save the CATs

[JonyRR]

Don't turn those remove catalytic convedrters into modern art just yet, kids. (I cutr mine up and used the metal for various shop projects and am kicking myself now; I shudder to think what a new one retails for).
I just noticed a california city just banned smoking tobacco OUTSIDE on ANY public space, sidewalks, streets, on private porperty outside (a business)....the cali-nazis are going out into deeper lunatic waters yet again.....
I'm waiting for the day CARB starts to institute smog checks on motorcycles. 'So, sir, I notice you have a nice vanderlinde system on your motorcyucle...where's the OEM cat...you don't have it, oh, ok, then, here's a nice federal $10,000 fine for tampering with the exhaust system...just like it says on the fine print stamped into the cat itself...have a nice day!;
time for the second american revolution....

[SergioK]

I doubt any CaliCat law would be retroactive... it's future bikes that would be affected. Still, BMW designs their bikes with cats so the most who have to lose if/when this comes about would be other manufacturers. They'll then need to design and implement these systems.

[JonyRR]

Au contrare. Please read the fine print. DOn't blame me, I'm just a messenger. B UT.
I guarantee it IS illegal to REMOVE a catalytic converter on a road-legal vehicle if said vehicle was delivered with one as OEM equipment. I could go quote the EPA regs, and they're draconian if they were enforced.
that $10K federal fine? It's real, not a blow-induced fantasy. Just casue the feds don't enforce it don' mean it's not there.
Am I a violator? I have a full vanderlinde system, so what do you think?I can go to another floor in the building I work in and find all the pertinent federal statutes and get a quote of the regs from a federal prosecutor as well as a CID (criminal investigation division) EPA special agent to point me to the regs. really, no kidding.
just a FYI.....but it's gonna be harsh if they ever staert getting down...

[Xa3]

So, supposedly my CAT system fell off by itself and I had to replace it with something cheap like LASER system? What can they do about that?

"Yeah my cat fell off and I ran over it, crushing it so I couldn't install it again. That's why you don't see it on my bike anymore..."

-ChaZ

[tbsstunta]

>>What can they do about that?

Same thing they do with your car, make you fix it so it meets regs. IE. Buy new CAT.

[SergioK]

Jony, I wasn't arguing the legality of removing the CAT. What I meant was the enforcement would most likely only be for certain years and forward. Pretty much what they were doing for cars (where cars before year 1976 are not required to pass smog inspection). If CA decides to start testing bike, they most likely would do the same thing.

[JonyRR]

nope; your 1999 bmw r1100S came with a cat as OEM equipmn nt and it's a federal offense for anyone, inlcuding a private owner to remove or disab le any piece of equipment , no matter how small, that's emissons related.
that means yanking the cannister is illegal
that means replacing the exhaust system with anything that eliminates the cat is ill-eagle (we all do it, the feds havent' made an issue of it...yet, but I guaran-dam-tee you there's a federal statuite that proscribes just exactly that.
You can't yank the cat on your car legally; that's why there are all kinds of 'cat-bvack' systems.
the collective motorcycle community in the US has flown under the radar, but the hammer of a 10K fine does loom out there.
don't like it? oh well, I'm not the bad guy here, just pointing out reality.
rail against it if you will, but them's the facts jack.

[Xa3]

Originally posted by JonyRR
nope; your 1999 bmw r1100S came with a cat as OEM equipmn nt and it's a federal offense for anyone, inlcuding a private owner to remove or disab le any piece of equipment , no matter how small, that's emissons related.
that means yanking the cannister is illegal
that means replacing the exhaust system with anything that eliminates the cat is ill-eagle (we all do it, the feds havent' made an issue of it...yet, but I guaran-dam-tee you there's a federal statuite that proscribes just exactly that.
You can't yank the cat on your car legally; that's why there are all kinds of 'cat-bvack' systems.
the collective motorcycle community in the US has flown under the radar, but the hammer of a 10K fine does loom out there.
don't like it? oh well, I'm not the bad guy here, just pointing out reality.
rail against it if you will, but them's the facts jack.

Hmm... ok let's not argue about the legality of it... let's talk about HOW we can get around that?

Does the statue of limitation apply to the year of the bike it was made or when I removed it?

-ChaZ

[Bob Hancock]

Never trouble trouble 'til trouble troubles you.
But then, I still have the cat in storage.

