Suggestion for speeding ticket - NY fines?

JerryTreeXprt · 08-16-2004, 05:49 AM

I got nailed coming home from a great vacation in the Adirondacks last week. After dealing with RV's and other slow and unnecessarily braking vehicles on all the good roads on the way to the Northway, I decided to open it up a bit on the first clear stretch of freeway. As I grabbed a handful of throttle, a car crested a distant hill coming the other way and lo and behold it was the man. I let off instantly and he didn't seem to slow down to chase. Right over the hill we came upon a border checkpoint where the officer stopped us and said "Whooooooeeeee! 102?!?!? Pull it over there. Then the officer who we saw earlier casually pulled up and wrote both of us up for 102 in a 65. OUCH!! He did inform me that 3mph faster and we'd be headed to the clink...good info for the future. I think my buddy may have abetter chance since I was in front (how can you read speed on 2 bikes at once?). Anyway, I'm looking for suggestions. I'm from NJ and out of state violations are all 2 pointers so that's not the worst. I don't think I'll be able to get out of it though but someone here may know something I don't. I'm figuring on a pretty hefty fine. Do I just plead guilty and beg for mercy or fight it and take my chances? Anyone know what the fines are in NY for 37mph over limit? I tried finding a NY fine schedule but had no luck. Before I get any responses of 'you f'd up, take your punishment and accept responsibility for your actions', I know already, I'm just trying to make it as least painful as possible. FWIW, It was on an open stretch of highway with no cars in view ahead of me or anywhere around me. I usually try to limit my bursts of speed to open sections of highway and don't ride like an idiot on local streets.

1967 R50/2 · 08-16-2004, 06:00 AM

Youch! If I remember correctly speeding in a 65 zone is double the fine...or maybe that is only in NJ.

Sounds like you've already got your options assessed.

How many points are on your license? Out of state moving violations usually only count for 2 points in NJ unless it is something like DUI or DWI...but it all adds up.

You may want to get an attorney.

blusxv · 08-16-2004, 06:17 AM

Hi,

What exit were you at on the Northway? They are tuff up there, when we were building our Cabin at Lake George I was heading up sometimes twice a week, I got two tickets in a 3 month period now I hang at 10mph over and they seem to leave me alone. I found that from exit one till around exit nine they are the worst but they are all over collecting from the vacation people.

I have learned to always fight it, just going to court may get the cop to plea bargin for something with no points or one time My cop didn't show up (cops go on vacation too) and the ticket was dropped. So id plead Not guilty and on the back of the ticket it will ask if you want the cops deposition, be sure and check NO cause if you make him write up a report he wont be very happy with you and chance of plea bargin would be slim to none.

even though you may think its only 2 points, that 2 point gets very expencive with insurance surcharges for 3 years.

Good luck,
Mike

blusxv · 08-16-2004, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 1967 R50/2
Youch! If I remember correctly speeding in a 65 zone is double the fine...or maybe that is only in NJ.

.

double in a 65 is only in our great state of NJ

Bumper · 08-16-2004, 06:39 AM

Make sure when you plead not gulity that you request a "Supporting Depostion" from the ticketing officer. There is a place on the ticket where you check off this request. They have 30 days to provide this information and if not provided then you can request the judge dismiss the case as the "State" did not provide this requested information in a timely manner. It will also tell you what the office will state about you in court when you go to fight this ticket, which you should. You will be able to plea this down with the ADA rather than wasting valuable court time. Good Luck....

pmc847 · 08-16-2004, 07:00 AM

Try this site. It might be all you need to know.

http://www.motorists.org/

Philip

Highlander179 · 08-16-2004, 01:58 PM

sign up for the experienced rider course thru NJ State. its good for a 2 point reduction. It's also a free class. I took it a few weeks ago in Sea Girt.

Effervescent · 08-16-2004, 03:59 PM

I know 43 over is $850. Plus $25 for the court.

For NY residents (at least) they are supposed to tell you to come back with an attorney ($$$) and not let you represent yourself.

-Eff

Effervescent · 08-16-2004, 04:00 PM

I would guess if you showed up, and they let you do it alone, the best you would do is $525.

Just my estimation.

-Eff

PFFOG · 08-16-2004, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bumper
Make sure when you plead not gulity that you request a "Supporting Depostion" from the ticketing officer. There is a place on the ticket where you check off this request. They have 30 days to provide this information and if not provided then you can request the judge dismiss the case as the "State" did not provide this requested information in a timely manner. It will also tell you what the office will state about you in court when you go to fight this ticket, which you should. You will be able to plea this down with the ADA rather than wasting valuable court time. Good Luck....

What he said.

The cop must have been a prick if he wrote you up for 102, as almost every ticket I have recieved in the state has been reduced. In fact one was reduced to "no reflective material on my helmet" a NYS requirement.

I would call some local motorcycle shops or attorneys in the NY jurisdiction and ask if the judge is usually reasonable or a “Hanging Judge”. If the answer is reasonable, the Assistant District Attorney (ADA) or the Judge can reduce it. May still cost a few bucks, but fewer points.

