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Crotchety Old Bastard
 
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If you get greedy the 915 will not work. I ran a stock 915 for 10 years behind 300whp with no issue. Added my headers which jumped power to 360whp and broke it. I then built a Euro '86 915 specific for my engine with all the WEVO stuff and custom gears. Had the factory oil cooler. That tranny held. 400whp is a step they cannot make unless you put G50 money into the 915. When we went 400whp we broke 4 trannies in 2 years. One so bad it busted the case. A cradle was built to hold it together and that worked ... then the $1000 2nd gear set exploded.

Old 11-25-2014, 08:21 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #41 (permalink)
Brando
 
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I think I'm going 930. I'm too cheep to go g50 though I feel it would be the best thing. It's just too pricey and complicated.
Old 11-25-2014, 08:24 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #42 (permalink)
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if you were running a 993 3.6 how hard would it be to swap a 930 4 speed tranny into the car? what down sides would i be facing?
im with you ^ the g50 is just to much money!
Old 11-25-2014, 08:28 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #43 (permalink)
gearhead
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quattrorunner View Post
I think I'm going 930. I'm too cheep to go g50 though I feel it would be the best thing. It's just too pricey and complicated.
I've got a decent 930 sitting under the bench in my shop gathering dust.
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Old 11-25-2014, 09:58 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #44 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
I've got a decent 930 sitting under the bench in my shop gathering dust.
Does it have the solid webs around the stud holes? If they're hollow, it can't be shortened (and so won't bolt into a pre-87 911 for the same reasons the G50 won't)

(and when did those change, anyway - was that the later, mid-80's castings?)

But if it's the 76-77 short bell 930 box, that's got to be worth money...
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'77 S with '78 930 power and a few other things.
Old 11-25-2014, 10:39 AM
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gearhead
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spuggy View Post
Does it have the solid webs around the stud holes? If they're hollow, it can't be shortened (and so won't bolt into a pre-87 911 for the same reasons the G50 won't)

(and when did those change, anyway - was that the later, mid-80's castings?)

But if it's the 76-77 short bell 930 box, that's got to be worth money...
Not shortenable. The solid holes were introduced in 1986. I would need to check but memory says it is a 1983 or 1984.

A couple places (I believe Patrick is one of them) will weld up the hollow section with material and then through drill it. However, not an approach I have ever really been fond of.
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Old 11-25-2014, 10:52 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #46 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Monson View Post
Not shortenable. The solid holes were introduced in 1986. I would need to check but memory says it is a 1983 or 1984.
Ah, thanks! I had it the other way round in my head.

Quote:
A couple places (I believe Patrick is one of them) will weld up the hollow section with material and then through drill it. However, not an approach I have ever really been fond of.
Heh...

For the benefit of those wondering why you'd shorten a 78-88 930 box; it's the same bell housing length as an unmolested G50 and for precisely the same reason - they both used the taller rubber-centered clutch. Which makes them too long to just bolt into a pre-87 911.
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'77 S with '78 930 power and a few other things.
Old 11-25-2014, 11:19 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #47 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spuggy View Post
For the benefit of those wondering why you'd shorten a 78-88 930 box; it's the same bell housing length as an unmolested G50 and for precisely the same reason - they both used the taller rubber-centered clutch. Which makes them too long to just bolt into a pre-87 911.
I've been wondering about this.

Does this mean a N/A '87-'89 G50/00 or G50/01 will bolt into a '78-'88 930 chassis with a 3.3 engine and no machining required to the G50 and no torsion tube mods to the chassis?

The 3.3 engine sits back further in the 930 chassis vs. a 911 chassis. My '87 930 chassis even has 2 different sets of trans crossmember mount holes.

Does anyone know?
Old 11-25-2014, 11:32 AM
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Brando
 
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This brings another dimension of questions>>>> Who makes a trans mount that bolts onto the 930 box but places the bolt holes correctly for the 911 chassis? I've seen modded mounts made to fit the 930 box but would rather just buy one. I'll cut it and weld it though if I need to.
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Old 11-25-2014, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spuggy View Post
G50 is an expensive conversion - and one you'll probably never see a realistic return on.
You'll see the return the moment you shift gears. The modern synchros of the G50 are a night-and-day difference compared to the 915/930 synchros, allowing smoother, faster shifts with very positive engagement.

Now let's talk clutch:
It's easy for a lightly modified Turbo engine, one with the standard bolt-on upgrades, to over-power a 915's 225mm diameter clutch. A clutch with enough clamping strength usually results in a very still pedal, difficult to modulate: high clamping force pressure plate, metallic disc.
With a G50, you get a 240mm diameter clutch. More clutch diameter = more surface area = more grip, more torque capacity, even if the pressure plate has the same clamping force. There are several aluminum pressure plates and organic, spring-hub discs available to match up to an engine's output. And even with the strongest pressure plate, the pedal effort is reduced thanks to the hydraulic clutch release mechanism -- no more clutch cable.


