, slightly, move the No.1 intake rocker arm up and down. Now rotate the crankshaft 360* to Z1 (this is Z1 TDC for #4) because #1 and # 4 fire 360 degrees apart. Set the valve lash for #4 and remove the Z block and dial indicator from the left bank and install it on #4 of the right bank and follow the same procedure you did on #1.





Cole
__________________
Cole - 80 930 "The Old Sled"
Mods: TurboKraft Custom IC, 934 Headers, GSX 61, Zork, Port Work, SC Cams, Air Mod Fuel Dist Relocated, Water Meth Injection, BL WUR, MSD 6530, Greddy EBC, Synapse Bov, Short 2nd & 3rd with 8:37 R&P, Wevo Shifter, Coupling, and Mounts, MTX-L SSI-4, Big Brakes, Rebel Coilovers, Bilstein Sports.
Old 05-15-2011, 06:32 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #23 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
Cole, sorry for the late feedback. Been busy the last couple of days.

I happily take all the advice you give me. I'll study your post on cam timing, and see what I get out of it.

Thank you very much.
__________________
Jesper
Carrera 3.0 1975
930 1978 OEM Matte Schwartz, ANDIAL IC, BL WUR, SC cams. LMA-3 w. XD-16 and CP transducer
www.stauningwhisky.dk
Old 05-17-2011, 05:27 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #24 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
Question, If I lign up the crank at Z1 and #1 CYL at TDC. Can I then mark the DIST and ENG case with a marker to make sure that I know the adjustment/position it is in prior to removal, and then just put it back in that same position, and expect ignition timing to be the same as before I removed it?
__________________
Jesper
Carrera 3.0 1975
930 1978 OEM Matte Schwartz, ANDIAL IC, BL WUR, SC cams. LMA-3 w. XD-16 and CP transducer
www.stauningwhisky.dk
Old 05-18-2011, 11:00 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #25 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Auburn,In. U.S.A.
Posts: 2,449
Jesper,

Yes you can do that. Make sure #1 is at TDC on the compression stroke, remove the distributor cap and mark the case with a black marker pen. You want to mark the case
directly under, and in line with, where the rotor tip is pointing. Doing this is not a substitute for correctly timing with a timing lite but it will get you close enough to have the engine start.

Cole
__________________
Cole - 80 930 "The Old Sled"
Mods: TurboKraft Custom IC, 934 Headers, GSX 61, Zork, Port Work, SC Cams, Air Mod Fuel Dist Relocated, Water Meth Injection, BL WUR, MSD 6530, Greddy EBC, Synapse Bov, Short 2nd & 3rd with 8:37 R&P, Wevo Shifter, Coupling, and Mounts, MTX-L SSI-4, Big Brakes, Rebel Coilovers, Bilstein Sports.
Old 05-18-2011, 08:35 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #26 (permalink)
MJR MJR is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Okinawa, Japan
Posts: 19
Running rough and a glowing header smacks of severely retarded ignition timing. When syncing the engine with what's loaded in the map with aftermarket engine management, we use a timing light and the starter. It gives a pretty good indication as to where it is to get it started.

Not sure where your timing is supposed to be at idle with zero vacuum (cranking), but the 1:30 position is around 45* ATDC, which is severely retarded.

Cheers,
Matt
Old 05-20-2011, 06:50 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #27 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
MJR, I really hope it is a matter of ignition problems, though that might have caused exhaust valve damage, or what...?

I have been away for the last couple of days. Now I have found a "new" DD. So the pressure is off, and I can start trouble shooting for real.
__________________
Jesper
Carrera 3.0 1975
930 1978 OEM Matte Schwartz, ANDIAL IC, BL WUR, SC cams. LMA-3 w. XD-16 and CP transducer
www.stauningwhisky.dk

Last edited by jsveb; 05-26-2011 at 05:55 PM..
Old 05-23-2011, 05:42 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #28 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
may have found the culprit

Hi
Guys After travelling on the job, I am back and picked up on the troubleshooting.

JBL930, I think (really hope) you are spot on with your suggestion.

I went out and took off the new IGN cap (just installed during this latest "endevour") I grapped the rotor (also new)and gently tried to moved it. Then with a pronounced click/clonk it moved. Now I can move it some. I guess it was stuck. As far as I remember it jumped counter clockwise, does this mean it was stuck in a retarded position?