If you want to fight it all the way, he can’t have gotten both, so one ticket will have to go but which?? Also I am told if he looses sight of you, there are grounds for dismissal, unless you admitted it was you when he wrote the ticket.

If nothing else sounds like a good excuse for another trip to the Adirondacks!!

jackbunce · 08-16-2004, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JerryTreeXprt
... Anyone know what the fines are in NY for 37mph over limit? I tried finding a NY fine schedule but had no luck. ...

Here is a link to the portion of the New York State Consolidated Laws governing speeding & fines:

http://assembly.state.ny.us/leg/?cl=128&a=54

If they are similar to Connecticut courts you will find that there are various additional court costs, surcharges and fees added to the statutorily imposed fines. I would suggest that you contact the court clerk and ask them for either a schedule of fines, or just recite the details from your ticket and ask them to give you a range for the bottom line.

My experience has been that in the northeast neither the prosecutor nor the judge is favorably disposed to show any leniency towards those traveling in excess of 100 mph; there is just no upside for them. Especially on a murdersickel! If they fail to throw the book at you and you do it again and someone is injured and the newspapers find out you were let off both of them will be toast.

So, if you decide to fight it, it will be a fight to the death!

All that said, I think there may be problems with the two of you both being clocked. Radar beams are very wide and do not do well in discriminating closely spaced targets. However, if the officer is willing to testify that he observed the two of you travelling together, i.e., the spacing was not increasing or decreasing you will be toast. Likewise, if you made any statements to the officer admitting the specifics of your transgression you may have problems.

Talk to a local lawyer who handles lots of traffic cases in that court. Be prepared to pay him for his time.

gixxer00 · 03-31-2005, 08:55 PM

alright man... the best thing you can do is get a lawyer, talk to him go through your options...im not aware of you reccord but you are offered a prayer for judgement every three years and two every five...some judical systems will let you do community service or go to an 8 hour deffensive driving course...hope i was of some assistance

eduard · 03-31-2005, 10:14 PM

Was it a state troper or a local cop. State troper it's a bit harder to fight. Local cop plead not guilty go to court and they usually work a deal with you. Some times they dismiss the summons and change the chardes to something else. The bottom line is that local police and the town want some money and if they find you guilty on the speeding charges they have to give a big portion to the state and that is why most of the time they will work out a deal. If you do go to court fight it and make sure the officer shows up. NYC is a different ball game because any mistake made by the officer the judge will throw out the case.

Sirus · 04-01-2005, 05:10 AM

Quote: "alright man... the best thing you can do is get a lawyer".....

best advice!!!! you would be very foolish not to do so. Try to find one that is an experienced in this venue, especially one that has put a lot of time in that jurisdiction (better). These folks work together all day, every week and all know the officers, the golf together etc. I was a doubter too and was about to just pay the piper, not any more. In short, I was nailed a few weeks ago, not quite in the triple digits but close enough to be very painful. Believe it or not, it was reduced to defective equip? otay... step up pay the fine and go..

I am not saying your going to get off scott free but it is really worth it in the long run. Also, if there is anything such as prayer for judgment (PFJ), your insurance company can see it. These are usually limited to 1 per household and IF you get popped again, it's nullified and you have to pay for the previous tick as well as the current (ouch!). Save it as a ace in the hole. If the state offers a school that will keep any mention of it off the record, take it. Your lawyer will talk to the DA an negotiate all this. You have to keep in mind that you can't count on not getting another (fact of life) and they add up.

718Rider · 04-01-2005, 05:29 AM

Don't plead not guilty. Show up in court, you'll have a chance to meet with the officer before hand and work something out.

I got tagged going 98 in a 55 in Upstate NY and had to spend some time in jail (a couple hours until someone bailed me out) - NY anything 40MPH over the speed limit = go to jail. Yikes.

I've gotten prob. 20 tickets in the last 10 years. (Speeding - a lot on 81 when I went back and forth a lot in a car) I've always found pleading it out to be the best route. The cops and judges are usually pretty reasonable - they want to make their $$.

For what's it work I got radared in NJ on I-80 going 126MPH, and apparently had a suspension in VA on my PA license that made me ineligble to drive in NJ. (This on an R12C w/straight pipes). I went to court and paid a $500 fine, no points. Go figure.

T

718Rider · 04-01-2005, 05:35 AM

BTW - I've only got a couple of tickets on my NY license. When I was in college and racking up major tickets I had VA & MD licenses I used to move points around. I don't suggest this BTW.

I think I've been to driver school enough to teach it. One of the blessing of moving to NYC means my driving record has cleared up a bit by default (ie not having a car). Most of the cops in NYC won't mess with you for speeding (on a bike anyway). : )

Effervescent · 04-01-2005, 06:53 AM

So it's been 9 months since this thread was started. Any updates?

