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930 Panorama Article

Here's the 930 Pano article from October. Not really impressed with the market evaluation or the information compared to the people on this and F-chat forums.

Sorry guys .... was contacted by Pano. Copyright infringement was tossed about. Had to delete the content.

All that aside ... nice to see even PCNA giving the 930 the love it deserves.


Last edited by Shadetree930; 10-28-2014 at 06:12 PM..
Old 10-24-2014, 04:19 PM
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The article really dogs the 4-speed without any of the historical background behind the homologation for the 934 and 935: “While some called the four-speed a step backwards, Porsche wouldn’t address the critics until the 1989 model year.” What critics besides the current G-50 NA Porsche crowd? The prices for the 1989 model year are bogus with absolutely no real sales data for the prices listed. They have a 1989 usable/as is coupe at $75K and a 1975 model year usable/as is at $50K. Bogus with no real sales data…
Old 10-25-2014, 06:03 AM
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Agree and lots of other biased info comparing the 930 project ( race or street) models to their other beloved high performance non turbo models, based upon their limited knowledge. However all in all a step in the right direction. After all for years they have either ignored or poo pooed the unloved stepchild now taking center stage with other special Porsche models. Even, until recently, the Ferrari Chat guys give the early 930s more respect ( and seem to know more) than the authors that write articles at Panos. They need to get up to speed as many who read it may not be so knowledgeable and take some of their perspective/conclusions as real. I doubt a 75 is now worth less than any other year and is way off. I know of 1975 sales about twice the price ( three yeas ago in Germany) as for any other year.
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Old 10-25-2014, 07:05 AM
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However all in all a step in the right direction. After all for years they have either ignored or poo pooed the unloved stepchild now taking center stage with other special Porsche models.
Good point - kudos to Pano for even doing an article on the 930.
Old 10-25-2014, 08:09 AM
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Thanks for posting this. The only real misleading part of this article is the statement about 20k being produced. Yes, over 14 years. More importantly not nearly that many exist today.
Old 10-25-2014, 04:40 PM
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Thanks for posting, I skimmed through it last night. Can't believe how incorrect the valuation information is!

Do love that they have a Casablanca Beige '78 in there
Old 10-25-2014, 04:48 PM
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As i remember when i read it they weren't really kind on slants either.

I didn't learn anything new but I always do when they write about 944 turbos or longhoods and I appreciate the focus.




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Old 10-25-2014, 05:03 PM
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I thought Prescott Kelly was a literature and poster expert. What's his background with vehicle valuation? It's a serious question and not meant to insult the author.
Old 10-25-2014, 05:38 PM
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Actually, I was glad to see PCA finally educating its membership on the 930's significance in motorsports and the prestige it brought to the Porsche name. Knowing Prescott I am sure he was well aware of those virtues well before he started to write the article.

Some may disagree with the published values (your prerogative, you are the experts) but there is no denying the impact of the Panorama Article. There are now more than a few Porsche 4-Door and SUV drivers that now know Porsche built a very special car in the '70's and '80's, the 930!


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Old 10-25-2014, 08:37 PM
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Bud agreed, the article brings the 930 a new level of interest and knowledge to the novice Porsche world. But the "turbo values" they state are a point of contention with me and others on this forum. I don't think nearly enough thought, evaluation and research went into the putting these "numbers" together. How they decided to evaluate comparable 76-77 or 78-79 US spec cars with a $30k discrepancy is beyond me. Unfortunately many members will use these numbers to either buy, sell, trade 930s in the near future.

The price evaluation focuses on the US spec cars which is understandable. But then adds the '75s as if they're US spec cars.They value all RoW cars from '80 to '85 as if they're the same. There were several advances and styling changes between those years including the newer interior in '85. What about RoW "euro" cars imported during US spec production years? "Add 15% for documented Last 50" '79s, regardless of condition or originality? I don't think it's that easy.

They spent 12 pages regurgitating the same information in Ludvigsen's book, among other P-cars books. This makes me think twice about other market updates in Pano and the accuracy of the information they publish. Sorry if I'm too critical but posting a disclaimer stating "What we present is out best guesses for right now," isn't good enough for PCA's magazine when evaluating P-cars.
Old 10-25-2014, 10:17 PM
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Bud agreed, the article brings the 930 a new level of interest and knowledge to the novice Porsche world. But the "turbo values" they state are a point of contention with me and others on this forum. I don't think nearly enough thought, evaluation and research went into the putting these "numbers" together. How they decided to evaluate comparable 76-77 or 78-79 US spec cars with a $30k discrepancy is beyond me. Unfortunately many members will use these numbers to either buy, sell, trade 930s in the near future.

The price evaluation focuses on the US spec cars which is understandable. But then adds the '75s as if they're US spec cars.They value all RoW cars from '80 to '85 as if they're the same. There were several advances and styling changes between those years including the newer interior in '85. What about RoW "euro" cars imported during US spec production years? "Add 15% for documented Last 50" '79s, regardless of condition or originality? I don't think it's that easy.

