Pelican Parts
Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   Pelican Parts Forums > Porsche Forums > 911 / 930 Turbo & Super Charging Forum


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Reply
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: DC
Posts: 1,185
Garage
by running the the vacuum hose that goes to back of distributor to the temp switch and back to port that goes bottom or back of the throttle body, ( the one closest to the rear bumper it act like a time switch , and blocks off vacuum to your distributor which raises your rpm's to about 1200 rpm's which takes about 2 min's to open, when it opens your idle should be at 900 rpm's . you may have to adjust you Idle a little,
__________________
1986 944 turbo -first car
1997 993 Cab 6 speed-sold
1992 964 C2 turbo
SOLD, 911GT ,CIS, 428 fwhp 450 trq, Carrillo rods, 964 cams, TT retainers,7.5 comp 1.1 bar boost 320 ml black fuel head 009 injectors, 044 pumps, 60-1 T4/T3 dual scroll turbo
Old 11-15-2011, 11:26 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #21 (permalink)
Registered Driver
 
Helmsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South Australia
Posts: 281
Garage
I believe some Euro 84 turbos (930.66 Engine) didn't have an electric operated solenoid-valve. They only had the temperature operated vacuum valve. I have tried with and without the vacuum valve connected and it has no effect that I can tell. Startup Rpm depends on cold start pressures and AAR.

The temperature switch on the left-side cam cover is for the Cold Start Injector.

If the problems arose since you recently changed or rebult your WUR then I would put money on the pressures being slightly off. That could be checked with CIS gauges (and AFR gauge preferably).

__________________
Ben
'85 930 - Black on Black
'95 993 Turbo - Silver
Old 11-15-2011, 03:07 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #22 (permalink)
Registered User
 
j930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Anthem, AZ
Posts: 875
Garage
wow you guys are awesome. so yes it appears all is hooked up correctly but i am unsure on the timer as i cant see it. i have talked to my mechanic and i think you guys have nailed this thing down to most likely pressure settings. i will update with how it is resolved.
__________________
84 930 Slant
15 Sonata 2.0T
08 Ram 1500
15 Ram Eco Diesel
Old 11-15-2011, 03:23 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #23 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Alan L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 3,261
You said your AAR was 'partly' open. I don't know what your ambient temp is, but mine is near fully open generally, when cold. Sometimes they get sticky. Othertimes they go out of whack - warped bimetallic finger. You could try
1) just flicking the disc open with a screw driver and see if it moves easily (won't damage - only pushing against the finger). If it moves freely then go to (2)
2) Do as Mark? said, and remove it and put in fridge with left overs. After 30 mins see if is fully open - should be - at 4 deg C. If not go to (3)
3) Your finger is out of whack and needs remedy. If this is the case, we can fix it.
If it does not move freely with screw driver (1), then either gunked up - should be able to see, or something restricting it from opening properly.
You may just not be getting enough air on startup.
Alan
__________________
83 SC, 82 930 (track) - Stock except for RarlyL8 race headers, RarlyL8 Zork, K27-7006, 22/28 T bars, 007 Fuel head, short 3&4 gears, NGK AFR, Greddy EBC (on the slippery slope), Wevo engine mounts, ERP rear camber adjust and mono balls, Tarret front monoball camber adjust, Elgin cams, 38mm ported heads, 964 IC. 380rwhp @ 0.8bar Apart from above, bone stock:-)
Old 11-15-2011, 04:33 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #24 (permalink)
Registered User
 
j930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Anthem, AZ
Posts: 875
Garage
alan, you bring up a good point. i thought in my reading that the aar was only to be partially open, this might be a huge part of my problem, my ambient temp last night here in phoenix when i tested it was maybe 65 degrees and it was only open a little bit. it did close completely after running for a few minutes. i checked it again this afternoon and it was just partially open maybe 70 degrees? how far open are these things to be?
__________________
84 930 Slant
15 Sonata 2.0T
08 Ram 1500
15 Ram Eco Diesel
Old 11-15-2011, 05:54 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #25 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: DC
Posts: 1,185
Garage
I also have a 930/66 without the smog stuff and the electric vacuum switch's and stuff,with the same T body, and distributor, what I'm trying to do is NOT hook it the way the factory did but an alternative way, like I did on my car,

J930 if you disconnect the the inside distributor vacuum hose, your rpm's up about ,can you do that test? it can be done with the engine cold or warm.