[JonyRR]

To my knowledge, no. for example, by federal statiute, if the machine came with polloution control equipment, you CAN NOT remove ANY of it, regardless of mileage. SOME states have variances on that theme, but the feds trump the state statiutes.
At lunch, I went down a couple of floors and asked a US attorney I know about all this. he laughed and said that the War On Terror takes precedense over some fuul yanking the cat on his motorcycle (while looing me in the eye and laughing at me) when I pointed out his boss was trying to view everyone's porn browsing habits he said that was different. I left it at that...heat, I'll never figure them out.In cali, just try running your car that had a cat on it without one; if they catch youo on a public road, I do belive tghe CHP impounds it on the spot and you get a hefty state fine, no?
we, collectively, have been skating for a while now, and I'm just as big an offendor as anyone. I just know the consequences. Will I plead ignorance? of course I will...

[wswartzwel]

Repoe removed mine... Since He is already guilty maybe you can blame him for yours too.

[JonyRR]

yeah, that's it.
repoe, tha's Mr. Poe III, right? at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave, Washington DC, right?

all joking aside, Bill, don't yank anyone's cat whils performing the duties of a paid mechanic/technician. and get caught.

[lemec]

Don't go yanking my cat. I did save mine just in case I ever get it inspected again and for some reason someone notices and cares.

[JonyRR]

'Don't go yanking my cat'
sung to the tune of Elton John and Keekke Dee singing 'don't go breaking my heart'

[Rapid Dog]

...well I got two cats in my garage to yank about!

[johnnydanger]

My response is: hmmmm *shrug shoulder* In my opinion the feds/state are not nearly smart enough to know if our S came with cats or without. Since most bikes do not have cats I suspect they'd think that our don't either. It's not like they'll have a list that says: If you pull over a motorcyclist it doesn't need a cat... unless it's an R1100S. Bureacracys move slow and aren't very smart in my experience. I wouldn't sweat it.

[JonyRR]

John; sure. I agree with that. but forewarned is forearmed. Just for giggles, while on the commode one day, read the fine print about tampering with any emissions-related equipment out of any modenr owner's manual for any street-legal vehicle. Shucks, my dodge ram even quoted the federal regs, and it IS stamped right into the side of any OEM exhaust system....
whatever. Keep your cat..who knows, in a pinch your cat could be your pussy (bad pun, I know, butg WTFO)

[X-Triple]

Originally posted by Xa3
So, supposedly my CAT system fell off by itself and I had to replace it with something cheap like LASER system? What can they do about that?

"Yeah my cat fell off and I ran over it, crushing it so I couldn't install it again. That's why you don't see it on my bike anymore..."

-ChaZ

I more worried why you think a LASER system is cheap and compared to what?

Since I "dropped" mine my bike has come so alive with it gone.

X-Triple

[bingo]

I just glanced through this post and Jony and everyone else has some good points. Jony is 100% correct, it is illegal to mess with emission controls of anykind that came stock. However, if one is driving down the road and strikes some debris that flys up and damages the cat on his/her cage, it has to be replaced. BUT, it does not have to be replaced with an OEM cat. If one goes into a muffler store to get their exhaust done (flowmasters, etc.) on the V-8 pickup and asks for a high-flow cat, the store won't touch it. If one goes home, punches a hole in their stock cat (road debris in play here now), the store is now allowed to repair the system. Most of the aftermarket or so-called high flow cats pass a visual inspection and nothing more. If it's a newer vehicle and kept in tune, it'll never be an issue. The CHP does not inspect emission systems, the Bureau of Automotive Repair (B.A.R.) does. The CHP will work with these people in roadside check points, but I've only seen one since 1985. At these check points they give you a smog test. If you pass, you're on your way. If you do get caught at one of these and are in violation, you actually don't get a ticket. You get a warning and are given time to make the vehicle comply again. They can't prove who made the change, so they just gain compliance. And they do not wave motorcycles into these check points. Just vehicles. I know everyone here knows a cop or two. Ask them if motorcycles come with cats. If they say yes, ask them which makes. Most will say no or will not know if they do or not. Too many cages to worry about than our so few number of good gas mileage, non-commute glogging motorcycles. About the only thing I've ever heard cops complain about is loud Harleys

[SergioK]

Don't forget the squids.