No, a G50 swap is not inexpensive, but it is utterly transformative.
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Old 11-28-2014, 07:06 AM
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I may have an extra 87 930 shortenable bell housing. Also a extra mainshaft if you want to use your car while it is getting machined. Patrick motorsports shortened one for me a few years ago. As I remember the price was around $1k. Also I have an extra 75-77 930 trans with race gears and 934 number internal parts just inspected with some new syncros & dog teeth as required otherwise it needed very little ( case transaxle numbers are not easily readable anymore so the matching number people most likely will not be interested ) which I might part with but that would get you into G50 price catagory. I was going to exchange it with the RUF 5spd in my 77 Aubergine 930 or keep it for a spare for my race car however those ideas are on the back burner for now. PM with ph# if interested in any stuff mentioned above. Thanks, Tony@VoitureLTD.
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Last edited by voitureltd; 11-28-2014 at 10:00 AM..
Old 11-28-2014, 07:53 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #51 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TurboKraft View Post
You'll see the return the moment you shift gears. The modern synchros of the G50 are a night-and-day difference compared to the 915/930 synchros, allowing smoother, faster shifts with very positive engagement.

Now let's talk clutch:
It's easy for a lightly modified Turbo engine, one with the standard bolt-on upgrades, to over-power a 915's 225mm diameter clutch. A clutch with enough clamping strength usually results in a very still pedal, difficult to modulate: high clamping force pressure plate, metallic disc.
With a G50, you get a 240mm diameter clutch. More clutch diameter = more surface area = more grip, more torque capacity, even if the pressure plate has the same clamping force. There are several aluminum pressure plates and organic, spring-hub discs available to match up to an engine's output. And even with the strongest pressure plate, the pedal effort is reduced thanks to the hydraulic clutch release mechanism -- no more clutch cable.

No, a G50 swap is not inexpensive, but it is utterly transformative.[/QUOTE]

+1.

LOL. What I meant was that you'll never see financial return from investing in a G50 conversion, so from that perspective it's dead money.

If you don't plan to ever sell the car, and just want to develop it and do it "right", it's pretty much a no-brainer. 930's with 5-speeds rock. A 930 with a G50 is freakin' awesome.

Couldn't agree more about the clutch. A 915 pressure plate to hold 400 ft/lbs is utterly miserable if you get caught in traffic, even worse with a puck - it's hard to provide the required finesse when your calf is in spasm because you've been operating a leg press for 20 minutes straight....

There is a point, power-wise, at which it makes no sense whatsoever not to run a 930 or G50 box. I personally couldn't go backwards to 4 speeds (and I think the chances are good that it's not that much cheaper) - there's just no substitute for having the right gear....

Even ignoring the shifting on the G50 (which is fabulously precise, and something you couldn't fail to enjoy), just being able to use that wall o' torque without getting twitchy about what it might be doing to the 915 is worth it...
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Old 11-29-2014, 11:43 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #52 (permalink)
 
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I have read this entire post (tonight) as I have a 70 RSR 930 engine being built with twin turbo set up...so I am worried about my Trans (a 915).

Anyway, I have no money or I would ask if this is a good buy...a 77 930 right her tonight on Pelican...FS:
930 Trans Short Bell housing Short R&P LSD
Old 12-08-2014, 05:49 PM
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Brando
 
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It's a good buy, but more than that it's a rare find.
I'd get it but I gave up looking for a short bell trans and just got me a long bell and am shortening.
Old 12-08-2014, 06:40 PM
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Eng-o-neer
 
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I'm suddenly thankful I have a mere 270hp 3.6 behind my 915...
Old 12-08-2014, 08:21 PM
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Brando
 
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Quote:
I'm suddenly thankful I have a mere 270hp 3.6 behind my 915...
I'm sure that's a great engine to have.



But...............
Old 12-08-2014, 08:29 PM
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I NEED BOOST!!!! ^^^^^^


My 915-rebuilt back in 1994-still holding up well-But then again I didn't drive the car 10yrs after.
Kep Clutch Stage 2 (light weight PP & Organic Disc) put in 2/2012-All good for now.. I don't get on 1st or 2nd gear..
Just like doing Hwy-Runs.

Walt
Old 12-09-2014, 06:16 AM
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gearhead
 
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Fs 1987 930 transaxle
No affiliation. But can be shortened, has Albins gears, LSD and billet side cover.

Old 12-17-2014, 07:24 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #58 (permalink)
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