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-   -   broken head stud repair? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/911-engine-rebuilding-forum/771681-broken-head-stud-repair.html)

safe 09-18-2013 05:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapkritis (Post 7662095)
If you use a direct flame them be sure not to let it rest in one area of the case for long. You can melt the case if you direct the flame in one spot for a long time.

No, not really... Its a pretty big heatsink....

Lapkritis 09-18-2013 05:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by safe (Post 7662100)
No, not really... Its a pretty big heatsink....

Yes, really and I've seen it done heating cast aluminum. You can get a spot hot enough the external surface will begin to flow even with propane fuel. This depends on the temperature of the flame and technique of applying the heat. A map gas torch that produces a 1" wide flame should be "worked" over an area larger than 1"... keep the flame moving.

safe 09-18-2013 05:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lapkritis (Post 7662112)
Yes, really and I've seen it done heating cast aluminum. You can get a spot hot enough the external surface will begin to flow even with propane fuel. This depends on the temperature of the flame and technique of applying the heat. A map gas torch that produces a 1" wide flame should be "worked" over an area larger than 1"... keep the flame moving.

Maybe, but the stud will be long gone before the case melts....

Lapkritis 09-18-2013 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by safe (Post 7662117)
Maybe, but the stud will be long gone before the case melts....

That depends on the instruction the guy receives... hence my post to take care when heating the case.

shbop 09-18-2013 07:37 AM

Managed to get in a little work before the family gets up and going. I'm working on #6 exhaust, next to the oiler cooler. Working carefully with my trusty Dremel, I managed to cut a slot into the top. It seemed a clean cut, that fit my new screwdriver pretty well. Using map, I carefully heated the spot inside the spigot. The corner broke off when I tried to twist it out. I've managed to get one more slot cut, but it will have to wait until I get the kids to school. I hear feet, and that means "breakfast".

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1379518602.jpg

Lapkritis 09-18-2013 07:39 AM

You may see a wisp of steam/smoke from the thread area once the loctite gives.

shbop 09-18-2013 07:48 AM

Thanks Andrew. I'd have to say fear of too much heat weighs on me, as I've heard two schools. I'm using map, and after a couple of minutes the area is pretty hot, but I'm thinking I need to double the exposure. In a couple of hours, I'll be back on it.

Lapkritis 09-18-2013 11:11 AM

No problemo - If you're watching the surface closely then you can see when it's about to flow. The surface will actually turn slightly more coarse than normal. A color change also occurs but it's hard to explain and is very brief before things begin to move. If you have a piece of scrap then that can be a good place to test the torch and material reaction.

docrodg 09-18-2013 12:15 PM

With the fight it is giving you a good option may be to have a machinist put it on a mill and drill out for a case-saver.

shbop 09-18-2013 02:43 PM

Sweet Jesus! Free at last! Many thanks to my friend, George, who came by to lend an extra set of hands and encouragement. While I hope I never have to deal with those again, I'll be better prepared. :) Thanks to all!

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1379544146.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1379544162.jpg

zelrik911 09-19-2013 05:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shbop (Post 7663065)
Sweet Jesus! Free at last! Many thanks to my friend, George, who came by to lend an extra set of hands and encouragement. While I hope I never have to deal with those again, I'll be better prepared. :) Thanks to all!

Great News
What was your final method for getting that stud to move?
It looks from the pic, that you got a stud remover onto it. Or was it heat & a screwdriver into the slot you cut into the stud?

Peter in Australia

Lapkritis 09-19-2013 05:18 AM

Looks like he welded a nut on. Another great technique when you're down nearly flush with the case.

shbop 09-19-2013 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zelrik911 (Post 7663869)
Great News
What was your final method for getting that stud to move?
It looks from the pic, that you got a stud remover onto it. Or was it heat & a screwdriver into the slot you cut into the stud?

Peter in Australia

Mig welder, a nut, and carefully heating the case. These last two studs had to be built up just a bit, and I think it's where I initially ran into problems. Last thing I wanted to do was damage the spigot surface. I taped an old base gasket to the area for protection. On one of the studs, It actually became a shim for the nut. Had to get creative in supporting the nut before welding. I used a long-nose baby vise grip, and zip tied it down using the crank webbing for a backer. Carefully cleaning the divilar remnant with the dremel helped quite a bit, as well as not just turning the stud in one direction when it was time to get it out. I applied pressure both ways carefully, and could feel it release, but kept turning both ways for a little while. Glad it's over!
I think there's two things that really get the juices flowing building these motors. This is one. The fear of damaging the case is pretty intense. The other is just before turning the key. Thanks everyone for all the help and encouragement to continue!! It's a great feeling to have this over.

jpnovak 09-19-2013 09:18 AM

Nice work. Having been through this there is not a stud I would be scared of. The challenge is that the dilivar is sometimes so brittle that welding a nut does not work. The HAZ from welding just makes the problem worse.

I had to resort to milling by hand with a dremel tool and the WC (tungsten carbide) bit. Slow but it worked and was cost effective from a tool point of view. I guess if you factored an hourly rate it would close to EDM (if available).

Diamond drill bits sound nice.

shbop 09-21-2013 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jpnovak (Post 7664229)
Nice work. Having been through this there is not a stud I would be scared of. The challenge is that the dilivar is sometimes so brittle that welding a nut does not work. The HAZ from welding just makes the problem worse.

I had to resort to milling by hand with a dremel tool and the WC (tungsten carbide) bit. Slow but it worked and was cost effective from a tool point of view. I guess if you factored an hourly rate it would close to EDM (if available).

Diamond drill bits sound nice.

Jamie, I would have thought EDM is readily available where you are. I'm glad I pushed-on, but if there were machine shops here that performed EDM work, I'd have been tempted. I spent a day and a half, not counting breaks. I seem to have one fight after another with this project. I'm in a pitch battle with the rear wheel bearings now. Turbo arms are another bruising battle.


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