On a side note. I could see some scrabing on the old cap from the rotor. I guess this means the bearing in the IGN is worn as well.

I think this may mean that I have to get the DIST rebuilt no matter what.


Thank you
__________________
Jesper
Carrera 3.0 1975
930 1978 OEM Matte Schwartz, ANDIAL IC, BL WUR, SC cams. LMA-3 w. XD-16 and CP transducer
www.stauningwhisky.dk
Old 06-18-2011, 10:01 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #29 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
I dont want to remove the distributor if it is not failing. Does anybody have any input based on my post yesterday?
I think it needs rebuilding, but would like some feedback from some of you who knows better than me.

Thanks
Old 06-19-2011, 11:18 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #30 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Auburn,In. U.S.A.
Posts: 2,449
Jesper,

Don't be afraid to remove the distributor as they are quite easy to reinstall. If you were seeing rotor contact scuffing on the inside of the cap something is defiantly wrong. What you have described would indicate the rotor wasn't seated correctly,
the distributor wasn't completely seated, or excessive shaft end play exists.

Now we need to make Jesper's special tool 101:

( Go out and buy 2-3 feet of 5/8 inch outside diameter rubber hose. Now wrap several layers of tape( 5-6) around the hose 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch up from one end of the hose This will allow you to put the hose into the spark plug hole and the layers of tape will create a seal against the cylinder head)

Pull the #1 plug and push you special tool 101 into the spark plug hole until the tape seats against the plug hole. Now while holding your thumb over the free end of the hose rotate the crankshaft clockwise. Continue to rotate the crankshaft several revolutions to familiarize with what's hapening. You will feel the compression in the cylinder pushing against your thumb once every 2 revolutions of the crankshaft. That compression you are feeling is the top of the compression stroke which is the point where the spark plug fires the cylinder. That is Top Dead Center of the No. 1 cylinder.

Now that you have done this and are starting to understand how all this fits
together you can pull the distributor.

1. Remove the distributor cap and move it out of your way.

2. Insert your hose into the spark plug hole on #1. Now rotate the crank
cloclwise several times to get familuar with what it feels like when the
compression pushes against your thumb.

3. Now, if your confortable with what your doing here we will proceed. Rotate
the crankshaft slowley clockwise untill you just start to feel compression
against your thumb and then stop. Now look at the crankshaft pulley and
find the Z1 mark on the pllley and slowlty rotate the crankshaft clockwise
untill the Z1 mark is directly alligned with the engine case split just above the
pulley. STOP !!!!

4. Now look at the distributor and note where the tip of the rotor is pointing.
With a black marker put a mark on the outside lip of the distributor rim,
where the distributor cap sits, put the mark on that rim directly in front of
where the rotor tip is pointing. Now put another mark on the distributor
base directly below the mark you made on the lip but put the second mark
on the distributor base where it goes into the engine case and extend that
mark off the distributor base and on to the engine case. Ok, we have now
made a complete reference of where the rotor, distributot base, and
engine case were located with the #1 piston at top dead center on the
compression stroke.

5. Having done this we can now remove the distributor knowing that by
using our hose to find the compression point for #1 and then lining up Z1
with the case split again we can install the distributor, using our reference
marks, and get it right back where it came from.

You need to get that distributor out of there so we can evaluate it;s condition and make sure it's functioning properly.

If you have any questions or need help don't hesitate to call me.

260-570-6914

Cole
__________________
Cole - 80 930 "The Old Sled"
Mods: TurboKraft Custom IC, 934 Headers, GSX 61, Zork, Port Work, SC Cams, Air Mod Fuel Dist Relocated, Water Meth Injection, BL WUR, MSD 6530, Greddy EBC, Synapse Bov, Short 2nd & 3rd with 8:37 R&P, Wevo Shifter, Coupling, and Mounts, MTX-L SSI-4, Big Brakes, Rebel Coilovers, Bilstein Sports.
Old 06-20-2011, 06:09 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #31 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
Cole, Thank you VERY much for that comprehensive checklist. If I cant figure it out with this, I'll just jump in a lake

The rotor definetly contacts the cap when it rotates. I have checked the old one, and can see it did too.
I can feel what I would call moderate shaftplay, I would think it is way out of tolerance. The way the rotor moves (when it is seated) just doesn't feel right.