-Eff

gixxer00 · 04-01-2005, 04:48 PM

The "PFJ" will not be charged against you if you get busted again I was worried out the same thing when i got busted but the D.A said that they expunged the ticket...just try to get them to reduce it (as they will usually do) and then take a class...(IF offered)

JerryTreeXprt · 04-01-2005, 06:11 PM

So it's been 9 months since this thread was started. Any updates?

Good eye Eff. I was surprised to see this thread resurface. Someone's diggin' deep. Still cold, eh?

Anyway, I think I might've posted something on this, but I forget. I did a lot of askin' around and got some books and did some diggin' on the web for info on fightin' it. I was at a League of Municipalities trade show in NJ and talked to some people who were dealing radar units and they swore that there's no beatin' em. If they nailed ya you're nailed. I don't know about that since I've read a lot of cases where people were able to get off. I also met a prosecutor from Bergen Cty., NJ and talked to him a bit about defending against a speeding ticket. He said 'Good luck in NY. You're usually dealing with a local justice who has a lot of leeway to basically decide what they want. Even if you have pretty convincing evidence, the judge in these little podunk towns can basically say that they believe the cop's story.' Any books that I looked into said to fight it or plea. The National Motorist Assoc. gave me the best advice since it was a write up specifically geared toward NY. They basically echoed the Bergen Cty. guy. If you get a ticket in NY, you can request a supporting deposition...within 48 hours of your ticket. If you request it after this, you have lost your chance. Plead not guilty and request a supporting deposition. If they fail to give it to you, you may be able get off.
BTW, in some towns, there is no DA or prosecutor, the cops act as prosecutor as well.

Anyway, I went to court (about a 4-5 hour drive) and registered as present. The courtroom was about the size of my living room and had about 20 chairs and a 'bench' for the judge. I went to look for the officer to try a plea bargain. My buddy Chris had gone a few weeks prior and the officer said that the judge wouldn't allow anything less than 90/65 so he took it and ended up with $350 in fines and costs. Ouch. So as I'm lookin' for the cop and not findin' him, I go out to the car to check my book to see what the procedure is when the officer isn't present. The book said that they'll sometimes get another officer to offer you a plea, but accept no substitutes and go to trial. At trial request dismissal due to 'want of prosecution'. Basically if you're on trial and the officer isn't there, there's no witness. If there isn't a witness to your speeding, are you really speeding? So with this info I went back into the living room...er, court room and waited to see if the officer showed up. When the judge came in, I nearly *****, it was judge Judy. Looked just like her and acted like her as well. I started to see that others going up who had been ticketed by the same officer had arranged pleas with another officer. Hmmmm. Well, wouldn't ya know it, case after case goes by and I find that I'm the last one in the court room. Judge Judy picks up my paperwork and looks at it. She looks over the top of her glasses at me and then back at the paperwork. One more time at me then the paperwork. She excuses herself and goes into her chamber. A few minutes later an officer comes out and introduces himself. He says that my officer isn't here and he's authorized to handle his case. I see you came all the way from Jackson, NJ, what are your intentions? I replied that I was going to try to plea it down, but if that wasn't successful I was prepared to go to trial today. However, since the other officer isn't here, I'm going to request a dismissal. He said that he doubted she'd grant it. I asked him 'what about my right to a speedy trial?' and he seemed a bit flustered and said that there are different time limits for different things, but he was prepared to offer me 85/65. I asked 'how 'bout 84?' He asked why 84...points?' My reply was that I just think that 19 over would be less damaging on my record than 20 over (I don't know if there's a diff or not). He was willing to accept it. When the judge came out, she asked for my plea and I hit her with the dismissal request. She kinda smirked just like Judge Judy and was shaking her head in a dismissive way. "What? you're shaking your head. does that mean no?" She said that she would just reschedule it. I asked her about my right to a speedy trial and she pretty much blew me off. Not being sure exactly where I stood due to my waiting till the last minute to file so I could buy some time, I decided to take the 84/65. $250 total fine and costs. Not bad at the end of the day. In NJ, any out of state moving violation is 2 points. In the past, I've had NY tickets not show up on my record. Worst case scenario, I'll get 2 points. Best case, $250 fine and it doesn't make it to NJ. I'm hopin that the town is as disorganized as they looked and fail to transmit my paperwork.

foobeemer · 04-03-2005, 07:12 AM

For what it's worth, I overpaid a fine by $5 for a ticket I got in Newark in 2001- I was alittle lost and made a wrong turn down a one-way street, only to be met by a cop who almost turned into me at the red light I was sitting at! He was an ******* about it, too. Anyway, I overpaid the fine by mail and received a refund check but never cashed it, thereby preventing the summons from clearing the books and going to the DMV. I avoided the 2 points that way. Interesting enough, 3 years later I got a letter from Prudential telling me they had found out about the ticket from a credit reporting agency (WTF?). They raised my rates $650 a year and I promptly dumped them for Geico and got a better rate in the end than I had before my Prudential enema.

Also, I had found out that the street I drove down had only recently become one-way due to construction in the surrounding area for route 21. It was very nice of them to cut me some slack-knuckleheads