Pelican Parts
Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   Pelican Parts Forums > BMW Forums > BMW Technical Forums > BMW R1100S / R1200S Tech Forum


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread
Author
Thread Post New Thread    Reply
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 8
2004 R1100S: Cause of the brake failure warning

Hello,

I am seeking help: What are some of the fault causes that can cause the brake failure red flasher warning to go off?

- I have checked the brake fluid level - no issue.
- I have checked proper inflation of the ties - no issues.
- I have ridden the bike some 45 miles in stop and go traffic; both the front and rear brakes function without issue (but I did not stop hard enough to verify the ABS function as the ground was a bit wet).

- Last time I rode the bike was about 6 mo ago and it wasn't an issue then (I checked for ridden issues and did not see any evidence this was the cause).
- When first starting out, the light would go off for a short while, then reappear and stay. But, it doesn't do this all the time. Most times, it comes on when started and just stays on.

Ideas would be appreciated.

Jerry
Old 12-18-2017, 04:49 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #1 (permalink)
Brent
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: santa cruz
Posts: 1,169
Garage
check both tail light bulbs
Old 12-18-2017, 08:23 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #2 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 8
Thanks Brent, will check this to be sure.

I will also check the rear brake reservoir, sensor cables front and rear, and actual sensor front and rear.

If no luck, I will disconnect the battery.

I'm still open to any other suggestion.

Will post back what I find.
Old 12-19-2017, 05:29 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #3 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 347
Garage
Dab a little solder on the rear light bulb if need be.
__________________
2004 R1100S
Old 12-19-2017, 08:42 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #4 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 8
A quick update:

1. I had to pull some bodywork to get to the rear reservoir and found it was very low, just a bit before the bottom. I looked but could see no sensor to detect a low fluid condition. I doubt this is the problem, but will fill and bleed the rear caliper.

2. I checked the sensor wiring front and rear, no obvious issues.

3. I pulled the rear tail light lens and verified that the single light bulb works. Either brake lever gets the bulb to light up. Since it worked, I did not add solder to the back of the bulb.

4. I started the bike and monitored the warning lights. The lower left flasher stays on at the 1 Hz rate, after a short 4 Hz burst; there is no other warning flasher. If you activate the rear brake lever, there is no change. If you pull the front lever, there is a change. 1 Hz warning light changes to a 4 Hz rate and the warning light next to it lights up. This only happens when you pull the front brake lever. When the lever is pulled and held, you can hear the servo. This suggests to me the fault condition is in the front brake circuit. I read the owners manual (but left it at the other house), so I cannot remember what the signature indicates. It is either there is no ABS function and/or I am on residual braking only.

I will investigate the actual front sensor (clean) and refill the rear reservoir/bleed rear brake. If this doesn't work, I will try disconnecting the battery and after a few minutes, reconnect it.

Any other thoughts?

Jerry
Old 12-20-2017, 03:34 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #5 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 347
Garage
Did you refill the reservoir ?

I found a procedure to bleed the ABS circuits -
http://www.ukgser.com/technical/nick/Brake%20bleeding%20%28All%20BMW%20EVO%20systems,%2 0%2704-%2707%29.pdf

If you're going thru a brake bleed procedure, a funnel with a tight stopper, isn't necessary , but it makes it easier if you are doing it by yourself -
https://www.beemerboneyard.com/abs3funnel.html

Here is another good pdf -
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwihpZzkva7YAhVFeSYKHVdpDDQQFgg4MAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fusers.rcn.com%2Fdehager%2Fservice %2Fservice_abs3.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2wvu8xy1TtH3VdDrOVdOX6
__________________
2004 R1100S

Last edited by Groceryrun; 12-28-2017 at 08:29 PM.. Reason: Added addl' link
Old 12-20-2017, 09:13 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #6 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 8
Groceryrun: You are a life saver, thank you for the link for the bleed procedure.

UPDATE
I have looked into the rider's manual to help troubleshoot the warning light signals. It seems the front circuit is working as it should. You can hear the the pump working and there never was any hint of the front brakes not working correctly.

When actuating the rear, it does not seem to activate the pump. I also find I have to really push to get the rear wheel to stop turning. Based on the general warning light staying lit and the ABS light flashing at 4 HZ, the manual indicates "at least one brake circuit in RESIDUAL BRAKING FUNCTION mode". I pull the bodywork off to get to the rear reservoir and find it is very low, just a tad above the drain point/well below the minimum level. It is clear, any angle of the bike will expose the drain point. So, I think I got air into the rear braking circuit and this is the cause of the problem.

I pull more bodywork off and lift the tank to get access to the ABS unit. After all the work tonight, I find I do not have the correct wrenches to release any of the 6 nipples on the ABS unit so I cannot properly bleed the system! I have to put the project on hold until I get back from a short trip and have the right tools.

