Bomb drops gone bad.

[Rusty Heap]

ooooops...........



"I throw a bomb into the air, where it last I don't know where"




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPTnmZ_HPAs

[pete3799]

Yeah.......i think they need to work on that a bit.

[Seahawk]

"Stores and Separation" testing used to be a bit of trial and error - with the results in the video (which I use all the time in briefs).

There has been a lot of progress in modeling and simulation, to a very high degree of confidence.

Here is a very good paper on the subject from almost 10 years ago - many more strides have been made.

https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a538155.pdf

More: https://www.arnold.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/410262/future-ea-18g-undergoes-store-separation-testing-at-aedc/

We go into store and separation analysis next year on a wing stored UAS we have designed. Very exciting stuff for us.

My wife's brother has a PhD in math and he runs a lot of the Navy Compatibility, Stores and Separation Testing...really interesting stuff.

Sorry to geek out!

[svandamme]

how can big heavy finless bombs drop and go back up again???

[masraum]

Originally Posted by svandamme

how can big heavy finless bombs drop and go back up again???

Those weren't bombs, they were fuel tanks that were empty after being used or some other similar item (mostly).

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by svandamme

how can big heavy finless bombs drop and go back up again???

All different types of wing stores (bombs, fuel tanks, TARPS Pods, etc.) undergo exhaustive testing so they actually separate from the host aircraft across the entire spectrum of the aircraft's performance envelope.

"Store" like to hand around (or worse, come off the aircraft in unpredictable fashion) for any number of reasons, pressure waves being the biggest culprit along with poor aerodynamic design...so much "stuff".

Read the link I posted, it goes into the subject at a reasonable level.

[sc_rufctr]

The worst for spectators is a hang up... Because you don't know when it will fall off.

Long time ago I was watching a demo and there was a hang up. The bomb fell about 500 meters closer to the crowd than intended.
No one got hit but you could hear the shrapnel wisseling above our heads.

[pavulon]

Originally Posted by svandamme

how can big heavy finless bombs drop and go back up again???

Because lift is disproportionately attributable to the negative pressure on top of wings.

[cstreit]

The planes might have been descending slightly too,,,

[flipper35]

They still have to test that. We lost an F14 during 0-g testing of the ejectors for AIM-7 Sparrow missiles.

[svandamme]

Originally Posted by flipper35

They still have to test that. We lost an F14 during 0-g testing of the ejectors for AIM-7 Sparrow missiles.

http://www.ejectionsite.com/F-14%20SHOOTDOWN.pdf

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by flipper35

They still have to test that. We lost an F14 during 0-g testing of the ejectors for AIM-7 Sparrow missiles.

Compatibility, stores and separation testing includes as much of the aircraft envelope as reasonable...pitch, yaw, roll, airspeed, etc., etc.

The ship side is as important...launch and recovery, logistics, etc.

Putting something on the wing/stub wing of an aircraft is a complex endeavor; bomb, missile, gas tanks or sensors are treated the same.

[svandamme]

Anybody here got DCSworld F14B sim on his pc?
It's about as close as I can get short of going sightseeing to Iran to see em

I figured out the pilot side and can bring it back on the boat
Air refueling is out of the question with VR goggles, it's near impossible on a flat screen to get into the basket properly.
The AA stuff and bomb stuff works..

figure otu some of the backseat stuff for radar, but haven't done anything with the lantirn yet.

Obviously it's all a lot easier if there aren't any G's and the Ejection isn't all that brutal either
But it's good fun.



They even simulated negative G fuel surge.
inverted for bout 10 secs at Zone 5 or 20 at mil power... Engines quit on ya

[flipper35]

DCS is awesome, but it has a bit of a learning curve.

Paul, in a combat sim durng a LAN party (I am old, so what) I had an AV-8B and the guy behind be was desperate to get me with a gun kill. I pulled nose high, rolled inverted and popped 4 cluster bombs while I pulled positive G toward the ground. The guy a couple chairs down yelped in surprise. Of course they did not work exactly as I hoped, but it did distract him long enough for me to skedaddle into a canyon. Not sure I would be a good one to design those tests, but I would have done it in real life if I were desperate.

[svandamme]

Im trying to find out if I can zoom on yo the merge with engines cold like Hoser did at Aceval.

Not sure id Dcs modeling of the Aim9m works the same or if it would still detect some kind of heat.

Only been at it for few weeks. no multiplayer yet. just learning how it all works and what works and what dont.

doing all the missions and setting up scenarios.

tty setting up that Rooskie Pyotr Velikiy missile cruiser and flying near it.
the Sam potential it packs is off the charts.

but it cant see ya if you fly 10 ft over sea level

[flipper35]

From the Lima version onward the Sidewinder is able to lock on from all aspects just from the friction on the skin of the aircraft.

[svandamme]

Originally Posted by flipper35

From the Lima version onward the Sidewinder is able to lock on from all aspects just from the friction on the skin of the aircraft.

Well Hoser who flew in Aceval tests of the Lima, describes how he came in sjit hot, turned off his engines , he turned his F14 cold and the opposing aircraft with the Lima's could not lock on...

Book : Hoser here:Shoot! has all that
He's the one that got the F15 with the F14 's pipper on the cockpit

https://theaviationist.com/2014/08/18/the-story-of-a-legendary-f-14-pilot-and-the-gun-kill-on-an-f-15-that-could-sell-tomcat-to-japan/

[abisel]

Originally Posted by svandamme

Well Hoser who flew in Aceval tests of the Lima, describes how he came in sjit hot, turned off his engines , he turned his F14 cold and the opposing aircraft with the Lima's could not lock on...

Book : Hoser here:Shoot! has all that
He's the one that got the F15 with the F14 's pipper on the cockpit

https://theaviationist.com/2014/08/18/the-story-of-a-legendary-f-14-pilot-and-the-gun-kill-on-an-f-15-that-could-sell-tomcat-to-japan/

So... in that article and looking at the picture at the bottom of the page, that ain't no F-15 in the HUD piper. That is an F-14. So where is the F-15's side of the story. Seems fishy.

[svandamme]

The aviationis has the wrong pic indeed
better recount of that story here

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/legendary-f-14-pilot-and-the-gun-kill-on-an-f-15.329640/

[svandamme]

Another story by Hoser was that they went 2v2 against some eagles

But his wingman had a technical problem and rtb
So Hoser and his RIO pretended radio chatter as if there were 2 Tomcats.

he called gun kills on both the other 2, because they were so busy and distracted trying to figure out where the ghost wingman was..

They were very upset when Hoser gunned em , and then admitted the scam

The repeated but now 1 vs 2 .. And he gunned em both a second time.


Hoser was one of the first Tomcat instructors, SecNav had called him up in person to convince him to come out of his first retirement...

He's a legend that claimed John Wayne talked to him when things got tough.
He flew with hand grenades over vietnam just in case he'de have to eject over indian territory