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RDG RDG is offline
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To Replace Rod Bolts or Not

Currently have my car in the shop for some upgrades, Turbo, Intercooler, Cams, Valve Job, Head Studs, Going to pull the engine apart down to the block, The car only has 28k miles and seems there's too different apinions, one says replace with ARP, makes sense, your in there right, The other says no need, that he's never seen a rod bolt be the point of failure in a porsce engine. Both these Guys are the best of the best so it's a hard desistion, I'd rather not throw money at something not needed at my power level, this is not a race car and I'm not even knocking on 400rwhp I'd speculate, 79 3.3 CIS, GHL Headders, GT 35r, Turbokraft long neck stock placement, cams to be determined. Lightweight clutch kit. What would you do..
R

Old 12-22-2014, 05:07 PM
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I'd install ARP or Raceware rod bolts and head studs for peace of mind and confidence. They can both be reused while the stock rod bolts are one time torque and use.
Old 12-22-2014, 05:30 PM
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Looks like a pretty mild build, in which case (depending of course on how you drive your car) stock Porsche rod bolts should be just fine. However, be they stock, Raceware or ARP, you must replace (or to put it another way: you must not re-use) your original rod bolts.
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Old 12-22-2014, 06:12 PM
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I replaced mine in similar circumstances
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Old 12-22-2014, 06:18 PM
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I had two rod bolts fail on me in my engine... Take it from me. These are expensive engines to go through if you have a failure like that. I would absolutely replace them!!
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Old 12-22-2014, 06:26 PM
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Old 12-22-2014, 06:41 PM
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RDG RDG is offline
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Looks like you all agree that the rod bolts should at least be replaced. I need to verify but I'm thinking I was told that we wouldn't even crack them loose if all looked well, Im not sure if a problem would be visual, I'd probably prefer to dissemble mic out the parts and at least replace with new OE bolts if not something different. I've also been advised to use the new 993 turbo head studs and not ARP or Raceware because the later will slightly crush at temp where the OE will thermally give at the same rate as the top end. I do know from being around here for quite some time that people have used the ARP with success and I have never heard of heads or PCs getting smashed but I do think I understand the point of view. I will hopefully never be in this engine this deep again, just trying to make sure I make the right choices now. Thanks for the replys..
R
Old 12-22-2014, 07:04 PM
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If you take the rods out you should take the rods and new ARP or Raceware bolts and nuts to a good automotive machine shop and have the big ends resized. If you're going to use new stock rod bolts have the rods resized with the old stock rod bolts.

The big end holes can become oval or egg shaped by around .001" after a lot of miles and high rpms.
The machine shop will measure the big end hole while the rod bolts are torqued and if they are out of round the slightest bit they will machine a tiny amount of metal off where the rod and rod cap come together and then they install the rod bolts, torque them to spec with motor oil on the threads and re bore the hole so it's perfectly round again.
Old 12-22-2014, 07:34 PM
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The one who says to NOT replace is obviously NOT the best of the best.......
Old 12-22-2014, 08:07 PM
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Rod bolts: inexpensive insurance, why would you *not* replace them?
#1 = ARP
#2 = factory
There is no #3

I've seen cases where the rod has failed yet the ARP bolts are intact. I like that level of strength.

Head studs: zero problems with ARP or 993TT, heard good things about Supertec but not tried them in a build.
Personally never seen nor heard of a scenario where the ARP head studs have caused a cylinder problem, never experience it with engines as basic as a 3.0L SC or as aggressive as a 900+hp 3.8TT.

Give us Raceware fasteners to install and they go straight into the recycling barrel.

Just my $0.02.

On the other hand, you've chosen your engine builder, and you trust his experience and judgement or you don't.
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Old 12-22-2014, 08:55 PM
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Hey Chris, you are the person I was speaking of who recommends Rod bolts. Either myself or the shop will be placeing the order for the parts we spoke of here soon, you know where the car is, and I do fully trust his experience, I may have just missunderstood and he was just against ARP, regardless Being at this point I think I'm just going to insist rods are removed inspected resized if nessary with new hardware. Also I'm sure the Rod bearings need inspection along with the crank journals we can see. Then there's coating to consider, is there anything you recommend here, is it good the coat a good in spec bearing, would this only really be useful if the engine was completely apart and all bearings were being done or is this only for new machine work and bearings..Thanks everyone for your feedback.
-R
Old 12-22-2014, 09:55 PM
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I knew who you were referring to. ;-)
And the guy building your engine -- I trust him, too.

Myself, my own car, I'd do ARP rod bolts and recondition the rods.

And, as both pistons & rods are out, I'd have them finely balanced. The factory allows a fairly wide spread in weights, and these run noticeably smoother at higher revs when balancing gets down to ~1g. You'll be having fun running the engine at these higher revs once you put some real camshafts in it.

Yes, if your rod bearings are flawless (as they frequently are on very good lower mileage engines) then they can simply be dry film coated. Mark the position of each on the back of the bearing, install in reconditioned rods, verify clearances -- and if still good, then send them out.
I'd also have the pistons coated at the same time. Most high performance pistons now come with coating standard. More cheap insurance, greatly reduces friction and increases longevity, pistons run cooler which decreases opportunity for predetonation and knock.
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Old 12-23-2014, 08:37 AM
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Yep the new Mahle Motorsport 3.4 Pistons I installed were coated as well as the main bearings and rod bearings

Old 12-24-2014, 06:00 PM
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