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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: MYR S.C.
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my "TO DO" list

its really hot out so i put it up on stands to take care of some little things:


engine miss:
who knows


brakes fading:
found cheap pads in there. going to flush the system and amke sure all pistons moving.


adjust valves:
DONE
but going to go back thru them again. waiting on new feeler gauge. screw came out on old one. thank goodness it did not fall into the motor

have speedo set to actual mileage:
its out and on its way
DONE

have WUR modified:
DONE.

remove oil tank and lines to clean:
on hold.
taking trip to mountains labor day. need to get it back together



bypass speed relay:
DONE
i like to keep the wiring as original as possible so it looks good and can always be converted back. this took a few minutes to come up with a good fix.
BTW, what is the black relay next to the speed relay?
i love these plugs. very easy to modify.




fix front speakers:
one is working. stopped to do other work. need more time to figure out this speaker fader inthe console vs the stereo system.

small drain on the battery:
inside the cabin somewhere.


wire in the MSD properly:
DONE
got the connector to wire it into the factory harness.
got the MSD wired in. timmy2 hooked me up with a connector that connects to the factory connector that went to the CD unit.
got into some other wiring. the wire to the oil sending unit on the front is about to break. why is it that those always break?
there is some kind of sending unit mounted on the right timing chain cover. not sure what it is for.
re-routed the engine harness to clean things up.

fix passengers inside door handle:
DONE
the metal bar keeps popping off. after looking at it, i think the panel has been off and the rod mmay be on backwords.
sure enough. the rod has a long end and a short end. they put the long end to the door handle so it scrapes the door panel and it pops out of the handle.
fixed

paint intake system:
DONE
also powder coated fan, housing valve covers and the front tin.
added this after removing it.
this came out pretty easy. going to plug it. not sure how yet. maybe epoxy a plug in. not sure if i want to tap it.




clean the inside real good:
DONE
another after thought. after removing the door panel i started cleaning the door jams. they were already very clean anyway so it did not take much to touch them up. may remove passengers seat to clean around it
cleaned rear. oiled with neets feet oil.

steering colum:
DONE
found the plastic part of the bearing is coming apart. new part on order. says all you do is drive the new part in and it pushes the old out.....i hope
this was very easy to do. just hammer the new part in.


big dent in passengers floor pan:
DONE
this is a big thing with me. i like a nice straight floor pan.
couple wacks with a large hammer and you cant tell it was ever dented.

replace oil seal on tranny side cover:
part on order.
on hold

replace seal around engine bay:
DONE
need to treat for a little rust on the part above the turbo. not rusted out yet.
also sealed holes in engine tin and added a piece to the tine around the turbo. not pretty but should work.
also applied "alu zinc' to under side of tin and back side of tin on bumper.
thinking about adding more heat shielding above turbo.

wiper arm switch:
DONE
someone put in a switch that cuts off the switch, but only for low. i have not decided if i am going to leave it in or pull it out.
i removed the 'racing switch" and soldered the wire back together to look original.

front condensor fan burned up:
DONE
replaced that. it works now.


small 1 inch crack in weld on exhaust pipe that goes to the WG
DONE
bought a northern tool welder. got some stainless welding rods and fixed. not pretty but fixed

wire in a vacuum solenoid for retard pot
DONE
this was quite simple but took time to figure out and do.
i wired the switch on the side of the throttle body so it operates the solenoid.
whats neat about this is that you could use it to delay the retard of timing when going on boost. the bad is that it would be hard to set. right now i am using the contacts that will cut out the retard pot at part throttle.
its also totally reversible.

replace engine sound pad
DONE
i had not orginally planed on this. the rats got in there and made a home out of the old one.
i decided to go ahead and replace it since i am still waiting on my WUR form brain. you need to get that back to me, i keep speeding more money on the car since it is sitting!

