Lawyer recommendation

SergioK · 10-11-2012, 02:40 PM

Anyone have a good lemon law attorney (here in California) they can recommend?

bradzdotcom · bradzdotcom's Garage

you gonna sue sand?

because if you're looking to sue sand, i believe that Ralf would make a mighty fine deposition-ite. depositioner?
i've heard that he's seen the sand attack you and eject you off your bike at least a couple of times.

i also have personally observed the fact that with even the slightest provocation of sand in a corner apex, sand is after you in a most vicious way.
i will testify too. you might have to buy me a tie though. maybe a belt too. you're about a size nine in shiny or lace-up shoes, right?

can anybody else on this board possibly pitch in and help support sergio's lawsuit against sand?
i know many of you have ridden with him.
now is the time to speak up and support the man.

if it were me, i'd save some money, admit i'm sand's bee-och and keep my insurance current, but i have an okay relationship with sand, so we're cool.

either way, glad to help you out serg!

just another example of how supportive this forum can be!

SergioK · 10-11-2012, 03:47 PM

No, not sand. Though sand may be partly to blame. Do they still use sand to make engine cases?

roger albert · 10-11-2012, 05:38 PM

There was a lot of it in wobbly wheel I took apart today, so it seems to be all over

(real story, idiots at shop my customer bought bike from powdercoated entire -6 spoked wheel, hub, and spokes assembly as one unit, including bearing holders, IN PLACE '. And obviously never cleaned the hub after blasting it. I´d say it was literally about 80% grease, and 10% each metal and sand in there. - ugh ·"$&&/"$$%/!" )

Buena suerte Sergio!

sgoodwin · sgoodwin's Garage

Ok, I'll bite, what happened?

SergioK · 10-11-2012, 06:55 PM

Oh nothing, just that there's a casting defect in my engine case and BMW won't make good on a repair for it.

AZ-Twin · 10-11-2012, 07:33 PM

Sergio,

Seem to recall some old posts about an oil leak on your HP2, is that what this is about?

SergioK · 10-11-2012, 07:44 PM

Yep, seems the leak is from a hole in the case. Took it in from day one for them to fix it. Dealers always thought it was something else. Now, 4 years later, they finally found the real culprit, a manufacturing defect.

PFFOG · 10-11-2012, 09:14 PM

roger albert · 10-11-2012, 09:21 PM

This is difficult.

In principle, they should fix it. Especially as it's apparently been documented as an issue from dia uno.

Otoh, IF, the above tubes of black and red goo can fix it, fairly easily and reliably, then it might be better to turn the other cheek and forget about it.

I don´t know enough to comment really, but wish you luck either way.

1100s nut · 10-12-2012, 06:31 AM

A hole in the case. I would love to see pics. What location? If its a hole or a stress crack I would persue the legal direction too...and you have the docs. to back you up that it did not just occur. If it was some old beater bike that was just a transportation device then maybe no big deal...but you have a special bike....it should 100% correct.

Lane

ckcarr · ckcarr's Garage

I'm torn on this.

Your bike is a limited production, special, hand crafted machine. Even though it's 4 years old certain components should be perfect. Forever. This stuff is a no brainer in the auto industry, with 100,000 mile + warranties on engine, drive train, etc. Batteries good for 60 months, or pro rated.. But when it comes to motorcycles it seems minimal.

But, BMW had a 36 month warranty, so when did the problem surface? Has it been documented all along? Are there any other cases out there like this? When did you bring it to the dealer's attention?

I am always a little surprised when BMW just refuses to make things right, especially on something like this. I'd think they would just ship another engine over from Germany for you - just to ensure the customer base says "Wow, they take care of us..." $10,000 or whatever it would cost is nothing to a company like this... Especially when the bike's price was about $11,000 more than a standard r1200s...

AZ-J · AZ-J's Garage

Have you called BMW NA about this? I can tell you from experience they are far more reasonable than any dealer.

tjs · 10-12-2012, 08:54 AM

Sounds like the Dealer techs were not very interested in locating the leak. I have had 3 or 4 situations where you could not detect where the oil is coming from. Cleaned the suspected area, then add dye to the oil. The spot the oil is leaking from will show up with ultraviolet light.Have had 2 engines and 1 brand new cylinder repalced under wtty. Have you talked to the BMW technical Rep. for your area about this problem? tjs

Steve Carlton · 10-12-2012, 11:30 AM

Michael Saunders
San Diego
(858) 272-9988

SergioK · 10-12-2012, 01:33 PM

Thanks Steve.

Yes, I called BMW NA. They denied the out of warranty repair. I clearly stated the oil leak appeared from day one and the dealer never found the true source of the leak til now because it never occurred to them that the there was a hole in the side of the engine case. It's not like you can see it. It's virtually microscopic but enough where trace amounts of oil can seep through. It's clearly a manufacturing defect because it is in a smooth & flat part of the engine case. It was not something that was caused by damage or anything else.

So, the dealer gave me two 'options'. The first and obvious is to replace the bad casting (engine case) with a good one. That basically requires a complete engine rebuilt. Or, the second option, is to do a small tack weld on the case to plug that hole. I'm thinking I may try JB weld instead if Mr. Carlton's recommendation doesn't pan out.

In either case, WHAT THE F BMW? This crap pissed me off.

shreddr · shreddr's Garage

replace the bad case, and while you are at it, go for the big bore top end and stroker crank! after all you don't want it to be a total waste of time!

1100s nut · 10-12-2012, 02:23 PM

I see....sounds like maybe some sand from the sand casting maybe contaminated it the pour. I have never seen this, but is there anyway to try to drive a very small needle in the hole and break it off. I have seen casting blemishes before but normally its not a problem....or its so bad in goes back into the scrap pile for another go. I would go for a repair before I would do a tear down.

Lane

AZ-J · AZ-J's Garage

SergioK, what is the California lemon law? Sounds to me as if you had it in more than 4 times for this leak while under warranty. If you can prove to NA you did, and write them with the proof, they have to cover it.

Right now out of warranty, NA does not have to speak with you!

Steve Carlton · 10-12-2012, 06:53 PM

CA Lemon Laws cover motorcycles, and Sergio could be looking at a complete refund including tax pro-rated against a 120,000 "lifespan." So, if the leak was pointed out to the dealer at 6,000 miles, Sergio should get 95% of what he paid for the bike plus tax. With that, he could buy another used one for quite a bit less if he wanted another HP2 Sport. Another option is BMW could sell his a new equivalent bike (since the HP2 Sport isn't sold anymore) for a 95% discount. I think the more times the bike was in for an oil leak, the better. "No problem observed" is a cheesy way for a dealer to attempt to defeat the Lemon Laws. Michael Saunders has a 100% success rate in my experience with him.