Yes check your AAR make sure is working correctly ,

Because you also don't have all those vacuum switches that helps you with cold start idle, let me what happens when you pull the hose.
__________________
1986 944 turbo -first car
1997 993 Cab 6 speed-sold
1992 964 C2 turbo
SOLD, 911GT ,CIS, 428 fwhp 450 trq, Carrillo rods, 964 cams, TT retainers,7.5 comp 1.1 bar boost 320 ml black fuel head 009 injectors, 044 pumps, 60-1 T4/T3 dual scroll turbo
Old 11-15-2011, 05:55 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #26 (permalink)
 
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: DC
Posts: 1,185
Garage
yes your right , if the car sat for a little while it will start to open up a little bit,even if the car sat over night it will never open all the way just may a 5th to a 4th of the way , when the car is hot and you just turned off the key , check it then, it should be closed all the way, this is the same situation I had, too the T
__________________
1986 944 turbo -first car
1997 993 Cab 6 speed-sold
1992 964 C2 turbo
SOLD, 911GT ,CIS, 428 fwhp 450 trq, Carrillo rods, 964 cams, TT retainers,7.5 comp 1.1 bar boost 320 ml black fuel head 009 injectors, 044 pumps, 60-1 T4/T3 dual scroll turbo
Old 11-15-2011, 06:02 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #27 (permalink)
Registered User
 
mark houghton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Central Washington State
Posts: 3,776
Quote:
Originally Posted by heliolps2 View Post
I also have a 930/66 without the smog stuff and the electric vacuum switch's and stuff,with the same T body, and distributor, what I'm trying to do is NOT hook it the way the factory did but an alternative way, like I did on my car,

J930 if you disconnect the the inside distributor vacuum hose, your rpm's up about ,can you do that test? it can be done with the engine cold or warm.

Yes check your AAR make sure is working correctly ,

Because you also don't have all those vacuum switches that helps you with cold start idle, let me what happens when you pull the hose.
I have none of the funky emmissions vacuum switches and solenoids, except for the one we've already discussed....which I will remove next time I can easily get to it. None of that stuff is necessary at all and was put there just to please the US import emissions restrictions. My car fast idles cold at around 1300 and settles in to 950 when warmed up. Just more stuff to go bad on us and cause us to chase our tails.
__________________
Mark H. 1987 930, GP White, Wevo shifter, Borla exhaust, stock everything else. The result of a massive Pelicanite good will fire recovery effort. Truely an open book, ready for the slippery slopes to modification.
Old 11-15-2011, 06:02 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #28 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: DC
Posts: 1,185
Garage
hey J930 I have some time a difficult time expressing my experience , on the computer if you like you can call me at any time 210-473-7158 and go over some of these things , hope to hear from you soon.

Helio
__________________
1986 944 turbo -first car
1997 993 Cab 6 speed-sold
1992 964 C2 turbo
SOLD, 911GT ,CIS, 428 fwhp 450 trq, Carrillo rods, 964 cams, TT retainers,7.5 comp 1.1 bar boost 320 ml black fuel head 009 injectors, 044 pumps, 60-1 T4/T3 dual scroll turbo
Old 11-15-2011, 06:08 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #29 (permalink)
Registered User
 
j930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Anthem, AZ
Posts: 875
Garage
wow thx, i will call you. i ran the car down to the dealer this afternoon with your diagrams. in hopes all can be fixed.
__________________
84 930 Slant
15 Sonata 2.0T
08 Ram 1500
15 Ram Eco Diesel
Old 11-15-2011, 06:36 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #30 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Alan L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 3,261
Right, I just checked my AAR - since I have the engine half apart.
My ambient temp is 75 F right now. I ahve about 1/3 aperture. You should have more than that at 60 deg - maybe 50%.
If not, try pinging it with screw driver - see if it is free enough to move more open.
Also you could try cracking the hose free a bit on the backside and let a bit more air in and see if the idle is happier.
Apart from putting it in fridge - it should be near wide open at fridge temp. It is designed to operate in tandem with the WUR which also controls fuel pressure by similar bimetallic finger - they both feel the cold the same. The WUR dumps more fuel in until the finger warms up and closes the fuel diaphragm down, the AAR opens up to allow more air to go with the fuel. If it is not opening properly, the engine can't use the extra fuel and idle up.
Alan
__________________
83 SC, 82 930 (track) - Stock except for RarlyL8 race headers, RarlyL8 Zork, K27-7006, 22/28 T bars, 007 Fuel head, short 3&4 gears, NGK AFR, Greddy EBC (on the slippery slope), Wevo engine mounts, ERP rear camber adjust and mono balls, Tarret front monoball camber adjust, Elgin cams, 38mm ported heads, 964 IC. 380rwhp @ 0.8bar Apart from above, bone stock:-)
Old 11-15-2011, 07:23 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #31 (permalink)
Registered User
 
mark houghton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Central Washington State
Posts: 3,776
On the topic of AAR's and what's appropriate for the opening, here's some creative photography of mine in my 65 degree garage. Should give you some indication of what "open" means. I would say that mine is 80% open.

