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What's the real cost of efi conversion?

What is the total cost of the efi ONLY conversion by the time you gathered up all the parts. I'm interested in the bare bones set up using the stock manifold.

I bought a '76 3.0 turbo motor, not running. I'm starting to pack up the parts to send out for machining. Going with the basic mods, SC cams, ported heads by Turbo Craft.

Since I would need to send the fuel head, wur and injectors out to get rebuilt/ modded, the subject of a efi conversion came up. I couldn't find any specific threads on converting a 3.0. I skimmed a couple of the MS write ups, and looked at the Clewett conversion at $5280.00. For ignition I want to use either the stock distributor/cdi, or Electromotive hpv-1, since I have them, and on a budget.
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'79 930/DP935
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Old 06-16-2014, 02:44 PM
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Old 06-16-2014, 03:03 PM
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Here's a conversion parts list. Add pricing based on specific brand/model chosen per item. I put prices in brackets for what we commonly spec out in our conversions at TurboKraft, all new parts:

Hardware:
* EFI Injector Blocks & Insulators + Fuel Rails + Rail Mounts [$1200]
...also includes manifold port plugs, block off plate for CSV
* Injectors [$390-804]
* TPS conversion kit [$188 with bolt-on adapter kit]
* MAP sensor [$105]
* Air Temp sensor [$35]
* Head (engine) Temp sensor [$198 with adapter kit]
* Crankshaft speed sensor + trigger wheel [$190 hall-effect, we machine the flywheel for timing teeth]
* Camshaft position sensor + trigger (if running full sequential injection) [$100 hall-effect]
* ECU [$2455 for TK/AEM]
...also includes Lambda sensor and driver/controller, start-up calibration file
* engine wiring harness [$1800-3500 Mil-spec, lightweight fine-strand wire, shrink sealed & terminated, shrink labeled, as PnP as can be done for a 930]

You can reuse your distributor, simply removing the vacuum actuator, magnetic trigger, and centrifugal weights. Lock it all down so it's a shaft with a rotor on top, nothing else.

You can reuse the stock CDI & coil, or upgrade to a newer aftermarket high output CDI & coil ($320+).


Most flexible for the price point will be Megasquirt MS3. Others on this board have more experience with it, can chime in with regards to its price, cost of harness, etc.

Separate from this is plumbing the fuel system. Cost varies by chassis and condition.
TurboKraft use lightweight PTFE lines as standard, Bosch or Aeromotive pressure regulator & filter (gasoline or ethanol).
There are more economical options, like using push-lock fuel lines & fittings, and a Fuelab or similar regulator.
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Old 06-16-2014, 05:13 PM
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So Chris according to your post above, $9K for EFI PnP using AEM ??
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Old 06-17-2014, 03:20 AM
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Nobody here using Electromotive Engine management?
Old 06-17-2014, 04:40 AM
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Using Motec it will be around $10-15k. Depends on parts and labor.
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Old 06-17-2014, 05:29 AM
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I am currently at $4000.00 for my SDS EFI conversion. Hope to be back on the road in 2 weeks. Getting motor back this weekend.

SDS EFI EM-5 6F including options (Twin Coils, fuel pump circuit relay, sensors MAP, CHT, Knock, TPS , fast idle solenoid, RPM switch - Shipped $2700.00

GSF EFI kit (blocks, rails, lines,FPR, adapters, seals, Crank Pulley) - Shipped $700.00

6 - 55 lbs Injectors - Shipped $300.00

AEM Wideband - Shipped $200.00

Forge Blow Off Valve - Shipped $150.00

Still have some stuff to pick up. Air intake tubing, was thinking of changing turbo, and wastegate.
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1988 Porsche 930 Targa - 3.4L Twin Plug Motor, DC 13 Cams, Supertec Head Studs, ARP Rod Bolts, Port and Polished Heads, Garretson Andial Intercooler, GSX 61 BB Stage 5Turbo, Tial F46 WG .8 Bar Spring, PowerHaus Headers, Rarly8 Dual Tip Muffler, MS3 Pro EFI conversion, 57lbs. Cobra Injectors, Center Force Stage 2 Clutch , Rebuilt 4 Speed with LSD.