I'll build my special tool, and report back as soon as I got progress

Thank you very much.
__________________
Jesper
Carrera 3.0 1975
930 1978 OEM Matte Schwartz, ANDIAL IC, BL WUR, SC cams. LMA-3 w. XD-16 and CP transducer
www.stauningwhisky.dk
Old 06-20-2011, 10:55 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #32 (permalink)
 
Infidel
 
JBL930's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 1,172
Hi Jesper, i didn't do the work on my dizzy, so not sure what is involved, sorry! All i know is i was told it was broken, that the arm had rusted through, and it needed rebuilding.... They made one good one out of two bad ones. Glad you may have got to the bottom of it!
I think all of the original dizzy's will be in need of a check, 20+ years old etc.... Certainly those that have not been kept dry all their lives.
Keep us up to date
__________________
Jonathan.
87 930, 993 turbo engine, RS Tuning 520PS/515lbf-ft, Arrow Rods, ARP hardware, Solid lifters, G50-50, RS Flywheel, 890nm Sachs clutch, RSR coil overs all round, 993 C4 calipers front, 930 fronts on the rear, Ruf Speedlines.....
Old 540 BMW, XB12S Modified, for being a total hooligan
Old 06-20-2011, 11:34 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #33 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Auburn,In. U.S.A.
Posts: 2,449
Jesper,

Great to talk with you !!!! I thought I might post a distributor exploaded view for you. It will help you see what all is in there,




Cole
__________________
Cole - 80 930 "The Old Sled"
Mods: TurboKraft Custom IC, 934 Headers, GSX 61, Zork, Port Work, SC Cams, Air Mod Fuel Dist Relocated, Water Meth Injection, BL WUR, MSD 6530, Greddy EBC, Synapse Bov, Short 2nd & 3rd with 8:37 R&P, Wevo Shifter, Coupling, and Mounts, MTX-L SSI-4, Big Brakes, Rebel Coilovers, Bilstein Sports.
Old 06-20-2011, 12:13 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #34 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
Well Cole, I appreciate you taking the time to help. It helps a lot, and makes it a lot more fun too.

The distributor is out...

With my extensive knowledge - as in NONE - I'd say it is messed up some.

For detemining TDC on #1 I used a hose I have got from a compression test set - Worked fine.

I have a trigger to engage the starter while working at the engine. It made it very easy to crank the engine. While doing this I could see (with the cap off) that the spikes on 805 and 811 seems to interfere with each other when turning over the engine. This or maybe something else causes the advance mech (i guess) to stick in one position.

There is moderate radial play in the shaft and a LOT of axial play.

The little pipe on the advance mech. (800) is loose, and maybe leaking. I have however not had a problem building boost.

The conclusion is that I think the DIST needs rebuilding.

Is this it, not sure.

There is one more thing: I think it is really hard to turn over the engine with a wrench. Two weeks ago just after this all happened, it was real easy, now it's not ??????????????? - even with the DIST off.
I had to tighten the fan ALT belt to do it. Well, it needed tightening anyways. I think I'll buy a new outer pulley half since the oval shaped hole seems worn, and off center.

I'll try to put on my torque wrench, if it'll fit, to see how mush torque it actually takes to turn over the engine.

This worries me, but also makes me wonder, since it was real easy to do two weeks ago under the same conditions.
__________________
Jesper
Carrera 3.0 1975
930 1978 OEM Matte Schwartz, ANDIAL IC, BL WUR, SC cams. LMA-3 w. XD-16 and CP transducer
www.stauningwhisky.dk

Last edited by jsveb; 06-20-2011 at 01:30 PM..
Old 06-20-2011, 01:28 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #35 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Auburn,In. U.S.A.
Posts: 2,449
Jesper.

If you have considerable radial and axial play you defiantly need to have someone go through it for you. You might call Jerry Woods at smart racing and get some pricing for taking a look and getting a quote to rebuild. There may be some decent used out there but also understand some of these are 30 years old so if you buy used make sure it is either lower miles or gone through.

The engine will not turn over easily with a wrench because you are still turning against the compression on 5 of the 6 cylinders. Pull the other 5 plugs and try it.
If it still turns over hard you'll want to check compression on each cylinder 1 at a time.

