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Remember Baloo has a 3.2 not an SC.
From reading other 3.2 turbo threads the process is certainly easier with less potential issues to overcome than on the SC cars.

I did read somewhere a 3.0 SC turbo having run over 60,000 miles ok.

Provided you keep it low boost, have a decent engine to start with, setup the timing correctly and have an AFR gauge to monitor, no drag racing from every light, then no reason why it wont be reliable. Others have done it and found so.

Admittedly if it was my daily driver I would think twice!

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Old 06-05-2013, 09:47 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #41 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raceboy View Post
Tilikum Turbo's statesments are sort diffcult to understand to say politely. Where are you born, on Earth? I'm asking this because you ought to know that engineers don't build cars alone, beancounters have the final word and that is even in Porsche.

Your statements about tested parts, sum of the whole etc may apply to NEW Porsches to some extent but how on earth you could convince a person with a slight clue of engines that CIS injected 930 is better platvorm than EFI 3.2 Carrera with programmable ECU?

And with this is mind I would like to make a suggestion to correct the 1st point of the list: standalone ECU is pretty much the first item one needs to buy if one thinks about boosting a 3.2 or SC. You can make the car run quite fast and relaible with stock headers but with poor tuning one cannot expect it to live more than few hundred miles at worst.
And number one reason for turbocharging projects to fail (mechanically) is poor tuning. That applies to all cars not just Porsches.
Yes, I was born on Earth(chuckling after hearing that, and am familiar with the what is required to bring a product to market from concept to prototype/marketing/funding/R&D.


If you looking to only make horsepower and torque, then by all means, I am sure an ECU modded 3.2 with turbo may shatter any 3.3L with CIS.

But how would a true 3.3L do with that same programable ECU compare to a 3.2L(which was not designed for forced induction, whereas the 3.3L has it all sorted out FROM the factory)
If I have a stock-block Chevy V-8 and build it to 700HP...is this truly a ZR1 motor? Is it as reliable...or flexible in all driving conditions. I understand components of the 930 are extremely expensive compared to the 3.0 and 3.2, but there was a reason why the 930 cost back in the day way more than a standard 911, and that money did not go into a fancier Porsche badge in front. They had to make everything work together AND make it marketable to the world in terms of emissions/safety/drivability/longevity, not just numbers on a dyno.

I can't say everyone who has a turbo drives it every day, most do not. I do not drive my car on a race track, but drive it everyday in Los Angeles traffic, virtually 365 days a year. For me, that 3.3L gives me the flexibility and reliability I would not otherwise have with a modded 3.0 or 3.2(nevermind not being able to pass a smog check).

Someone else chimed in about evidence of issues of people having problems with failed turbo projects with the 3.0 and 3.2. Is that not already self-evident here?
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Old 06-05-2013, 10:01 AM
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Let's keep it in perspective here... what are your goals for turbocharging a NA 911? Reliability factors will depend on use and overall design. Plan to use as daily driver or the occassional stop light "romp"? Keep it close to a 930 design as possible (K27, J-pipe). Want 500HP to enter SCCA and tear up the track? Call Turbokraft!

When people discuss failed turbocharging projects we often times don't hear about intended use and expectations. I was very realistic in the scop and goal of my project... Daily driver and occassional, light track use. So far, I could not be happier!



Just be realistic with how you plan to treat the car and then plan accordingly. If you're still having fears of modifying your pefectly good 911 to a turbo, remember it will still behave just like a NA motor (OFF BOOST)UNTIL/EXCEPT when you begin to build boost. This is where is becomes CRITICAL to have fuel and timing correct, no secret there... many ways to accomplish this, all of which are documented here on this board.
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Last edited by cliyde; 06-05-2013 at 12:01 PM..
Old 06-05-2013, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilikum Turbo View Post
For me, that 3.3L gives me the flexibility and reliability I would not otherwise have with a modded 3.0 or 3.2(nevermind not being able to pass a smog check).

Someone else chimed in about evidence of issues of people having problems with failed turbo projects with the 3.0 and 3.2. Is that not already self-evident here?
Tilikum, you always make these BS, unfounded claims. Why would a 3.3 be more reliable than a 3.2 and have a better chance of passing smog?

Making a statement like 'seeing so many crash and burn projects' then not backing it up with one example... You go on about not messing with Porsche's master engineering plan, you put a 3.3 in a targa dude...

It's clear you're just trying litter the thread with disinformation.
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Old 06-05-2013, 05:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence88mph View Post
you put a 3.3 in a targa dude...
.


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Old 06-05-2013, 05:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence88mph View Post
Tilikum, you always make these BS, unfounded claims... Why would a 3.3 be more reliable than a 3.2 and have a better chance of passing smog...
Hmmm, kinda agree with spence's statement here. If anything, I do see some advantages of a 3.2 over a 3.3, not counting reliability.

