R1200RT Good , bad, OK?

[turboflyer]

This is turning out to be one of the best forums I have been on. Knowledgeable, funny, new and old riders with diverse interest. I was hoping some would share there thought on the RT as a two up tourer. I have tried several other bikes but this one keeps winning from my perspective. If I can not swing a new one are there certain problematic years? Best year? Thanks.

[ckcarr]

I've looked at that bike a lot off and on. Problematic on any BMW for me seems to be 30" inseams. I sort of like being in the bike, not way on top. However, they had a used one at BMW of Grand Junction that came with a factory lowering kit. It fit perfect. (I could probably push my way out of some gravel if I got stuck too!). I believe they all have the option (including the R1200GS). So I'm thinking now of a more touring type bike for the future like that. I've heard from people that love the K1200LT also. I think it's gigantic, but they say after 50 miles it's easy riding. That bikes not for me however.

[RoLoo]

Well, as a great RT-fan I’ve to respond.

After a R80RT, a R1150RT, and for somewhat more than two years now the R1200RT.
Great two-up tourer indeed ; BUT also quite a sporty Tourer if you ask me.

Problems you ask…; well some of the EWS (key recognition) problems you can find amongst others Beemers, you can also find amongst the RoyalTourer.

Some RT’s (mine for example !) suffer from vibrating front-discs.
I, for example, had them changed already for the third time, and this ‘new’ set is already crap again (after 6000 miles)
But BMW replaced all sets under warranty.

The ‘older’ RT’s suffer more from this hick-up than the newer ones.
You can recognize the newer (2007 and newer) RT’s on these flat, instead of the ‘bulb’ like, discs bolts.

The only thing I couldn’t used to : the stock seats. WAY to soft !
I replaced the seats for the Touratech ones, and with these seats, 750 miles per day isn’t a problem at all.
Even not for the passenger.

And maybe the screen could be somewhat wider.
For a touring bike you may find a lot of turbulence behind the stock screen.
And one other thing ; with a pillion the view in the rearview mirrors is as good as worthless.


For the rest : long distance bike par excellence !

[Guest24]

Whether you're running the twisties or doing Iron Butt, the R1200RT is quite the machine for the asphalt runner. I would go with the later year bikes because of the improvements in the tranny. For 2up you want the topbox to give the passenger the security of a backrest since they don't have the bar to grip. It comes with a heated rear seat and a plug for heated gear when the weather changes. The side cases don't rub the back of the passengers legs like the boxey GS cases. With the ESA system you can leave the bags in camp and run with the sport bike dudes with just a tank bag or the soft tail bag. I have the Cee Bailey cut down wind screen to get more air in the hot weather. It also get rid of that big touring bike look. The cruise control is well worth it on the long hauls. BTW it turns in quicker than my stock HPS. In wet weather it is a very dry bike due to the fairing but while it looks heavy it really isn't. It goes 300+ miles on the 7.1 gallons of gas so if you're out west, you can spend more time touring and less time being concerned with the next fuel stop. For me, the RT/HPS combination is the ideal combo until BMW drops the HPS DOHC engine into a cut down RS. As for Craig's 30" inseam, I'm a 30" also and ride on the stock saddle even though I have a low seat on the shelf. There is also a lowered suspension that BMW installs at the factory if you are really concerned about the ability to flat-foot the bike at a stop light. But, with the lower suspension comes the reduced clearance in the tight turns. A big considerstion IMO if you are prone to use the edges of your tyres. Well that's just a few of my thoughts on one of the main horses in the BMW stable. Oh yeah, if the 11S is a donkey bike and the 12S is a mule--the RT is a draft horse that runs like a quarter horse.

[cageyar]

I see your Rotary Club sticker on your bike, at least I think that's what it is.
The Rotary Club does a lot of really great things for those who need assistance, but it reminds me of something from a long time ago.
When I worked at AMOL Precision in Dumont, NJ back in 1977-78 (one of the old, venerable BMW dealerships), the R100RS had just come out. The silvery blue one (I forget the name of the exact color).
An older, retired gentleman came in who was a long time customer of the store and bought the first one AMOL received. Everybody was excited about the bike because of the full fairing, the great styling, etc.
A week or so later, he rode it to AMOL to stop in to say hello and shoot the breeze which a lot of customers did back then. It was part of what made it a neat shop. I was working on a bike in the service department and I heard these yells of surprise and perhaps, loathing.
This guy had retired from Yellow Frieght Lines after many years and was proud of his association with the company.
I walked outside to see what the fuss was-he had placed four, 6" X 3" Yellow Frieght stickers all over the bike; one on the nose of the fairing, one on each side and one on the tail. The AMOL employees were horrified (it was a very traditional, hard core BMW place) and when the proprietor, Richard Liebmann came out, he just stood there with his mouth open and I thought for a second he was going to faint. No amount of scorn would convince him to remove even one of the stickers and the whole situation was rather funny.
Anyway, not saying your bike looks like that-it just reminded of the old guy.
Some one should have helped him put the stickers on-they had wrinkles in them.