ADD HEAD LIGHT RELAYS
almost doen with this. very easy the way i am doing it and virtually no invasion to the wiring...that cant easily be undone. this also makes it look oroginal.
i will do a post about it.

SEPERATE POWER TO THE FUEL PUMP RELAYS
DONE
i pulled the wire that connects the power to pin30 of the 2 realys and ran it to my unused fuse for the fog lights. then ran a wire from the main power to the fuse panel to the top of that fuse. this uses orignal fuses and orignal wiring except the jumper to the fog light fuse. anyway, it splits the load to 2 fuses. best thing is you can not tell anything was done.
when i am done, this car will be as perfect as it can be. no its a 25+ yr old car excuses.
__________________
86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:

Last edited by T77911S; 10-18-2013 at 10:44 AM..
Old 07-18-2013, 10:52 AM
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Garage
You might know this, or ha e a better way...

On the engine seal: I recently did this on my Carrera 3.0. I used a medium flat screwdriver and was able to gently pry the seal into the groove. It went quick, was a lot faster than trying to slide it in.
__________________
Jesper
Carrera 3.0 1975
930 1978 OEM Matte Schwartz, ANDIAL IC, BL WUR, SC cams. LMA-3 w. XD-16 and CP transducer
www.stauningwhisky.dk
Old 07-18-2013, 06:26 PM
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The relay next to the speed relay and the sending unit on the right cam chain cover are both parts of the lambda emissions system.

The sending unit disables the lambda system until the oil warms up to a certain temp so it runs a little richer then... and the enrichment relay disables the lambda system via the throttle position switch on the side of the throttle body when you floor it so it runs a little richer then
Old 07-18-2013, 07:25 PM
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oh yeah it's called open loop mode...
it's changing the frequency the inline injector/pulse valve is pulsing at and returning fuel from the lower differential chambers in the lambda fuel head to the fuel tank so as more fuel is returned from them to the tank and the diaphram seperating the upper and lower chambers drops lower in the fuel head uncovering the orifices in the top chambers it lets more fuel go to the injectors... so it runs a little richer.

btw, that white wire soldered to the pin in your picture from the plug for the speed relay.. thats the one that was making bad contact in my car when I bought it and it would shut the fuel pumps off and leave me stranded on the side of the road, at intersections, or even better on a bridge over the intracoastal waterway.

that white wire goes to the overboost sending unit and the yellow relay fuel pump ground chain from hell that most 930 owners eventually have to deal with. it even ties into the alarm system controller under the cowl by the glove box.

the power drain in the cabin might be the door light switches in the door jams that ground the interior lights that are hot all the time.
the glove box light switch is hot all the time too, if they weren't they wouldn't light up if the ignition is off.

you can put a digital ammeter in line with the battery cable and remove one fuse at a time to help find the power drain.

and.. those blower fans from harbor freight help make it bearable working on the car in this humid summer heat,,, they blow away some of the mosquitos too.
Old 07-18-2013, 07:52 PM
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the white wire. thats how i bypassed the speed relay. i did not need it anymore and it was just a point of failure for the fuel pump. with the MSD unit, i have a rev limiter in that.
the white wire is just grounded on my engine. they bypassed the overboost. i am planning on wiring that back in.

i figured that sender was some sort of temp sensor for the lamda system.

i need to wire a solenoid back in for the vacuum retard to the dist. i am planning on using the throttle switch for that, otherwise i could remove that stuff too.

i thought the speed relay disabled the O2 at around 3krpm.
__________________
86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 07-19-2013, 05:08 AM
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The speed relay is also the factory rev limiter that disconnects the ground to the fuel pump relays shutting them down around 7200rpm. I'm not sure what all else it might do. If you take the aluminum cover off you'll see two small relays on the PCB inside.

