930: 3.3 IC on 3.0 engine

[TiberiusCassius]

Hi there,

I'd like to install the 3.3 OEM IC onto my 3.0 Turbo engine. Now I have the IC itself and valve housing below the IC from the 3.3 engine but it still doesnt quite fit. Does anyone have any ideas where the 3.0 inlet manifold differs from the 3.3 one?
And whether it is possible to do the job I am intending to without buying too every single part of the 3.3 engine?

Thanks,
Dennis

[stevie 77 930]

You'll need the entire intake manifold from a 3.3 to make this happen. The angle of the 3.0 throttle valve is distinctively different from a 3.3.

Youll need the intake manifold, 3.3 BOV assembly, up pipe adapter and the IC to make it all happen. Luckly, these 3.3 intake parts are always for sale in the classifieds on Pelican Be sure to replace the o-rings.

[RarlyL8]

The throttle body sits in a slightly different plane on the 3.0 as compared to the 3.3L engine. A 3.3L intake manifold will put things where they need to go.

[jimtweet]

930 Intercooler and BOV housing and new O-rings, modded to fit duck

[TiberiusCassius]

Ok, so last thing to get is the manifold. Last question: Does it make sense? Any ideas how many hp I might gain or how much boost I might drive with the IC?

Thanks a lot!

[jimtweet]

Originally Posted by TiberiusCassius

Ok, so last thing to get is the manifold. Last question: Does it make sense? Any ideas how many hp I might gain or how much boost I might drive with the IC?

Thanks a lot!

this is a HUGE HUGE misconception in the "turbo" world....

fact: intercoolers do not add horse power, intercooler allow for more power to be made

intercoolers cool the air intake temperature allowing for more boost and timing and lowering the chance of knock and detonation.

i hope i said that right, i know what im trying to say, but sometimes its harder to type on a blackberry.

[JakobM]

Look at the figures

What do you think happens with the torque of an engine, and hence hp, on the same manifold air pressure with different air inlet temperatures entering the combustion?

some examples of mass vs. temperature on SAME manifold air pressure

Temp. °C = Kg/m3

0°C = 1.251 kg

50°C =1.057 kg

100°C = 0.916 kg

200°C = 0.722 kg

300°C = 0.596 kg

Hot air expand and hence giving higher or same manifold air pressure with less air molecules. Cold air holds more air molecules on same map pressure. Combustion needs the air molecules to burn fuel. Keeping the same manifold air pressure and same volume of fuel injected, colder air will burn more of the injected fuel in the combustion due to higher quantity of air molecules. We never succeed to burn/exploid full potential of the gasolin (you could find other fuel fluids having greater burn rate than gasolin). Greater combustion per cycle makes more torque per cycle and as torque x rpm (cycle) = power, you will gain more hp theoretically.

If intercooler is working correct, cold air makes more hp on SAME manifold air pressure due to the higher volume/mass of air molecules entering the combustion. However you will properly not notice it on a 75-77 930 due to OEM setup. Having said that, you are absolute right on the fact intercooler is needed if you want to increase boost on a respectable modern CR to control detonation. But alone lowering the temperature on same manifold air pressure will have a positive effect on torque and power theoretically. Controlling detonation is another story/benefit and the single most efficient reason to use a IC.

Remember, we boost (increasing manifold air pressure) to increase number of air molecules, we also increase air molecules by lowering the temperature (as one of the benefits from cold air manifold intake). Air molecules = torque.

[mark houghton]

God I love it when we talk technical stuff like air molecules, density and temperature!

Absolutely correct. You see the same (relative) impact on a NA car when running down the road on a brisk winter morning, as opposed to blasting through the desert on a hot summer day. Guess which scenario the car runs strongest at?

As Brian said - "The throttle body sits in a slightly different plane on the 3.0 as compared to the 3.3L engine" - I wonder if it would be do-able to leave your 3.0 manifold in place and briddge the gap from the IC with a somewhat flexible silicone hose adaptor? Of course, you'll still need to install a BOV somewhere.

[Miguel Antonett]

Prrrreeeettty cool stuff!

I'm with you Mark, I love this forum...

[quattrorunner]

Just for some real world back to back comparo....
I just installed an intercooler to the same engine you use last week, and while my intercooler is a reallly nice one, I'd bet you'll see an increase in seat of the pants power over the same engine, boost, and timing as before. For me, the diffrence was longer lag with snappy onset and then more power overall. It's worth it.
I'm getting more power no doubt about it. My azz says about 20hp, but I have a really good intercooler.

[infraredcalvin]

I would say the comparable diffeerence would be driving a stock 3.0 on a HOT day vs. cool 50 deg morn. Definitely a difference in power, probably better described as 'pep'...

Sorry Mark, just noticed the repeat.. Anyway you guys get the drift... Back to my cave...

[quattrorunner]

BTW mark is right. I Bridged that gap with some silicone coupler/hose and hose clamps and it works great.