[Kieran R1100S]

I'd, like to chime in here!
I recently took the R1200RT for a good 2.5hrs ride and was very impressed.
If I had ownership I would change the screen to a larger one, stock one is ok but could be better. Cruse control is a must and once operated leaves you asking all bikes should have it. The seating position for me at 5'11'' tall was perfect and like the other say it is a 1000km a day bike.
To make it easier for you to make your mind up DO YOUR HOMEWORK!!!
The competition are heavier bikes, by a long way, the BM is a much lighter bike.
Even the Kawasaki GTR Continent buster as posted is big burther in comparison.
The BMW1200RT comes in at 229kg and 258kg fully fueled.
If you have had any experience touring a bike, you experience all type of road conditions. You need to be able to flat foot it, especially with a pillion. The RT is a surprisingly good handler and will put some would-be sport rider to shame.
Take one for a ride. If you suffer from Ducks disease (arse to low to the ground) the bike can be lowered at factory.
The only problem I have with the bike is it is to expensive in OZ for me to have a new one.

[Yellow12]

Turbo, Ron's being nice as he didn't mention one thing that he has mentioned a couple of times before.
It can get hot behind the faring on occasion.

Ron I've been meaning to ask, (and this thread is a good time to do so), what is the part that makes it hot sometimes?

* Is it Simply that the faring is so good you don't get very much wind hitting you to cool down?
* Does the heat build up in the oil cooler and come out somewhere to warm you up? Through the screen on the chest or something?
* Does the faring direct warm air from the heads/exhaust over your legs or something?

I'm interested because just like many people here I like the idea of a dedicated tourer and I think the R12RT would be it.

Cheers,
Ant

[Guest24]

This is what it looks like the last time I rode it. I'm old school about stickers, also Cageyar.

For Yellow12, The Cee Bailey windscreen that you see in my post left the bike cool enough for riding in 107 degree temps out in Colorado. I've got three windscreens total and they change out in 5 minutes max. The fairing does keep you dry. I wear mesh Olympia pants in the summer. If the ST would of had a cruise control, I'd be showing you pictures of it.

[RoLoo]

Originally Posted by Yellow12

Ron I've been meaning to ask, (and this thread is a good time to do so), what is the part that makes it hot sometimes?

* Is it Simply that the faring is so good you don't get very much wind hitting you to cool down?
* Does the heat build up in the oil cooler and come out somewhere to warm you up? Through the screen on the chest or something?
* Does the faring direct warm air from the heads/exhaust over your legs or something?

I'm interested because just like many people here I like the idea of a dedicated tourer and I think the R12RT would be it.

Cheers,
Ant

...no ; no warm (as in : extraordinary hot...) legs, it's mostly the upper body part...
...the fairing is simply to good...


...it keeps you out off the riding wind...



...on the other hand ; on cold days (we have'm over here), it is almost impossible to get it cold...







...and yes ; ESA is a great option, as is the cruise control...
...I both love them...


...we just came back from Italy, and we did 'a couple' of passes over there, and most of the time you are faster up or down than te so called sport-bikes...

...the only bikes you have to let go are the 1200GS, the HP2MegaMoto, and all those kind of bikes (like the SuperDuke and so on)...





...here a few of the passes we did...


Ultental : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-c-zVuwX1Po
Mendelpass : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yt1I--X378
Jaufenpass : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHDwe7vCMI8
roadnumber Sp24 : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goIwApYUUNg
Gampenpass : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJv-MBTW2EA
Passo Compolongo : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw75g9XINws
Karerpass : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lWaYTKDCQo

[OwenM]

I had my first proper outing on my RT today with my wife who has not been on a bike in 30 years, that’s about how long it’s been since I last rode with a pillion as well. I have to say I’m very happy with it, the steering is first rate and general handling is unbelievable for a big bike with pillion, the extra weight of the passenger goes almost unnoticed, even at crawling speeds. Stability is excellent and the bike steers into corners and holds its line with great accuracy in spite of the soft comfortable suspension.

I am 5’10” and with the seat in the low position I can flat foot it, however I prefer the seat in the high position even though I can only touch the ground with my toes; I found the low seat position a bit cramped and unnatural.

The screen works very well (probably better then any other bike) but could be better, research shows that the California Scientific screens are the most effective so I will get one of those.

Ergonomics are very good and so is the seating, although there was some numbness in my tail after 5 hours. If I sit on anything for that long I can expect some discomfort, buy for a motorcycle I have no complaints.