I installed a small black rocker switch next to the sunroof open/close rocker switch and use it to manually operate the vacuum solenoid that blocks vacuum retard to the late eightees distributor.
It will advance the timing a little when throwing the switch to close the vacuum retard solenoid and sometimes I use it to raise the idle speed about 300 rpms at traffic lights if I want to while the motor is still warming up around 3 minutes after a cold start.
At 3 minutes after cold start the AAR and WUR bimetallic spring heaters are fully warmed up and the idle will be a little low until the cylinders and heads are fully warmed up and that takes a few more minutes of running.

edit: I just noticed you recently posted in the sticky post on why my car doesn't start at the top of this page. You know your electrical stuff a lot better than me and the post above yours from billjam has nice wire diagrams of the fuel pump relay circut. Good stuff.
Sticky for common answers to why "My car doesn't start...."

Last edited by JFairman; 07-19-2013 at 06:16 AM..
Old 07-19-2013, 05:43 AM
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yea, i know the fuel side very well but thats it. my brother had some fuel pump problems before i got my 930 and he gave me a diagram so i went thru it pretty good. his tunred out to be the speed relay.it had some bad solder joints.

i just dont know some specifics on the 930 like that temp sensor. i can make a pretty good guess, but just need the final details. i am learning now that i have a 930 and i am going thru it pretty good right now.

like the diagram that i have seen floating around for the vacuum lines. i think it is wrong. it shows the vac advance going to a thermo time valve for engine warm up that is suppose to do what your switch does, raise RPM's. but the vacuum retard should go to that valve. blocking the advance at idle does nothing, blocking the retard at idle will raise the RPM's.
when i got my car, it was connected like the diagram shows, which i think is wrong.
i connected it the way i think is right.
i also saw an old post about timing. icant believe it took them so long to understand the 930 timing. anyway, i dont have any solenoid valves on my vacuum lines. i want one on the retard that works off the TPS to block the vacuum under boost. i too did the test of putting boost on the retard and advance, timing does not move. my car has been like that for a while.
perhaps this was part of the cause of bad leakdown when the PO had it. thank goodness i was not getting full boost.

i was very shocked to see the AFM cone. not much of one compared to the 911. i am guessing there is not as much movement of the plate as the 911. this makes me think fuel pressures are much more critical on the 930 vs the 911.
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86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 07-19-2013, 08:37 AM
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like the diagram that i have seen floating around for the vacuum lines. i think it is wrong. it shows the vac advance going to a thermo time valve for engine warm up that is suppose to do what your switch does, raise RPM's. but the vacuum retard should go to that valve. blocking the advance at idle does nothing, blocking the retard at idle will raise the RPM's.
when i got my car, it was connected like the diagram shows, which i think is wrong.
i connected it the way i think is right.


That mechanical thermovalve screwed into the intake manifold under the air flow meter housing you are talking about is origonally in the vacuum advance line - the diagrams you saw are correct.
The reason for that heat transfer operated mechanical thermovalve is to keep timing from advancing any more than centrifical advance alone until the motor heats up.
That way with timing not advancing as far, exhaust temperature is higher and that heats up the catalytic converter faster and lowers emissions sooner after a cold start and that made it so they could sell the car in the USA again starting in 1986.

Retarding timing raises exhaust temperature and advancing timing lowers exhaust temperature.

If you don't have a catalytic converter on the car then bypass that thermovalve and run the vacuum advance line directly to the vacuum advance pot on your distributor.
The advance pot is the outer one farthest from the distributor and the retard pot is the one closer to the distributor.

The way the 1986-1989 930 vacuum pot is designed turbo boost pressure has absolutely no effect on the vacuum retard pot at all! I have checked it and the vaccum advance pot with a mighty vac that can make pressure or vacuum so I know this for fact.

Only the outer side vacuum advance pot is affected by boost pressure and when it does get pressure it moves the diaphram inside the opposite direction and the linkage rotates the vacuum advance plate in the distributor the opposite direction and that retards the timing in the distributor

Only the late eightees 930's have origonal dual pot distributors from the factory with vacuum retard.
The only time vacuum retard is working is during deceleration, idle, and up to around 1500rpms and any rpm higher than that the throttle butterfly moves past the little hole in the throttle body wall that leads to the vacuum retard line and at that rpm point on up vacuum retard is non existant and does nothing.