They spent 12 pages regurgitating the same information in Ludvigsen's book, among other P-cars books. This makes me think twice about other market updates in Pano and the accuracy of the information they publish. Sorry if I'm too critical but posting a disclaimer stating "What we present is out best guesses for right now," isn't good enough for PCA's magazine when evaluating P-cars.
Very well said, I completely agree.
Old 10-25-2014, 11:19 PM
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Any numbers posted in any volatile market will be wrong. People always insist on accurate charts with todays prices, when there is no such thing.
I really do not believe anybody could have done much better.
The 'unwashed masses' needed a heads up on 930's and 'Pano' did that, kudos to them for it.
All in all good article.
Old 10-26-2014, 05:11 AM
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also agree, great the 930 got so much focus and ink

unfortunate it was penned by an author who is a 356 / longhood snob - at least twice referencing 20k production / not rare... yeah... because 356s / longhoods are 'rare'

And then the "boulevardier" and "highway cruiser" comments - yeah, OK... um... no. No focus to the rock 'em sock 'em bare knuckle brawl nature when trying to tame? No mention of the pinnacle of Porsche's driving experience, one that defines the marque - thru it's racing successes - through today? Alrighty then.

Not to mention, the read was pretty bland / dry - to me, at least... like was said, a huge regurgitate of Excellence Was Expected, amongst others.

Loved the comment about US imports ceasing due to emissions and "weight issues"... um, wut?

Also agreed on all the valuation flimflam... swing and a miss. A huge LOL @ the grey market cars dig - seems he's stuck in 1995 when that may have actually mattered???

But like stated, a step in the right direction at least...
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Old 10-26-2014, 06:12 AM
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It's a poorly done article, no doubt. Kinda disappointing considering how far the magazine has come since Pete Stout came on board. Market updates are always suspect. Just recall Bruce Anderson and his "buy the newest Porsche you can afford" bias. Those taking his advice missed out on awesome cars.
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Old 10-26-2014, 12:12 PM
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When BA said buy the newest car you can afford they were all aircooled. It found advice then. Not anymore. I'd bet he'd agree, maybe not. But the thoughts at the time were the mid year cars and the dangers of grabbing one of those when an sc car looked similar. These days they're all fixed for the most part. I'd say we can effectively forget that advise of his. It's no longer valid.
Old 10-26-2014, 12:37 PM
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A very well written balanced article on all counts including value. The reasons the broader Porsche community did not and most do not today take well to the car was well explained. Yes, the four speed was very disliked then as now with stock engine configuration which is what any investment grade car has.

And don't get me started about what Ferrari owners know that the general
Porsche population do not. A Ferrari owner will buy a $1M car that can not sit in traffic and idle without overheating then tell you what a great engineering masterpiece it is.
Old 10-27-2014, 11:04 AM
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A Ferrari owner will buy a $1M car that can not sit in traffic and idle without overheating then tell you what a great engineering masterpiece it is.
A prime audience for a 930. The 930 does just about everything right compared to most performance cars built at that time ( and for some years since) and that includes some Porsche models they (at Panos) seem to adore.
4spd? Once you learn how to drive it works just fine. Just have to get used to not having a granny 1st and doing hole shots etc. It seems they are not used to a model that was primarily engineered to handle up to 750HP and still make it street usable. Can't satisfy everyone.
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Old 10-27-2014, 11:17 AM
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Some interesting feedback on the Ferrari Chat sites on both of the Porsche Blogs regarding Panos article.
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Last edited by voitureltd; 10-28-2014 at 08:43 AM..
Old 10-28-2014, 08:30 AM
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It seems that all enthusiast magazines, when writing about older cars, have a tough time satisfying the two audiences which read them: those with less knowledge, looking to learn more, and those (like us) who already know quite a bit and are looking to either gain even more esoterica, or to confirm what we already have stored in our memory banks. I've read the English monthly "Classic & Sportscar" for almost thirty years now (it feels odd to acknowledge that), and have learned that, essentially, it publishes two kinds of articles: the general interest, basic stuff about MGB's or something similarly mainstream, and specific stories about something more particular, like Mick Walsh driving a pre-war Mercedes GP car and recalling it's history. I find the latter variety of articles worth reading but seldom read the former, although understand that the more simplistic stuff is useful and of interest to someone, and helps keep the magazine in business.
What really gets my dander up, however, is when any article presents information with its pages which is clearly wrong. I canceled my "Hemmings" European car magazine for this reason....it was just poorly written and often contained obvious factual errors, representative of lazy writing and insufficient editing. Speaking of which, weak editing is a major fault with the post-Pete Stoudt era "Excellence" (hopefully I have spelled Pete's last name properly), which is a bummer because back in his day, Excellence was a solid read, precisely because it was filled with articles people like us found interesting, and because it was tightly written and put together. No more, and the publisher won't even acknowledge it.
I'm no 930 expert, but this Panorama article looks more like something from the Hemmings rag, or maybe a generalist magazine trying to give a brief, canned history. Hopefully Pete Stoudt can call on more qualified members of his team to write on their true areas of expertise in the future....and for those times when the objective is to teach younger folks about older Porsches, he insists that the work be reviewed by genuine experts before committing it to print. John in CT.
Old 10-28-2014, 03:54 PM
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[QUOTE=shlobeck;8322675]Here's the 930 Pano article from October. Not really impressed with the market evaluation or the information compared to the people on this and F-chat forums.

Sorry guys .... was contacted by Pano. Copyright infringement was tossed about. Had to delete the content.



Sensitive aren't they? Well what do you know they actually pay attention to Pelican forums. Once they really dig in I think they will find our criticism of some of their analysis to be constructive. We are not a competitor to them, just are really focused on 930 and many can easily see where they are either biased, jaded, or not well informed. SO THERE Panos. A boulevard cruiser indeed?

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Old 10-29-2014, 08:32 AM
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