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Thanks for the high praise, Cole! That means a lot coming from you, especially considering the awesome Sled you built. (Don't misplace it in all that white stuff again, y'hear? ;-)

And I completely agree about weight savings -- it can make the same car substantially quicker and feel as if it has another 50-100ft.lb. torque.

Swapping in a used stock 3.3L is one method, but not as straight-forward as it first seems, and sometimes you're better off working with your known engine you know rather than an unknown from a salvage yard.

How much does a 400hp turbo conversion cost? Not a zillion dollars.
You're looking to double the engine output, and you've already indicated that reliability is essential, so it really depends on:
a) the condition of the engine
b) your expectations of drivability and performance

Let's assume for (a) that the engine is sound, bearings and bottom end are all good, heads are in good shape, and no hack has been into this engine before. The top end is going to come apart and

Then all that's left is what you expect for drivability and performance, and that greatly affects price. To illustrate, here's 2 ways you can make 400hp:
- modified original Motronic injection blowing through stock AFM, pistons with the compression lowered, a stock 1986-89 930 heat exchanger system, and a K27 turbocharger
- 3.4L or 3.5L Turbo P&Cs with MAP-based programmable engine management, short stainless headers, and a Garrett ball bearing turbocharger.
Both have 400hp, and the two cars will drive very differently.

If you would like a detailed estimate, send me a PM and we'll review these specifics, work out the details, and determine a turn-key price.
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:57 PM
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There are plenty of 3.2L-to-Turbo conversion threads on here, and here's one we were involved with not so long ago:
America Roadster Turbo Project
Other than a really flashy intercooler and twin-plug ignition, this is a straight-forward engine rebuild + Turbo conversion:
* engine rebuild with Turbo P&Cs -- nothing fancy or exotic, just a solid quality rebuild
* common 930 Turbo bolt-on upgrades -- headers, muffler, turbo, intercooler
* engine management -- EFI + ignition + boost
Granted, this car is very lightweight around 2,400lb (if it isn't needed, it isn't there), but it is incredibly quick and very easy to drive.


BTW -- getting a 1987 Carrera down from 2,667 to even 2,400lb isn't exactly cheap, either. $0? Not if you want it to look good and/or be safe.

And on the "safety" note, completely agree with what Captain Kettle One said: don't even think about doing this without addressing suspension, brakes, and wheels & tires. You don't have to go crazy and install Motons, 355mm Brembos, and Fikses with PSCup tires, but do upgrade the car as a whole with balanced systems. It's much of what makes Porsches so fun to drive.


$0.02 from the peanut gallery. Carry on.
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Old 02-12-2014, 09:17 PM
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I would rather be driving
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboKraft View Post
but do upgrade the car as a whole with balanced systems. It's much of what makes Porsches so fun to drive.
Oh So True! It is not that hard to maintain chassis balance between amount of rubber, stopping power, suspension setup, transmission gearing and overall engine output and characteristics. Tip the scale too far in any direction and you will constantly fight the car. Get it all right when upgrading all the systems and it will be pure joy.
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Old 02-13-2014, 05:39 AM
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gearhead
 
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Chris does excellent work. Also wouldn't hurt to have a conversation with Pat Williams.

Budget some gearbox work in your plans, including an LSD. With 400hp traction becomes an issue.
Old 02-13-2014, 07:25 AM
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one of the great unwashed
 
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Throw out some numbers; $20K? $40K? How much for a stout, reliable, streetable 400 h.p.?
The three adjectives do not lend themselves to compatibility. You need to further define what you want. Until then, I'd go with the higher number. Engine only, of course.
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Old 02-13-2014, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpnovak View Post
Oh So True! It is not that hard to maintain chassis balance between amount of rubber, stopping power, suspension setup, transmission gearing and overall engine output and characteristics. Tip the scale too far in any direction and you will constantly fight the car. Get it all right when upgrading all the systems and it will be pure joy.
I prefer my version:
otherwise

you've got a 400hp turd


good for a drag car, that's about it (tho not really if it's left a useless 1legger) - whatever rocks yer werld, I guess...
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Old 02-13-2014, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Nader View Post
Throw out some numbers; $20K? $40K? How much for a stout, reliable, streetable 400 h.p.?

I'd consider a budget of $20-$25K for the motor. That should cover most any surprises, and might leave you with some change. This is for a conservative reliable build. Add in a 930 trans, refreshed with a shorter r&p, lsd., and shifter, that would be in the $3-6K range. Then suspension, brake up grade, and bigger wheels & tires to keep it all balanced. That would add another $3-$6k. It's easy to go crazy, then all bets are off.
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Old 02-13-2014, 11:23 AM
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If it is an '87 911 Carrera, then it has a G50 and there's no need to change that out. IMO, that's the gearbox Porsche should have installed in every 930 1987-onwards. The closer gear ratios of the Carrera 'box are a total blast for a street-driven Turbo.
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Old 02-13-2014, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krasuskyp View Post
I prefer my version:
otherwise
you've got a 400hp turd

good for a drag car, that's about it (tho not really if it's left a useless 1legger) - whatever rocks yer werld, I guess...
Man, this board wouldn't be the same without you!
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Old 02-13-2014, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by krasuskyp View Post

you've got a 400hp turd[/B][/INDENT]
I think this is about what I have. It handles well, That's about it. Way too much power for non lsd 915 gear ratios. Lights up in first and second at will and part of third gears. And my brakes........hmmmmm Turd.
I have wide body metal flares going on in the next couple months and big fat wheels to fill them, Then I need to get the lsd and g50 or some such.
Maybe bigger brakes should be first....nah, I like widebody first. Famous last words.
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Old 02-13-2014, 12:37 PM
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Brando - def didn't mean any direct offense w/ my (typical) stoopidity... by any means. Hope it wasn't taken that way.

