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-   -   K&N Air filter alternative... (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-930-turbo-super-charging-forum/942518-k-n-air-filter-alternative.html)

puddy 01-15-2017 04:10 PM

K&N Air filter alternative...
 
I was searching the K&N catalog for a filter possibly better fitting than the K&N 5163 that other here have used. I didn't find anything from K&N however I found this:

Vibrant Performance ::.

Does anyone who has used the K&N and done to small mods to make it work, think this might be a nice alternative?

Jeff NJ 01-15-2017 06:50 PM

I have the k&n and to me it looks like you may have to do the same mod to cutout for the mixture screw clearance. You should find out what the OD is on that and compare it to the k&n.
Also, it looks shorter, so it may flow less air? It may be more than a 930 needs, so may not matter, but I wouldn't stick that on without knowing it had more flow capacity than you need.

Pat RUFBTR 01-16-2017 01:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by puddy (Post 9434189)
I was searching the K&N catalog for a filter possibly better fitting than the K&N 5163 that other here have used. I didn't find anything from K&N however I found this:

Vibrant Performance ::.

Does anyone who has used the K&N and done to small mods to make it work, think this might be a nice alternative?

Hi,
For my part I had installed(settled) the filter K*N 5163 by modifying him(it) for the access to the screw of wealth, but on second thought I found him(it) too restrictive with regard to(compared with) the surface of the original. Finally I opted for a quite simple radiator hose ID 127mm which will pass behind the engine and will go on the right-hand side (side air conditioning) and shall put this big filter AEM has his(her,its) extremity. ;-)

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1484561253.jpg

puddy 01-16-2017 03:26 AM

Here is the K&N specs for the 5163

K&N RU-5163XD Universal Clamp-On, Replacement Filters

Looks to be about the same, but i'm not sure if the K&N height of 4.125" is overall or just the filter height. Where the vibrant is 4.25" overall. I thought if the Vibrant is slightly shorter in height i'll be easier to install since some said they had to squish the K&N to fit and even drop the motor slightly. Though some had no trouble. The Vibrant look like its not as tapered which may not be able to modify as easily as the K&N?

puddy 01-16-2017 03:38 AM

Another possible option...

Volant

boosted79 01-16-2017 04:52 AM

Do some research on oiled media filters like the K&N's.

Bucketlist 01-16-2017 05:59 AM

A couple of years ago I looked at this and found the K&N option to be too tight for my application. (My 3.0 turbo in the SC body is tighter than some.) I aquired this used Mr Gasket unit from Paul K (thanks Paul) which after some further modification solved my problem. Adjustments are really easy without the stock mailbox in the way.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1484578639.jpg
This might be a link to a new one:https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mrg-1485/overview

flightlead404 01-16-2017 06:33 AM

I had no problem with the K&N except I had to make a U shaped cut out of the heavy duty sound pad I had installed and make a small notch in the rubber at the bottom. Took a couple of minutes, not a big deal at all. The hardest part was cutting the sound pad as the heavy duty one is very dense fiber mat and difficult to cut. My filter isn't squished at all and didn't have to drop the engine. I've had it in and out multiple times with no issue.

Mocker 01-16-2017 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boosted79 (Post 9434570)
Do some research on oiled media filters like the K&N's.

Care to expand on that? I've used oiled media filters in the past with no apparent negative results. If you have new, unbiased information to the contrary I think we'd all like to hear about it.

Rawknees'Turbo 01-16-2017 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boosted79 (Post 9434570)
Do some research on oiled media filters like the K&N's.

I've been using oiled media filters for around 30 years on a wide variety of vehicles (cars, motorcycles, diesel truck, light aircraft - on track, street and air), and have never had a problem with them.

I know people have posted in the 911 forum that they were seeing dust/dirt particles in the intake tracts of their cars when they installed them, butt I've never once seen anything like that - I would ASSume that user error is the primary primary problem with those type filters.

boosted79 01-16-2017 09:34 AM

See the attached. If the filter ( paper or oiled gauze or foam) can flow the SCFM required by the engine at max rpm then a less restrictive filter (meaning more dirt gets thru it into the engine) is not going to make ANY measurable difference. In this test the K&N had an initial pressure drop of 4.54" H2O vs. 6.23 " H2O for the AC Delco. Both of those points are at 350 SCFM. 4.54 " WC = 0.164 psi, 6.23" WC = .225 psi. So in a turbo engine running at sea level ( filter sees 14.7 psia) at 1 bar boost (29.4 psia) the K&N will give a PR across the compressor of 2.02 ((14.7 + 14.7 / 14.7 - .164). The AC Delco will give a PR of 2.03 ((14.7 + 14.7 / 14.7 - .225). To see exactly how much difference that makes in airflow depends on the PR vs. flow curve for the compressor but I can guarantee you will not see the difference on a dyno.

I question the flow capability of those small round filters sitting right on top of the flow meter, whether they are paper or oiled gauze.. Look at the surface area of those vs. the stock 930 flat filter.

K&N Air Filter Review - Debunking the Myths (and why OEM is better)

Rawknees'Turbo 01-16-2017 09:45 AM

Several people have tested oem filter box and filter - versus - round/cone K&N - versus - no filter at all, on dynos and there was no horsepower benefit, or detriment to any of them. The main motivator to the filter directly on the air metering housing is convenience of future fueling adjustments, and getting rid of the the ridiculous, mailbox air filter housing on principle.

timc 01-16-2017 01:53 PM

I use this, attaches right on the AFM neck...Same diameter.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NKCIR0/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

puddy 01-28-2017 11:26 AM

I bought the K&N 5163 filter and clearance is too tight, can't get it on. Looks like I may have to cut the mounting flange a 1/4" and will still be tight. Anyone else have to trim the mounting flange down?

puddy 01-28-2017 01:38 PM

So I finally got it installed. Very tight fit I cut the mounting flange down to be the same height as the gear clamp. I also had to lower the motor about 1" at the back and I still had a tough time getting it on. Anyways it's not something I'll need to remove very often so I'll live with the right fit.

Before
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1485642954.jpg

After
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1485643018.jpg

Will be listing the old intake & filter for sale soon.

Brian911T 01-29-2017 07:03 PM

I tried the 5163 K&N but it seemed like a lot of work to drop motor just to install it. I also wanted to vent the breather back to the intake after my Oil Catch Can. I made the top of the air cleaner out of 3/16" aluminum and used AN fittings for the breather lines except for the one from the oil tank to catch can (hose was too large).
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1485748889.jpg

Rawknees'Turbo 01-29-2017 08:17 PM

PUDdyPuller, I wonder if your install issues are due to your car being a 911 tub with a 930 engine in it (that's what you have, right?)? I didn't have to trim my filter base, didn't have to lower the engine, have had the filter on and off probably 6 times in the last two years (chasing running problems), and do not have a singe bend or ding in any of the pleats. It's either that, or maybe my superior pimp hand is the decisive factor?!?! :D

puddy 01-30-2017 02:01 AM

Brian911T - that looks great. Nice & clean! I was considering doing the same but I liked the idea of a gear clamp mount better than the 2 screws on top. In hindsight now that I know how tight my installation is perhaps I should have gone the same route as you.

HisRoyalRawness - you're correct i have a 1975 911 carrera chassis, and I have no doubt about your magic hands.


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