Hell, I can remember when I used to order a fillet. Of course that was 40 years ago, but still...

when it comes to steak or pork, or even chicken or fish, fat is where it's at...

Yep. As I stated above, my dad always cooked really good ribeyes from the butcher on his Weber grill w really hot charcoal briquets. He seasoned them first w black pepper, (can't remember if he used anything else), then really seared them so that the outside of steak was charred and the inside was dark pink, (or however a guest preferred).

They were incredibly good but I always wondered if his eventual cancer of throat was caused partially by eating too much charred food, which is really high-risk for that. Of course he also smoked for years and drank a lot of Scotch for years, etc. The real danger discovered in recent years is from acid reflux, which all of us lovers of acidic foods usually have.

Not meaning to be a wet blanket, just that there might be a health aspect to certain very tasty diets. Definitely moderate red meat but GD those steaks were good. :cool:

I definitely think when you brown meat to the point of charring, it becomes less healthy. I also think that charring ruins the taste of the steak. I once ate at The Forge in Palm Beach and they cooked my steak like that. It was a huge disappointment and I probably should've sent it back to the kitchen.

I would imagine your dad probably used salt too, without that most steaks are nowhere near as tasty. The question of when to salt and pepper steak is an interesting one. I tend to prefer to salt my steaks fairly heavily well ahead of cooking, at least an hour or two. I hold off on the pepper until after it's cooked, for two reasons. Pepper is soluble in oil, so I tend to think it does better when you pepper the meat while it's resting. It also changes its flavor when cooked and it can be burned if it gets too hot.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1531602113.jpg

Beef Wellington at Home,Yummy.

Yeah, as for pepper, I save it for resting. I only season my steaks with salt. I found that adding pepper upfront before cooking sort of added a bitter flavor.

And nice job on that Wellington!!

It could be that my dad salted the steak before grilling, I can’t remember and unfortunately, it’s too late to ask him. :(

I may be describing his technique wrongly, it was a fairly quick cook on a very hot grill and while it was pretty dark and a little charred on the outside, it was still very delicious and juicy. We ate at some very famous steak restaurants in town and definitely knew the difference between sublime and mediocre.

Sidebar; have you ever squeezed a chunk of fresh lemon on a steak on the plate before eating it? There is a place in town here w a great ribeye where they always put a large slice of lemon on the plate and it makes it even more delicious, IMO. I also use a little salt and fresh ground pepper, I am crazy about black pepper on almost everything I eat.

I remember being at the butcher counter w my dad once when I was in college, grabbing a couple steaks to take home and cook for dinner. I asked my dad, “how can you tell the best one to buy?”

He answered, “You go out and make some money, boy. I’ll show you how to spend it.” :D

He was a character.

I've never used lemon on a steak but I've used lime a fair bit. It's something I've learned from studying Mexican cuisine and you can also find it occasionally in some parts of Europe. I use mostly the zest and I will admit that I do use a lot of lemon zest in other dishes.

I will often pan fry a skirt steak. I will rest it for at least an hour before cooking it and prior to putting in the pan I will salt it and squeeze some lime juice over it. I will let that sit for 10 or 15 minutes then it gets thrown into the pan long enough to get good color on both sides and get to about 110° in the middle. I remove it from the pan and let it rest, then I start a pan sauce with what's left. I will sauté some finely chopped garlic and finally diced anchovies, then deglaze the pan with about a quarter cup of water and when that becomes a sauce I'll throw in some finely diced green onion tops and pour the sauce over the steak. It gets finished with a little freshly grated lime zest.

I agree about pepper. I consume vast quantities of it.

Two Words: Sous Vide

https://www.seriouseats.com/2015/06/food-lab-complete-guide-to-sous-vide-steak.html

Ah the old “pelican don’t read the thread and skip to the end and use a buzzword” reply. Nice work, Dad! :)

I wonder if things have changed that much for the worse? I haven't been to Lugers for about 5 years..

The Times Drops a Brutal Zero-Star Review on Peter Luger

The Times article

Peter Luger Used to Sizzle. Now It Sputters.

Some other related articles:


Self-Satisfied New Yorkers Swear They Hated Peter Luger All Along

Peter Luger Responds to Zero-Star Review: Critics’ ‘Whims Have Changed’

Eater Critics Debate: Is Peter Luger Still Good?

Guilty as charged, but I believe this was in response to Tim & your posts, 33-36.

More specifically, I've been to PL, was not impressed considering the cost. If I was in the city wanting a steak, I'd probably go back to Old Homestead.

I am beginning to wonder if finer restaurants are starting to rest on their reputations. I think most people wouldn't even notice.

Date and I went to one of Boston's best restaurants, Ocean Prime. I'll spare all of the (many) details of how the night was subpar, but I was literally astonished at the $70 bone-in ribeye placed in front of me, ordered rare with a very hot sear. It was supposed to be prime, it was certainly choice, and whoever butchered it left the silverskin in between the cap and the eye. It looked like it had been thrown on a flat top griddle at the local diner and let sit there a few minutes. It was sent back. And the whole experience was closer to Applebee's than a top tier restaurant. This sort of thing seems to be happening more and more when I go out.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1572391136.jpg

must be something wrong with me...I cannot eat steak that pink.

St Elmo's has been disappointing the last few times I've been there. It used to be that waiters had to be able to take a table of 7 people's orders, without writing anything down. Not the case any more. Also, I ordered green beans last time I went...they couldn't even be bothered to trim the ends (like they used to).

I went to a newer place in Indy earlier in the year...Tony's. Terrific meal, and FANTASTIC service. A week after I went, I got a thank you card in the mail from my waiter, thanking me for coming and that he hoped I enjoyed my ribeye.

Then you wouldn't like this.