After bleeding the brake system, I will check the battery since all is off. With any luck, that will fix the problem.

Jerry

Last edited by spacetiger; 12-27-2017 at 02:52 PM..
Old 12-27-2017, 02:49 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #7 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 347
Garage
Excellent BMW motorcycle Integral iabs Brake Flushing and Bleeding pdf -

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwihpZzkva7YAhVFeSYKHVdpDDQQFgg4MAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fusers.rcn.com%2Fdehager%2Fservice %2Fservice_abs3.pdf&usg=AOvVaw2wvu8xy1TtH3VdDrOVdOX6
__________________
2004 R1100S
Old 12-28-2017, 08:34 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #8 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 8
Groceryrun,

Have you bled the servo assisted brakes?

I have not gotten the rear successfully bled. Seems I cannot get the servo to activate like the front by activating the master cylinder. I have to see about fully flushing the control valves. Then, I will try to bleed the wheel circuit again. I was a bit surprised that I would have an issue....
Old 01-12-2018, 07:29 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #9 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 347
Garage
Checking the easy stuff first -

1. Near the rear brake lever, there's an electrical switch.
When you press down on the rear brake lever , listen for a click. Sometimes there's a small rock or dirt that stops the switch from closing.



2. Check the rear brake light bulb -
The rear brake light bulb, 1157 , has 2 filaments.
When you turn on the motorcycle, you will see the one of the filaments light up (on my motorcycle, it's the lower filament ).
When you press/pull either brake lever, the second filament will also light up.
Using sunglasses you should see both filaments light up at the same time.
__________________
2004 R1100S
Old 01-13-2018, 07:59 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #10 (permalink)
R1100s
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Australia Tasmania
Posts: 445
Garage
[QUOTE=Groceryrun;
2. Check the rear brake light bulb -
The rear brake light bulb, 1157 , has 2 filaments.
[/QUOTE]
been caught there.
__________________
2009 HP2 Sport
2006 R1200s Remus exhaust, K&N, ilmberger carbon hugger, Ohlins, ABS, Heated grips, Wide Rear Wheel
2006 Subaru WRX STI S204 #318 / 600
Old 01-13-2018, 04:00 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #11 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 8
Thanks my fellow riders for the help. An update:

- double checked the bulb for 2 filament operation - no issues here as both filaments work.

- Checked the small switch - no issues as I can here it click when the brake lever is depressed.

- Completed the flush - there were a few small bubbles on the control side, no bubbles on the circuit to rear brake.

- I still cannot get the servo to come on when the rear brake lever is activated. The front MC activates the servo when the lever is pulled. CAN SOMEONE TELL ME IF THEIR SERVO WORKS WHEN THE REAR BRAKE LEVER IS ACTIVATED WITH THE IGNITION SWITCH ON?

- Right now, the general warning light stays ON and the ABS warning light light is FLASHING AT 4 HZ. Per the owners manual, it indicates "At least one brake circuit in RESIDUAL BRAKING FUNCTION mode". I believe the bad circuit is the rear.

I was going to sell the bike, its in great condition. But, I can't sell it in its current condition. If I can verify it is the pump, then I think I have 2 options:
1. Have the pump rebuilt ( the place in Idaho has not indicated they can rebuild the third generation pump yet, so it would have to be sent to Germany).
2. Bypass the ABS and make this a standard brake set up. If I go this route, I am likely to keep the bike as it still an awesome bike and would only be worth $3K (best case). If I go this route, is there a thread I can review to see what is entailed? I have modified plenty of motorcycle brakes in my time. My only thoughts would be the electrics to run the brake lights; how much can I change. I think I would remove the pump (weight) and keep it handy for the day the US place can rebuild the pump.

comments?

Jerry
Old 01-15-2018, 12:56 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #12 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 347
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by spacetiger View Post
CAN SOMEONE TELL ME IF THEIR SERVO WORKS WHEN THE REAR BRAKE LEVER IS ACTIVATED WITH THE IGNITION SWITCH ON?
Jerry
With the key in the "ON" position ( engine not running ) , the rear brake lever will activate the servo just like the front brake lever does.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spacetiger View Post
Checked the small switch - no issues as I can here it click when the brake lever is depressed. Jerry
Let's test the small switch. Follow the small switch lead to where ever it goes ( maybe the right hand tail section connector , connector then hardwired to the ABS unit ? ). Test the switch. Check the lead and connector for corrosion.
__________________
2004 R1100S

Last edited by Groceryrun; 01-18-2018 at 01:35 PM..
Old 01-15-2018, 07:52 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #13 (permalink)
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Central NJ
Posts: 347
Garage
Youtube I-ABS, Integral ABS removal .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLrn45PJD_c
__________________
2004 R1100S
Old 01-17-2018, 11:42 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #14 (permalink)
Reply

Thread Tools
Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

 


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 11:34 AM.


 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page
 

DTO Garage Plus vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.