The reason for vacuum retard at idle, a little above idle, and during closed throttle deceleration is to raise exhaust temperature and that raises the temperature in the catalytic converter and that lowers exhaust emissions.

You mention the metering cone venturi in the 930 compared to a 911.
The 911 CIS metering plate moves upward and the 930 metering plate moves downward so the cone will look quite different.

FWIW, the 930 air flow meter and fuel head assembly is origonally derived from the Mercedes 4.5 liter V8 CIS.
Old 07-19-2013, 09:28 AM
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there is a thermo time valve mounted on the block, not intake. same one?

my advance now goes directly to the TB. before, the retard went to the TB and the advance went to the TTV.

here is my setup

no O2 sensor
no freq valve
injectors- 009
WUR-054
FD- 037 with large fuel lines.
AFM- 205
header- ?
dual out exhaust- BORLA
RUF intercooler
K27- 7006
WG- tial .9bar
dist-

i want my vac retard connected back up. it idles better and leans it out a tad.
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86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 07-19-2013, 09:50 AM
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there is a thermo time valve mounted on the block, not intake. same one?

The thermo time valve is mounted in the left side cam chain housing cover and it has nothing to do with ignition timing or any vacuum lines...

It is electrical and mechanical and it opens the cold start injector in the intake manifold under the back side of the throttle body so it sprays extra fuel during cold weather starts while the starter motor is cranking the motor over.

It's thermostaically controlled injector spray dwell time is controlled by the temperature of the oil in the left side cam housing and a 12 volt heater element inside it.
It will only operate the cold start valve during the first time you try to start a cold motor so it doesn't flood out the motor with too much fuel if you repeatedly keep trying to start it unsuccesfully.
Old 07-19-2013, 10:06 AM
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updated
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86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 08-14-2013, 08:19 AM
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86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 08-17-2013, 05:52 PM
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86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 09-12-2013, 10:30 AM
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here is the sound pad and one of the engine. i will do some better pics.
i like the sound pad, although the fit could have been better.

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86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 09-13-2013, 08:07 AM
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3 months now and i am still waiting on my WUR to be modded so i added 2 more items to my list. i have not had much motivation to work on it the car in a while.
i am putting in head light relays since i am running higher wattage bulbs and i split the fuel pump load to 2 fuses. i am waiting on connectors to finish the headlight mod.m should be here today.
__________________
86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 10-18-2013, 10:48 AM
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drivers side door lock
DONE
would not lock or unlock with key. i wired the linkage back on. the plastic ball end needs to be replaced but i did not want to leave the door panel off with good weather.

front speakers dont work
im deaf anyway.


turbo seals.
i think the seals in the turbo are gone. sometimes LOTS of blue smoke when starting. oil in IC and turbo pipe.

fans noisy.
sometimes i get a loud squeal when i turn on the heat.

this car is as close to everything working as you can get. i am working on making it a "no excuses" car. you know, "its a 25 yr old car, there are things wrong with it" excuse.
but then i think once i do that, its gonna get wrecked. someone came SOOO close to rear ending me the other night. scared me to death. its kinda like paying off a car. it gets totaled 3months later.
__________________
86 930 42kmiles [__] RUNNING:[__] NOT RUNNING: ____77 911S widebody: SOLD
88 BMW 325is 200K+ SOLD
05 BMW 330CI 130K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
08 VOLVO V70 190K:: [__] RUNNING: [__] NOT RUNNING:
90 B2200[__] RUNNING:[] NOT RUNNING:__2000 MER E320 WAGON [] WRECKED:[]RUNNING:
Old 02-11-2014, 03:47 AM
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