__________________
Mark H. 1987 930, GP White, Wevo shifter, Borla exhaust, stock everything else. The result of a massive Pelicanite good will fire recovery effort. Truely an open book, ready for the slippery slopes to modification.
Old 11-15-2011, 07:25 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #32 (permalink)
Registered User
 
j930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Anthem, AZ
Posts: 875
Garage
mine was no where near that! maybe 1/2 that amount!
__________________
84 930 Slant
15 Sonata 2.0T
08 Ram 1500
15 Ram Eco Diesel
Old 11-15-2011, 07:54 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #33 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Alan L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 3,261
Well, that sounds like a good place to start. Like I said earlier , you could get a bit of an idea by cracking open the tube on the 'out' side of the AAR and let a bit more air in and see what happens.
That pic is almost as good as my colonoscopy pic - wanna see it?
Alan
__________________
83 SC, 82 930 (track) - Stock except for RarlyL8 race headers, RarlyL8 Zork, K27-7006, 22/28 T bars, 007 Fuel head, short 3&4 gears, NGK AFR, Greddy EBC (on the slippery slope), Wevo engine mounts, ERP rear camber adjust and mono balls, Tarret front monoball camber adjust, Elgin cams, 38mm ported heads, 964 IC. 380rwhp @ 0.8bar Apart from above, bone stock:-)
Old 11-15-2011, 08:32 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #34 (permalink)
Registered Driver
 
Helmsy's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: South Australia
Posts: 281
Garage
Trying prying it open with a screwdriver as Alan suggested and make sure it is free to move and more importantly spring back to where it was.

Put it in the fridge or freezer for ~10mins and you will see its maximum opening. You can also then put it in the oven to make sure it closes fully. You can also check the resistance of the wires (there is a thread on here somewhere about what it should be).
__________________
Ben
'85 930 - Black on Black
'95 993 Turbo - Silver
Old 11-15-2011, 08:43 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #35 (permalink)
Registered User
 
j930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Anthem, AZ
Posts: 875
Garage
i will keep ypu guys posted with what the end result is. Heliops gave me some direction on timing and idle that may be of help as well. THanks for the great Pic mark. that picture says it all. from everything i was reading it seemed that those were only to open a little bit and you pic shows what a little bit is.
__________________
84 930 Slant
15 Sonata 2.0T
08 Ram 1500
15 Ram Eco Diesel
Old 11-16-2011, 06:22 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #36 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: DC
Posts: 1,185
Garage
here's a pic of the thermo valve , That's the black thing with two ports on it , next to the engine breather,
__________________
1986 944 turbo -first car
1997 993 Cab 6 speed-sold
1992 964 C2 turbo
SOLD, 911GT ,CIS, 428 fwhp 450 trq, Carrillo rods, 964 cams, TT retainers,7.5 comp 1.1 bar boost 320 ml black fuel head 009 injectors, 044 pumps, 60-1 T4/T3 dual scroll turbo
Old 11-17-2011, 05:23 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #37 (permalink)
Registered User
 
mark houghton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Central Washington State
Posts: 3,776
Yep, that's the one that unless you're really a purest and must keep everything stock, then it's just as easy to bypass it. Many have done just that. Too bad it's so darn hard to get to.
To save any confusion for people following this thread, don't confuse that with the thermotime switch.
__________________
Mark H. 1987 930, GP White, Wevo shifter, Borla exhaust, stock everything else. The result of a massive Pelicanite good will fire recovery effort. Truely an open book, ready for the slippery slopes to modification.
Old 11-17-2011, 05:47 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #38 (permalink)
Registered User
 
j930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Anthem, AZ
Posts: 875
Garage
great pic, thx. helio i sent you a PM. they are cleaning up the aar
__________________
84 930 Slant
15 Sonata 2.0T
08 Ram 1500
15 Ram Eco Diesel
Old 11-17-2011, 08:48 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #39 (permalink)
Registered User
 
j930's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Anthem, AZ
Posts: 875
Garage
helio you have the fuel thing(cant remember the name) that adds fuel at boost. where did you find it? its in the center of the picture with the spring on the front.
__________________
84 930 Slant
15 Sonata 2.0T
08 Ram 1500
15 Ram Eco Diesel
Old 11-17-2011, 08:50 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #40 (permalink)
Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

 


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:54 AM.


 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page
 

DTO Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.