1) How about 3.2 fully finned cylinders vs 3.3's half finned.
2) Higher flowing 3.2 heads
3) Better intake manifold (more torque)
4) Electronic ignition

I'm sure there are some cons, but I cannot think of any.
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Last edited by cliyde; 06-05-2013 at 06:12 PM..
Old 06-05-2013, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spence88mph View Post
Tilikum, you always make these BS, unfounded claims. Why would a 3.3 be more reliable than a 3.2 and have a better chance of passing smog?

Making a statement like 'seeing so many crash and burn projects' then not backing it up with one example... You go on about not messing with Porsche's master engineering plan, you put a 3.3 in a targa dude...

It's clear you're just trying litter the thread with disinformation.
Spence...in California, they do a visual check as well as what comes out the exhaust pipe. The tech's doing their job of smog inspection know that a stock 3.0SC or 3.2L Carrera did NOT come from the factory with intercooler/turbo/wastegate, etc...RED-FLAG, and they are now on the Phone to the CARB(California Air Resources Board), and now you have a lot of explaining as to WTF are these engine/modifications are doing in your car?! Cripes, even the gas cap is tested. We have the toughest emission standards in the world.

I could give you some people's numbers here whom I know thru the POC who have went the 'turbo' route(turbo-ing a 3.0 and 3.2), and it became very expensive lesson in humility and frustration. I had to submit my car to the air resources board as installing a newer engine in an earlier car(and as long as it passes smog, they are happy), but will NOT let you turbo/supercharge an exisiting engine, regardless of it passes smog or not. That's the way they roll here, I don't make the rules, I just found the loophole to get a 3.3 in my car.

Am I wrong, are not there PLENTY of examples right here on this forum of endless frustration of people going thru the same dilema, just to get the car running right, nevermind being subjected to California's stringent emission standards?
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Old 06-05-2013, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Uncle View Post

And so did the Porsche factory as well make a Targa Turbo...I guess they didn't know what they were doing.
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Old 06-05-2013, 07:02 PM
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Well, I stand corrected on the SMOG stuff. Still the the claim of your 3.3 being more reliable remains unfounded.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tilikum Turbo View Post
And so did the Porsche factory as well make a Targa Turbo...I guess they didn't know what they were doing.
Yes we all know 930s came in cabs and targas, but never a narrow body targa, my point is that you are a hypocrite. You go on about not deviating from the perfect Porsche engineering plan yet:

* Your car was also never 'designed' to be a turbo.
* Your car has stock 911 suspension, not 'engineered' for you car.
* Your car has 915 box, not 'engineered' for your engine.
I also wouldn't be surprised if your brakes and wheel sizes are stock too.

I don't care what mods you do, just don't jump on here preaching that any deviation from the Porsche factory is going to prove an unreliable disaster, especially when it's based on no evidence and your car is just as modded as many here.
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Old 06-05-2013, 08:18 PM
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Just for the record. I work as a quality specialist in automotive industry, so I have pretty good idea how the R&D process is.

Tilikum Turbo seems to be the kind of guy who has to justify his purchase (currently his 3.3 Turbo) in every possible and impossible way by bashing other approaches, even if it is not needed. Are you so protective regarding your house/wife/dog also?

Oh, I forgot, no point in arguing with the person who doesn't care about technical facts, but lives in beliefs.
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Old 06-06-2013, 12:09 AM
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I believe the 3.2 can be made to work with forced induction easer than the sc because of the fuel systems for sure, but I feel other than the issue of smog in California what issues they're are with turbo charging a 3.2 revolves around the compression ratio. The 930 is built for pressure, the 3.2 is not. The case is basically the same for both cars and there are some other small details that change between the two types but mostly were talking about pistons and the compression. There is a lot if power in the 3.2 engine to come out for sure but its more of a tight rope walk than a 930 because of the safety margin built into the 930. Crap, the factory went even further by changing the cooling effect of the cylinders by removing some fin length on the 930. There's a lot going on in the design there.
Air cooled porsche engines don't have high compression by today's standards and there is a reason for that. The 3.6 got twin ignition and that's for the ability to go higher compression. Even then it's still not as high as a water pumper. Modern turbo cars from other companies even porsche have higher compression than our air cooled cars. So, the idea of pressurizing a 3.2 needs to be taken more seriously wether it's in any body 911. Be it targa, cab or whatever crazy concoction some dude desires. The point that needs to be that there is care if the internals are intact. No boost knobs available, no high boost without race gas or e85. Or lower the compression.
That's it.
O-and there better be an Intercooler on it.
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Old 06-06-2013, 06:36 AM
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...you old guys are cool...i believe you drive as hard as we all can shoot the crap around...

Old 06-18-2013, 07:40 PM
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