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Another 3LDZ packs it in...

So the 930 is at it's weekly visit to the shop, this adventure looks like it will be replacing a 3LDZ that has been somewhat dishonorably discharged. Under boost I am doing my best Spy Hunter impression, power is lumpy, center section is wetter than normal.

I have a call in to TurboKraft but they seem pretty busy. So here is what I want.

I am going to be running CIS for the next couple years at least. I currently have SC cams, B&B headers, B&B exhaust, B&B intercooler, rebuilt WUR (non Leask), stock ignition.

I want to maintain the character of the car, I enjoy the baseball bat to the back of the head. Of course because I am a great hairy chested beast of a man, I want more of that. I acknowledge going the modern route (GT35R, BW S-series etc) will get me there I am reticent to lose the character. Is this fear unfounded? With the 3LDZ I was making a full bar at 3100-3500rpm, boost onset was around 2800rpm. I would like something that is reasonably bolt on. I dont mind doing an adapter or what have you.

From my 'research' it would seem that a K27 is the happy medium without going balls deep into a full EFI build. I am not against EFI (I have converted CIS cars back in the day) its just not in the cards for me in the near future.

So chuckle heads, what say ye? What can I do to let Mr.Hyde have a little bit more fun? Thanks.
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Old 05-20-2015, 06:35 AM
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As we've discussed, you can have my 3LDZ gratis or Turbonetics 60-1 cheapcheapcheap.

The Turbonetics is a bit of a biznich, since you'll, at minimum, need an oil line adapter, as well as an adapter to run it on T3 flange B&Bs. Ideally, go with major surgery tom take advantage of the twin scroll. The real benefit of the Turbonetics is that it will give you the most impressive "baseball bat to the back of the head" experience. The downside is your stock WUR isn't going to cut it.

I think there are two best choices IF you want to upgrade power: find a good used k27 (I think you'll like 7006 better than a 7200) or go half-balls-deep and call Brian to get a k27/29 hybrid. I agree with you that wouldn't like the full-balls-deep GT35R or BW options.
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Last edited by kenikh; 05-20-2015 at 08:25 AM..
Old 05-20-2015, 08:05 AM
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From my understanding the 3ldz has a lower power level in addition to higher rpm threshold. So which do you like about it more?
A better turbo will give better response(which I'm hearing you don't want) but also more power(which you'd apreciate).
Try a Borg for a similar install to kkk turbo? Maybe a larger 366 size for higher threshold but more power? K27 is simpler but more expensive and older tech. Still I understand some of them to be a good choice(k27).
Btw my gt Garrett is a very shovy turbo and still has the laggy feel of a turbo just sooner boost threshold. It responds very quickly but the turbo "feel" is there. I doubt we would ever get rid of that.
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Last edited by quattrorunner; 05-20-2015 at 08:09 AM..
Old 05-20-2015, 08:06 AM
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I have a 7006 that I just removed and will be listed FS as soon as I get around to it.
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Old 05-20-2015, 08:55 AM
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I had my 3LDZ trashed by a piece of the now gone termonuclear whatevers, replaced it with a K27. Still same driving characteristics, just atad earlier on the rev band.. works perfect!
Old 05-20-2015, 09:08 AM
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Thanks for all the advice, knew I could count on the hive mind.

Here is a huge caveat - I have never driven/ridden in a 930 that had anything other a stock setup.

What I Like About The 3LDZ
I like that I can drive the car off boost comfortably. I like that when I want to go its rockin and rolling by 3200rpm. I guess its what I know. Its not that I am looking for more lag, I just want the same or slightly better. Not something that comes on like a nitrous hit when I am 3/4 throttle. Something that keeps the cars 'nature'.

I am fully aware that maybe I am stupid for not wanting a GT35 which I know will pretty much do everything better. The catch with the GT35 in my eyes is both driving characteristics and the cost precipice it represents to keep things safe AFR wise.

