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-   -   5 min. charging...could this be a game-changer for EVs? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/1029124-5-min-charging-could-game-changer-evs.html)

berettafan 05-09-2019 01:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by biosurfer1 (Post 10453827)
This will not happen without some crazy MAJOR upgrades to every electrical grid out there. I've seen what it takes to plan and install a 1 MW customer, and thats for an expected typical commercial load.

1MW spikes at uncertain intervals? Ya right!
this is the reality of EV that no-one talks about. we do not have the capacity for this. and capacity is expensive as hell.

would it make a difference in sales if you could charge in 10 minutes? hell yes! but I just can't fathom the changes needed to make that a reality for more than a few wealthy people in certain areas and at certain times of the day.

Jims5543 05-09-2019 01:35 PM
I do not think this is going to be a setup for the typical EV drivers garage. I can see this in commercial areas where one would need to stop and get charged back up real quick.

I have a 220 setup in my garage, it changed my electric bill $40 a month. Ironically, I changed out my Air conditioning a year earlier, we saw a drop of about $50-$60 a month in our summertime bill so our EV is not taxing the grid at all. As a household we have actually lessened our power usage despite adding a EV charger to our house.

I think these high speed chargers like Tesla is using at power stations will mostly be seen in commercial areas where power demands are already very high.

Jim Richards 05-09-2019 01:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sammyg2
Originally Posted by red-beard View Post
The issue isn't the charger, it is the battery. IF what they are printing is true, they have made a much more efficient battery which obviates the need for cooling. That will be huge. The charging will just be what ever the batteries can handle.

I see they pick 80%. That is pretty much where you have to back off the maximum current Bulk Charge phase (constant current) and switch to Absorption (constant voltage).

They do not say what the kWh of the system are, but lets assume it is 100kWh battery. 80% = 80kWh. To charge that in 5 minutes will take 80*12 = 960 kW. Call it a Megawatt.
a megawatt is a whole bunch of energy.
1 megawatt = 1,341.02 horsepower

Quote:
The 1 MW photovoltaic solar installation by Gap Inc's WesternDistribution Center in Fresno, CA takes up five acres, cost $7million, and took 6 months to build.




1 MW is in the range of output of an older locomotive, such as the U18B GE Locomotive shown here, built in 1973-76, which puts out1.3 MW of power.
Meh.

https://aa1a5178aef33568e9c4-a77ea51...b733e67ea6.jpg

aschen 05-09-2019 01:55 PM
Quick look on google says a typical manufacturing facility uses 95kwh per sqft per year. By my calculations that means a medium sized 100k sqft factor has an average power draw of around 1MW if they operate continuously day and night. Peak usage would likely be much higher depending on context. of course you could do alot of 5min charges with 1 mW continuous.

I think this is mostly vaporware and designed to get some headlines, but 1 mW in the industrial sense doesnt seem that absurd especially considering the duty cycle would be quite low. the energy density of super caps is about 1/20 lithium ion, so if an EV had a 1000lb battery it would take about 10 tons of supercaps at the charging station to hold the equivalent charge. Then you may be waiting for your charger to charge depending on the utilization rate

OK its a little absurd, but no scifi

wdfifteen 05-09-2019 02:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GH85Carrera (Post 10453806)
Yea, I want to see the numbers on how much amperage and voltage that takes. I can't imaging any normal home in this country had the electrical capacity to do it.
Not many, if any, people need to charge that fast at home. You're home, destination reached. It's only on trips where the destination is farther than your battery capacity that fast charging is an issue. You don't have a gas station at home, so why need a gas-up fast charger?

mepstein 05-09-2019 04:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wdfifteen (Post 10454038)
Not many, if any, people need to charge that fast at home. You're home, destination reached. It's only on trips where the destination is farther than your battery capacity that fast charging is an issue. You don't have a gas station at home, so why need a gas-up fast charger?
Exactly what I was thinking. It would only be needed rarely until more people go electric and there is time to scale up. It wasn’t that long ago that the whole idea of Tesla was unbelievable.

RWebb 05-09-2019 04:13 PM
graphene based (enhanced) batteries are the big woo-woo right now, but I'll be surprised if any manf. has them (outside of a lab)


so... what is the technology here?

rcooled 05-09-2019 04:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RWebb (Post 10454169)
so... what is the technology here?
Piech is still playing it close to the vest. Here's a statement from the web article ↓

"Due to the ongoing patent process, we cannot comment more detailed information about our lithium ion cells at the moment. This much I can reveal: we were able to construct the inner workings of the cell in such a way that significantly stronger currents can flow, hardly any heat develops during charging and discharging, and the entire recuperation can be made much more efficient."

stealthn 05-10-2019 08:52 AM
Talking to a guy I know at the local Porsche dealership he said Porsche has really up'd the game with their tech, so much so they will be licensing it out to other manufacturers. He said they are using capacitors to flash charge the batteries and they are not BS'ing about the capabilities.


I guess it will be coming to light soon enough. He is going down to drive the Taycan in June at the dealer launch.


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