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http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1572395389.jpg


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1572395389.jpg


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I’ll eat his, if he doesn’t want it.

That was one the best steaks I've ever done. It was perfect.

Pssst... go to Tampa and go to Berns.

It is an experience. They grow butcher and age their own beef.

The place us decadent to the point of gaudy the evening will leave an impression on you. Fly into Tampa, spend a quick weekend. Go see the Dali museum in St. Pete. Make sure to get reservations about 6 weeks out.

After going there, I have no desire to visit any other steakhouse.

I have tried others. The Forge in Miami ( go to place for cocaine kingpins) Charlie's in Tampa and Ruth's Cris in Palm Beach. None come close to approaching the experience of Berns.


After posting this. I need to book a trip over and hit up Berns. I feel a road trip coming on. :D

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I still love the Golden Steer in Vegas. In a seedy, terrible looking strip mall just off the Strip, but once inside, you are transported to the height of the Rat Pack, all waiters in tux's, top notch service and very good steak and sides to go with it.

Or take a risk and try some steak tartar at Miguel's on Siesta Key, Sarasota for something different.
Get the early bird. It's in a beach mini mall, a bit dark inside, but a dress up place.

There's no way to hide raw meat quality.

By the miracle of the internet a New York Times review of Peter Lugers showed up in my news feed a couple of hours after I opened this thread. The reviewer trashed the place. Basically, “Used to be good, old and dated now, has been passed by by better places.”

Interesting about the old places that have slipped, the smart ones know that they have to always be diligent about keeping their reputation. I’m sitting at the bar @ Little Dom’s right now in LA, waiting for my dinner companion to show up. I’m about to have good steak and it was reading this thread 30 minutes ago that is to blame. :)

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1572410399.jpg

I had a great lunch at Lugers last year.
Tried to keep on a budget, so ordered their burger, maybe the best I’ve ever had. A side of bacon, amazing!
Tomatoes and shrimp. Staff was great and very kind to my 5 year old son.
They gave us a fat stack of their gold chocolate coins.
The steak is good just sooo expensive.
They also have free parking.
YMMV

Now this is funny:

Check out the Yelp reviews prior to and after the zero star review...

Looks like a bunch of young "influencers" jumped on to belatedly recall and post about a less than stellar experience...Granted, there were some clunker reviews in the past too... Overall 4 star avereage out of 5600 reviews?


https://www.yelp.com/biz/peter-luger-brooklyn-2?osq=Peter+Lugers

Having worked at some higher end restaurants in college, the above is very true. Every new place is looking for signs of decay in the old places, especially in places with a combo of tourists and locals. I worked a few restaurants in and around Ghirardelli Square (my Mom also worked there in the 1940s in the summers as clerical help) and the competition to get and hold a "rep" was ferocious.

Looked at their breakfast menu - I'm in.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/29/dining/peter-luger-review-pete-wells.html?rref=collection%2Fsectioncollection%2Ff ood&action=click&contentCollection=dining&region=r ank&module=package&version=highlights&contentPlace ment=1&pgtype=sectionfront

seems this guy did not like Lugars

I've been to PL once, We did steak for 2 and a KC Strip (IRC) With all the sides a couple Shrimp cocktails and a few regular cocktails. Dinner was around 600.00 for all 4 of us. It was really good.

Dang, $150 per head is a very expensive place all right. I never mind paying for a good meal, but I would have a hard time justifying $150 a head for any meal. We ate a fancy high brow place in Carmel-by-the-Sea that had a fantastic view of the sunset and the ocean. It was not $150 per person. Of course I only had one beer and my wife had tea. A couple of cocktails at many places can be 25 bucks each.

We have a local crazy price steak house. It will be about $150 per head is you do some drinks. Or I can go to Cattleman's down in the stockyard and have some of the best steaks anywhere for a 1/3 that cost. Guess where I go for a nice steak.

Cattleman's is way overrated...

Restaurant prices are getting a little out of hand, though.

Never been to PL but have had some mighty fine steaks in NYC. After reading the recent review: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/10/29/dining/peter-luger-review-pete-wells.html?smid=tw-nytfood&smtyp=cur
it seems to me that PL is a victim of their success. They rested on their laurels and forgot to maintain excellence. I have seen this before with restaurants. They start out excellent but eventually become "the place to go" so that you can brag I went to... last night. People are paying for bragging rights and not best of the best.

The NYT reviewer has way too much power. I won't put much credence in a single review.

I once ate at the Forge in Miami. I had one of the worst steaks in my life and the entire experience sucked. Is that true of every steak that they cook and every dining experience? Or did I get a bad steak on a bad night?

Sorry to read about St Elmos - Whenever I'm in Indy, I make it a point to go there. I remember the time you could smoke there and buy cigars. It had am ol school feel to it. I have plans to go to Indy in early May - I will check out Tony's

Was there last month for the second time in as many years. I go for the shrimp cocktail and the camaraderie of the guys I go with. The rest was meh.


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To be fair we probably had 100-125 just in drinks. It was a great experience. I have a buddy who is a big wig with Bank of America, he made a call and got us a Saturday night 7pm reservation. He has one of their credit cards.

My Wife and I went to Peter Lugars on the advice of a co worker who is from New York (Brooklyn). We both thought it was just Ok. We've been back to NYC since then several times and have not been back......

The shrimp cocktail is still great. I used to go often, but now I just go upstairs to the 1933 lounge and grab a shrimp cocktail and a drink. I'm going on Saturday before the Tool concert.

That seems to be the consensus, which would be NBD if it was $30-40 a head. But it ain’t. :(

Bringing it back local, ate @ Arroyo Chop House in Pasadena recently and it was the shizzle. Very expensive but super high end steaks. :)

Smith & Wollensky's blows Peter Lugar off the map.