Last edited by jpilcher; 06-18-2014 at 08:35 AM..
Old 06-17-2014, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slow&rusty View Post
So Chris according to your post above, $9K for EFI PnP using AEM ??
Yes, everything in a box, as plug-and-play as you can make it, is about $9k: sequential injection + ignition, Lambda, boost control, injectors & fuel plumbing, sensors, Bosch 3-wire idle stabilizer motor, ECU with program, and tech support.

The only thing not included is basic shop supplies, like vacuum hose, clamps, etc.

Cost can go up with more controls and components, for example:
* twin plug ignition, multi-channel CDI, coil-on-plug
* single or twin knock sensors
* ethanol content sensor & plumbing
* sensors for oil temp, oil pressure, fuel pressure
No extra features/codes to purchase with the ECU, it comes fully enabled.

Cost can go down if you want to tackle making a wiring harness, use less expensive fuel lines & fittings, don't want ECU-controlled boost, etc.
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Old 06-17-2014, 10:31 AM
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Here are some amounts of my SDS EFI conversion:

SDS EFI EM-4 6F including options (fuel pump circuit, sensors MAP, CHT, Knock, TPS circuit only, fast idle solenoid, RPM switch):

2101USD shipped

GSF EFI kit (blocks, rails, lines, Aeromotive FPR, adapters, seals) + injectors (ca. 400USD):

1510USD shipped

Turbokraft TPS kit:

203USD shipped

Note: Shipping is to Switzerland, so prices for US would be a bit lower...

PS. I replaced the GM knock sensor with a Bosch (ca. 65USD), details later

Some more costs of course not included like connectors, materieal for inlet pipe etc...

However here some more about:

Another EFI conversion
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Old 06-17-2014, 11:04 AM
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If you go with a Megasquirt 3x with all the bells and whistles it's less than 1 k for the ecu wiring and most of the sensors. It will support twin plug coil on plug. full sequential spark and fuel. Knock and boost control. Selective fuel maps with a fuel sensor. So you can tune it run on e-85 or pump gas and it will adjust fuel and timing maps accordingly. It will also do stuff like variable boost for different gears, Shift light, launch control, and something called turbo lag reduction or something like that. Which changes the timing to keep the turbo spooled up between shifts but apparently is really terrible to the life of the turbo. A racing only application
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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's.
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Old 06-17-2014, 11:11 AM
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Excellent question Harold!
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Old 06-17-2014, 11:52 AM
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To recover your cost if you go full sequential instead of cannibalizing your distributor. just put a steel screw and a hall sensor in the air pump pulley wheel. Then you can use the stud for mounting the crank sensor on the crank pulley. Then sell the distributor along with the CIS parts.
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88 turbo Guards red Targa slant nose, and yes I am a horsepower junkie, 3.4liter,7.5 to 1 JE pistons, Adjustable WUR, Imagine fuel head, 1 bar waste gate headers,allthe cis toys. Now apart to become the next EFI monster. fabbing my own intake, headers Individual throttle bodies, MS-3, pauter rods, Xtreme twin plugged heads, gt-2 evo cams cop's.
05 Cayenne S lapis blue
Old 06-17-2014, 12:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboKraft View Post
...* Camshaft position sensor + trigger (if running full sequential injection) [$100 hall-effect]...
Chris, is this something you offer? I don't see it on your website.
Old 06-18-2014, 05:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken911 View Post
To recover your cost if you go full sequential instead of cannibalizing your distributor. just put a steel screw and a hall sensor in the air pump pulley wheel. Then you can use the stud for mounting the crank sensor on the crank pulley. Then sell the distributor along with the CIS parts.
Definitely -- sell off all the old CIS stuff to help offset costs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by will hung View Post
Chris, is this something you offer? I don't see it on your website.
Yes, PM me.
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Old 06-18-2014, 08:31 AM
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It looks like the minimum starting price is $4000.00. The Electromotive set up looks pretty good, but I notice no one has tried it. Is there a reason.
Would like to hear from the guys who did their own installation, and have it running and fully sorted.
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Old 06-19-2014, 05:21 AM
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I converted my existing Motronic based Carrera 3.2 (3.4) to MegaSquirt II and EDIS ignition for $1500.