Cole
__________________
Cole - 80 930 "The Old Sled"
Mods: TurboKraft Custom IC, 934 Headers, GSX 61, Zork, Port Work, SC Cams, Air Mod Fuel Dist Relocated, Water Meth Injection, BL WUR, MSD 6530, Greddy EBC, Synapse Bov, Short 2nd & 3rd with 8:37 R&P, Wevo Shifter, Coupling, and Mounts, MTX-L SSI-4, Big Brakes, Rebel Coilovers, Bilstein Sports.
Old 06-22-2011, 10:11 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #36 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
Hi Cole
I am currently searching my options; buying, rebuilding etc.

Regarding turning over the engine. Well, the plugs are all out, that's what worries me.
Old 06-22-2011, 10:33 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #37 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Alan L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 3,247
My dizzy was frozen, and the car lacked power below boost - ie was not advancing. Dont know that it was running red tho.
If the rotor is stiff to move - not good.
I did mine on the bench. Not hard to disassemble and lubricate/free up. mine had a lot of rust type stuff reezing the rotate mechanism to the shaft. It is all very logical to pull apart.
Set to #1TDC on compression. pull the cap and note the rotor should be pointing at #1 plug lead terminal (follow the lead to #1). Use a marker pen and scribe a mark on the dizzy base and crankcase base - you join these up when put dizzy back in - and MAKE SURE ROTOR IS POINTING AT #1 TERMINAL AGAIN.
If you have an issue, post a pic. I used a bit of very fine wet/dry paper (1200) to remove the crap and used some never seize copper compound after, on the shaft.
You can crudely check your cam timing by finding TDC compresion for #1 same as you would do for valve adjust.Then rotate another 360 - ie back to same mark, The #1 inlet valve should have JUST started to depress (0.7mm) - you can actually set a dial gauge up in the engine bay if you really want to get serious, but eyeball is probably good enough here. If it has let loose it will be by more than 0.7mm. Then when you are on this TDC mark you are on TDC compression for #4 inlet. Rotate 360 and check again on #4. I cant really see how they can come out of adjust without loosing complete function.
Alan
__________________
83 SC, 82 930 (track) - Stock except for RarlyL8 race headers, RarlyL8 Zork, K27-7006, 22/28 T bars, 007 Fuel head, short 3&4 gears, NGK AFR, Greddy EBC (on the slippery slope), Wevo engine mounts, ERP rear camber adjust and mono balls, Tarret front monoball camber adjust, Elgin cams, 38mm ported heads, 964 IC. 380rwhp @ 0.8bar Apart from above, bone stock:-)
Old 06-23-2011, 01:33 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #38 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: S. Florida
Posts: 7,266
When you slide any bosch distributor back in it's hole the rotor tip will turn about an inch as the drive gears engage because they are helical cut. So depending on which way your distributor rotates you point the rotor at approximately the preceding spark plug terminal next to the #1 terminal before carefully sliding it in.
Look to see it is pointed where you want it after the distributor is all the way in.

Put some motor oil on the gear and distributor oring seal, it may take a few insertions before it's right... but thats always good practice.
Old 06-23-2011, 09:22 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #39 (permalink)
Registered User
 
jsveb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Norseman territory
Posts: 2,780
Garage
Alan L, thank you for the input. I am in the garage right now working on the car. Well, hands are idling and the head is spinning
Thanks you for the info on the distributor I may get back to you on that.

JFairman, thank you for helping me, I see why the rotor will spin when dropping in the distributor. I will keep your advice in mind. Greatly appreciated.

I have to say right now I am puzzled and worried. I am really debating with my self on whether I should try to contain this thing to get it running, or if I should just let it rip and maybe end up rebuild and efi $$$$$

I have been talking a lot about it being hard to turn over the engine by hand with plugs removed. I decided to put my torque wrench on and see exactly how hard it was.
It took about 60nm and the engine sounded weird for about 45-90 degrees - Hasn't done that before. Then it eased up, now it only takes 15nm and there are no more sounds...

Last edited by jsveb; 06-23-2011 at 01:19 PM.. Reason: spelling and iPhone screw-ups
Old 06-23-2011, 11:40 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #40 (permalink)
Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

 


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:34 PM.


 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page
 

DTO Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.