I only meant it as in, having all that power w/o being able to stop / turn commensurately is a bit... silly.

'twas all

I bet it's a hoot. I'd prob do the brakes before the fenders, but that's just me. Cool you're doing that tho, will be a neat setup.

Chris... hey, I tried leavin all yous to yer own volition for 18mos after I sold my car. Had to buy my car back and return here to help muckup this place and bring things down a notch!

Hey, I'm good for 'something'... (and today's re-take was entiiiirely sans any Kettle or Genny 'inspiration'!)
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| '58 TR3A | '01 //S8 | '95 //S6 6gang | '88 ///M5 | '87 190E 2.3-16 |
Old 02-13-2014, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
If it is an '87 911 Carrera, then it has a G50 and there's no need to change that out. IMO, that's the gearbox Porsche should have installed in every 930 1987-onwards. The closer gear ratios of the Carrera 'box are a total blast for a street-driven Turbo.
This. The G50-01 is better geared and shifts better than any 930 ever will.
Old 02-13-2014, 01:22 PM
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Thanks for all the responses. I have a lot to think about. Someone raised the good point that it might be worth just getting a sorted 930.

If I were smarter, I'd be waiting out some of these aging car enthusiast Baby Boomers for when they let go of their hopped up cars in the next few years.

Scratch that, if I were smarter, I wouldn't be seeking out 400 h.p. street cars.
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Old 02-13-2014, 02:33 PM
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400hp in a street car isn't that much these days............but most weigh about a thousand tons.
Your car with 400hp and 2700lbs and close ratios is really mental
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Old 02-13-2014, 02:50 PM
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I'd like to get 350 +/- h.p. in my Crewcab. That would be just about right.
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Old 02-13-2014, 02:53 PM
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Drop the compression to about 7.5 or 8:1, add 1 bar boost. A K27HFS would easily do it. Play around with different turbos if you want. Add aftermarket EFI so you can tune it right. You already have ported heads, great manifold and running Motronic EFI. Just plumb exhaust, turbo and intercooler.



Whoosh! Enjoy.



Since you already have a G50 car you are all set.
That sounds familiar!
Old 02-13-2014, 06:46 PM
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I have a drop in chip that allows up to 1.2 bar of boost safely on pump gas as long as the CR is dropped to 7.5:1.
Old 02-13-2014, 07:17 PM
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The Red Rocket was 360WHP at 2700 pounds wet with me in it and had stock SC brakes. I never had a problem with them and could lock up the tires at will, which I figured was good enough for a street car. You don't have to worry about brake fade on the street (at least if you are sane). The 915 was a hoot but too short for that power. It was time for a 930. Now that I have one I find the tranny gear ratios very good with the power level range I am shooting for. Brakes are awesome but way too much for the street. If you ever use 930 brakes to their fullest on the street you're looking at serious jail time.

Want 400WHP? Budget $25K if you plan to go inside and mod a 3.2L engine. The bolt-on go fast parts will cost you $10K of that total. If a shop is doing everything it may be a bit more before all is sorted.
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Old 02-13-2014, 07:58 PM
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You don't have to worry about brake fade on the street (at least if you are sane)....If you ever use 930 brakes to their fullest on the street you're looking at serious jail time...
<---------------------exhibit A!
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Old 02-13-2014, 08:39 PM
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The Red Rocket was 360WHP at 2700 pounds wet with me in it and had stock SC brakes. I never had a problem with them and could lock up the tires at will, which I figured was good enough for a street car. You don't have to worry about brake fade on the street (at least if you are sane)...
That's exactly what I was thinking. A stock Carrera already has more chassis than engine. Mine already has the optional sport suspension, limited slip, full spoilers, and I added Fuchs 8s and 9s. When I used to do track days, I installed brake cooling ducts, Pagid Orange pads and Castrol SRF brake fluid. Never had brake fade at the track after that. Since I no longer take this car to the track (I race a '69 Alfa Spider now), I won't need the kind of hardware to handle repeated braking from 150 to 40 MPH, taking hairpins at the limits of adhesion, then blasting off the apex to do it over and over again, lap after lap. I've got the Alfa for that, albeit at a slower pace. I love my Porsche, and I think I'd love it more if it pinned me back in the seat a lot harder when I took off from a rolling start.

I appreciate the concern for safety, but some make it sound like putting the key in the ignition of an overpowered car will result in the car suddenly peeling out and careening into a ditch, bursting into flames. I personally think of the throttle as something more than an on/off switch.
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Old 02-13-2014, 09:32 PM
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