Of course, I already had injectors and fuel rails.

From memory breakdown:

1. MS II ECU - $444
2. EDIS ignition - $100 used
3. Crown Victoria plug wires Bosch - $60
4. TPS and harness from BMW used - $50
5. Inlet air temp sensor (IAT) GM - $20
6. Crank trigger, VR sensor bracket, and dizzy block off - $250
7. Fuse panel ganged - $30
8. Injector pigtails - $36
9. Minitimer connectors to hook to OEM 911 sensors - $50
10. TunerStudio tuning software - $50
11. MegaLogViewer datalogging software - $20
12. Lots of raw wires, solder, flux, soldering iron, etc. - $?

Last edited by Tippy; 06-19-2014 at 06:35 AM..
Old 06-19-2014, 06:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gumba View Post
It looks like the minimum starting price is $4000.00. The Electromotive set up looks pretty good, but I notice no one has tried it. Is there a reason.
Would like to hear from the guys who did their own installation, and have it running and fully sorted.
I have a tech 1 Electromotive. Can't unlock it for a retune from old cams to Gt2 evo cams. Took it out and sent it to them. They said it could not be unlocked for retune even by them. Nothing wrong with the way it functions from last tune, just not retuneable and have to get a new one. Anyone know more than they do so I can retune it?
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Last edited by voitureltd; 06-19-2014 at 06:26 AM..
Old 06-19-2014, 06:24 AM
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Can you hook it up to a laptop and communicate with it. If so their should have been a file named to save tune. Sometimes you can make minor change and give tune new name and then go from their. I've used their engine management systems from the beginning 25 years ago.
Old 06-19-2014, 06:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gumba View Post
It looks like the minimum starting price is $4000.00. The Electromotive set up looks pretty good, but I notice no one has tried it. Is there a reason.
Would like to hear from the guys who did their own installation, and have it running and fully sorted.
From the several cars that have come in for Tec3r/GT installations/fixes/tuning, our $0.02 is it is a lower-end system.
The appeal (as we see it) is that it is sold as an all-in-one package: comes with computer, unterminated flying lead harness, ignition coils, and narrowly defined GM-based sensor set so there's no variables or extra setup time.
But there's a laundry list of shortcomings, too, that waste hours in setup and diagnosis, and affect drivability.
In more than one instance, we've removed a TEC system and replaced it with a different computer & harness, and gotten better drivability, torque, power.
If the choice was between a TEC-whatever and a MS3, I'd install the MS3.
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Old 06-19-2014, 10:06 AM
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Porsche 935. Unfortunately no info with it. Upper motor was by D. Jarvis with enough guts that it bent a rod on initial break in. I bought the car with broken motor about 6 years ago. Just got it finished with Carrillo rods and better cams and whole bottom end and put it on dyno. No ability to communicate and the seller has no contact info. So sent it to Electromotive. Even they claim they can't unlock it. WTF. I have another Electromotive tech 3 which is no problem in another 930. Sorry if I hijacked the thread but the initial thread starter indicated he was going to reuse the same system which may be a waste of his time based upon my experience. I think Electromotive should be more responsible for a expensive product that has such a defect that it can not be unlocked and re programmed, even by the manufacturer. Anyone have any ideas how not to throw it in with the junk ?
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Last edited by voitureltd; 06-19-2014 at 01:04 PM..
Old 06-19-2014, 12:58 PM
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