My bike has the conventional suspension which I consider under damped for sports riding, I have ridden the ESA model and it’s only marginally better IMHO.
I think I will get a set of Ohlins as they should give more control and improved ride comfort when properly set up. Damping that works does not need to be adjustable on the fly and I am confident the Ohlins will easily outperform the ESA setup.

The engine does not have the low down torque of a big i4, but with 4000rpm on board it is quite smooth and pulls happily over hills in 6th will no effort, from 5000rpm there is ample power for just about any situation. I like the way I can putter smoothly along with as little as 2500rpm with no complaint as long as I don’t ask for much acceleration.
Keeping to city speed limits is not only easy but actually pleasurable, totally unlike my R12S.

The weather is cool here so I can’t comment on hot weather comfort; the screen and fairing do such a good job very hot conditions could be less than ideal.

I don’t understand Roloo’s comments about the mirrors with a pillion on board, they are clear and work just fine for me, no different to one up.

I also don’t understand comments suggesting the R12RT will keep up with the sports bikes, under very specific conditions it could be competitive but I know I can go a lot quicker on a sports bike that is more than 60kg lighter, has much better suspension and has an extra 60hp.

[RoLoo]

Originally Posted by OwenM

I don’t understand Roloo’s comments about the mirrors with a pillion on board, they are clear and work just fine for me, no different to one up.

...probably my wife has a pair of firm knees...

[Yellow12]

Originally Posted by RoLoo

...no ; no warm (as in : extraordinary hot...) legs, it's mostly the upper body part...
...the fairing is simply to good...


...it keeps you out off the riding wind...

Ah, thanks for clearing that one up Ron. I thought it might be a case of good faring-ness.
Sounds like, depending on your height, a change of screen can help out with putting you in, or taking you out of the airflow.

Ant

[markjenn]

Originally Posted by OwenM

I also don’t understand comments suggesting the R12RT will keep up with the sports bikes, under very specific conditions it could be competitive but I know I can go a lot quicker on a sports bike that is more than 60kg lighter, has much better suspension and has an extra 60hp.

I agree. I really like the new RT overall as a sport-tourer, but it a big/heavy bike, anyone who really likes sport bikes would find it pretty ponderous, at least initially.

I've probably mentioned this before on this forum, but a group of three of us rented bikes on a recent trip and we traded back and forth all the time between the RT, FJR, and ST1300. Everyone liked the RT's comfort, ride, and wind protection, but we all thought it was the least sporty of the three, despite being lighter. It has the softest/least-damped suspension, the least power, and the most gadgets. The huge amount of plastic (both fairing and windscreen) really bugged me - this thing has nearly the frontal area of a Wing. But that's why it is so comfortable.

In this class of bike, I'd take the big Kawi unless I lived in a hot climate in which case I'd take the FJR.

- Mark

[Guest24]

Mark, I haven't driven the other two bikes; but, the Cee Bailey cut down windscreen reduces a lot of the plan form you refer to as a wing. Did your RT rental/loaner have ESA?

[turboflyer]

The wife and I will be doing a test ride together this week. I really appreciate the unbridled enthusiasm and hits as well. This kind of exchange give folks more to think about when considering such a bike. I did test the K1300GT. Just to much power for me. Yea I never thought I would say it. Guess I like the heart beat of the twins. Please keep the onfo comming.

[markjenn]

Originally Posted by Nail24

Did your RT rental/loaner have ESA?

No. I cranked all the preload I could into the rear and it still felt way too soft.

- Mark

[Guest24]

Originally Posted by markjenn

No. I cranked all the preload I could into the rear and it still felt way too soft.

- Mark

I did not like the non-ESA on my 05 RT but the ESA equipped 08 RT is much better.

[OwenM]

ESA is better but still not good enough IMHO, A pair of Ohlins goes for $1500US at the moment so I can’t see much point in ordering the ESA option.

[Guest24]

Got my RT used with about 7k miles on it. If I keep it past warranty and the ESA goes out, then I'll install the Ohlins.

[RoLoo]

Originally Posted by OwenM

ESA is better but still not good enough IMHO, A pair of Ohlins goes for $1500US at the moment so I can’t see much point in ordering the ESA option.

If I would use my RT only for myself, I wouldn’t care for ESA suspension at all. Probably a set of Wilbers (or Öhlins) would do the job much better indeed.

But ; for two up touring ESA is just perfect.

Bad road (or on those brick roads we’ve still got over here so now and then) : 2 helmets + Comfort, and you can see the fork legs bouncing up and down, but in the saddle it feels as if the road surface is still smooth.

Autobahn : 2 helmets + Sport, and the RT keeps stable up to some 120 MPH

Normal roads (and speeds) : 2 helmets + Normal. The suspension just does the job.