Dual Compound Tyres for Track Day Good or Risky Business

[Guest24]

After my HP2S track day I noticed a marked difference in the wear on the outer regions where the compound is softer and the center area formulated for greater mileage in the chicken strip area. The tyres are PP 2CT. Just what would happen if you happen to be rolling on hard as you stand the bike up out of a turn and hit the harder compound while still needing the sticky. What say you track day experts about using a tyre designed for higher mileage in the normal street riding zone? Is it good to go or "risky business".

[bradzdotcom]

Originally Posted by Nail24

what would happen if you happen to be rolling on hard as you stand the bike up out of a turn and hit the harder compound while still needing the sticky.

don't claim to be a "track expert", but other than a bit of a manageable wiggle when you transition from one compound to the other, it shouldn't be the end of the world as you know it.

.....or.....since there's lawyers around...don't do it! the bike will instantaneously burst into flames and you'll die a horrific death.

or it will just wiggle a tad.

[ckcarr]

Or the rubber will peel off like the skin of a bad sunburn on your back!!

[NakedRider]

I've seen the same thing on other multi-compound tires even riding on the street.

Although I can't address your standing it up while on the gas I have noticed that the bike falls into turns more since the shape of the tire is no longer rounded but instead is more like a triangle.

It almost has be wondering about the multi-compound. They're great when they are new but after some wear they seem to have some handling issues.

[PFFOG]

I will tell you what I think after I do a track day on B'stone BT-016 TRIPLE compound skins.

[roger albert]

I've not done much time on the 2CTs, but on the 016s, I've felt no odd transition.
They like a really low rear pressure on the track, btw. No more than 24 cold on the rear.

[BMathison]

Originally Posted by Yeskino

I will tell you what I think after I do a track day on B'stone BT-016 TRIPLE compound skins.

I'm thinking about these to replace the M3's. I will be watching for your report, and a couple pics would be nice too.

[PFFOG]

Originally Posted by roger albert

I've not done much time on the 2CTs, but on the 016s, I've felt no odd transition.
They like a really low rear pressure on the track, btw. No more than 24 cold on the rear.

No more than 24 on the Stones or the Michelins??

I know Pilot Race they recommend mid 20's cold.

Originally Posted by BMathison

I'm thinking about these to replace the M3's. I will be watching for your report, and a couple pics would be nice too.

I still love the M3's and only bought the 016's because there was a smoking deal on them last fall, I think $189/set. I do have 2 set's of M3's waiting to be mounted too.

Even it the stones wear the same, unless you get them on sale, they are more $$$ than M3's last I checked. I have NEVER had issues with the M3's as far as traction, they warm up fast and give great feedback.

[PFFOG]

Originally Posted by Nail24

..............Just what would happen if you happen to be rolling on hard as you stand the bike up out of a turn and hit the harder compound while still needing the sticky. What say you track day experts about using a tyre designed for higher mileage in the normal street riding zone? Is it good to go or "risky business".

A couple of other thoughts on this, First, you need less traction as you straighten up, because you are only asking the tire to accelerate, and not support lateral loads, plus you are decreasing the RPM, and thus the power due to the larger circumference of the tire standing up. It is very noticeable if you pay attention.

[roger albert]

22-24 cold was for the 016s in track use.

A lot of race tires are down in that 20psi range now, but it's an unusual recommendation for a street tire that runs 'normal' pressures on the street.

Despite being skeptical, I followed the Bridgestone rep's advice when I ran the 16s on the back of the SV for some superstock races and they worked and held up great (there is no 003 for the rear of the SV, and the new 16s are actually grippier than the old 090 DOTs)
I eventually did a 4 trackdays and 4 sprint races on the rear. Almost as much life as slicks, with good grip still late in the tire's life.

[roger albert]

> due to the larger circumference of the tire standing up. It is very noticeable if you pay attention.

I never gave that much thought until I started racing. The small bikes really drive it home.
There are places one is wide open on a small bike that you'd never be on the larger ones (mid size sweepers and corners at bottoms of hills etc), and that often require taller than ideal gearing to keep from redlining while way leaned over in top gear.

Annoying if you pick up more speed during an endurance race than you had in practice, and find yourself redline limited in top. Very annoying.

[Jeff Williams]

Bubba,
imo use the ct-2's to protect boats on the docks as they come in and try the oo2's from bridgestone. Good value and sticky but don't last long as 2200 miles rear.
jeff

[signit98]

Originally Posted by Jeff Williams

Bubba,
imo use the ct-2's to protect boats on the docks as they come in

Can I have them?

http://itwasnotme.com/Yeah..._I_AM_blogging!/Entries/2009/3/15_Ouch....html

[Guest24]

Don't think you need 2CT's on a GS Ralf. Read the first post. This is about the risks associated with using dual compound tyres for track day. I know its hard to keep this group focused. Thanks Jeff for addressing the subject.

[throttlemeister]

Bubba, did you read the link Ralf put up? He was referring back to the boat reference and the fact he has a problem parking boats in their docs.

[roger albert]

In short, there is no problem with them. Dual compound has been around a while.
It's just not always marketed as such. At least on the track, where you use the whole tire, I don't even see a dividing line between tread types. Totally transparent

[signit98]

Read TM's post... and then ask yourself who needs to focus, Bubba...

Also, do not make the mistake of underestimating the GS on the track... EVER!

[Wild Will]

Mr Mayor, I'd buy the stickiest DOT sport tires for any track day. Save the dual compound for the street. Race tires will need warmers or they're dangerous. Take the tires off and keep them for track day use. You should get a few track days out of a set of soft sport tires. Remember Parriott at Daytona March 08? He low sided his race tires in the first few laps because they were not warm enough. He still picked it up and took 6th!

I agree with Signit - my pal Jim Randolph (his son is one of Parriott's contemporaries and an AFM champion) regularly embarrasses hyper bikes at Infineon on his 1200GS!

[gigantic]

Originally Posted by Nail24

After my HP2S track day I noticed a marked difference in the wear on the outer regions where the compound is softer and the center area formulated for greater mileage in the chicken strip area. The tyres are PP 2CT. Just what would happen if you happen to be rolling on hard as you stand the bike up out of a turn and hit the harder compound while still needing the sticky. What say you track day experts about using a tyre designed for higher mileage in the normal street riding zone? Is it good to go or "risky business".

Bubba, No worries- The 2CT's are good for all but mid-upper A group pace & will normally wear just as you've described. I've not had any issues with either the 2ct nor the regular PP's which I use regularly when coaching. great tires- FWIW, the center compound is identical to regular Pilot Powers, with s softer compound for added side grip.

[roger albert]

Exactly my eval as well. Someone that says the dual compound is only for the street, just doesn't know the compounds. At least not for 2CTs or 016s. On moderate power bikes like ours or SVs, they're even capable of a good race pace. No problems unless they come from the pilot (the rider, not the tire) No worries.