I spoke with Chris (least I think it was Chris) at TurboKraft and he is working on some pricing for a 'plain jane' K27 and a hot-rodded K27 setup. I also put in a call and left a message for Mr.RarlyL8.
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Old 05-20-2015, 09:20 AM
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I'll throw in another vote for a K27/K29 hybrid aka "baby K29".
Old 05-20-2015, 10:03 AM
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Shannon, many years ago I had almost the same thoughts as you about changing to a turbo that would alter the "hammer in the chest" effect of the stocker, but I talked myself into it, and any misgivings I had went out the window (literally ) the first time I drove the car with the new turbo (an Ultimate Motorwerks K27HyFlow) and felt how it begins pulling yer arms out of their sockets much earlier in the rev range and keeps on pulling regardless of how high you rev it.

Not trying to convince you of anything - just sharing an unasked-for opinion, buttofcourse.
Old 05-20-2015, 10:17 AM
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Thanks Ronnie, as I understand it the K27Hyflow as its called is similar to the hybrid K27 I was talking about. I do think thats the right direction for me.

All this is meaningless without wheel/housing sizes to reference of course. Hopefully with TurboKraft gets back to me I will have more info.
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Old 05-20-2015, 10:37 AM
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When I first got my "first" 930 (RIP) it was stock in all regards, including the 3LDZ. I did the standard stuff like larger IC, cat bypass, then freeflowing exhaust first....and felt the difference....then slapped in a k27 7006.

Now I've got a deja vu going on....with my "new" 930 sporting a stock 3LDZ and everything else except for a freeflowing muffler. I can say this that the 3LDZ boost onset doesn't seem much different (maybe a tad slower) than the 7006 yet still slams you in the back of the head once she hooks 'em up. But, the 3LDZ seems to crap out at around 5,600 rmps and just kind of languish there, whereas my old setup with the 7006 would continue to pull hard in the upper echelons beyond what the 3LDZ is capable of.

Probably not a real valid comparison because of other build factors affecting turbo performance, so take it for what it's worth.
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Old 05-20-2015, 11:22 AM
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Stick with old school turbos if you want sledgehammer, my huge sample of 2 indicates modern turbos don't hit hard, rather keep adding power higher and higher like an NA vehicle IMO.
Old 05-20-2015, 11:27 AM
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I'd rebuild the 3ldz, simplest thing to do.
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Old 05-20-2015, 11:50 AM
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Looks like I spoke too soon. A comp/leakdown has revealed deeper issues in the motor. Looks like the 930 is going to have a time out in the corner while I think about what to do.
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Old 05-20-2015, 01:11 PM
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^^^ That's unfortunate, Shannon. Did you (or the tech) determine where the leakage (different than Paul's leakage!!!) was from (for example, from the piston rings, valves, ect.)?
Old 05-20-2015, 01:14 PM
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Not yet Ronnie. One cyl has 16% leakdown when warm.

Im going to go mutter to myself and rock back and forth in the corner for a few months.
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Old 05-20-2015, 01:53 PM
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As I've told Shannon, sounds like things are pointing to a top ring failure on one of the pistons, which could have puked a chunk of ring or ring land thru the turbo, causing the failure via FOD. Given that possibility, anyone with a single P/C...you're on deck for the 930 good karma act of the month.

Yeah, I'll ask because I know Shannon won't. I'm not above begging for receiving hand outs, much like Ronnie and Paul...uh...never mind on that last part. I got receiving hand outs mixed up with giving hand jobs, although both of those guys seem confused regarding who is giving and receiving anyway.
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Old 05-20-2015, 02:13 PM
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Drum roll...
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Old 05-20-2015, 02:14 PM
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Thanks Kenik.

Well I am off to my shift behind the dumpster at Wendy's.
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Old 05-20-2015, 02:22 PM
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Say hi to my half eaten baconator
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Old 05-20-2015, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenikh View Post
. . . although both of those guys seem confused regarding who is giving and receiving anyway.
Whereas you, my friend, never experience a bit of confusion - all catching ALL the time, right?!?!

Old 05-20-2015, 02:41 PM
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