The right tool for fieldstone mortar?

[john70t]

I've got a Michigan field stone basement that needs some touch up.

Previously made a weak first attempt but a small area took forever.
1). Dug all the lose stuff out and blew out.
2). Sprayed insides with Acryl 60 Additive Cement Bonding Agent. Let dry.
3). Used grout bag with a watery mixture and Acryl 60 to try to get it in deep.
4). Used grout bag to pour a normal slurry. It was painfully lumpy and sloppy and I was not a happy camper.

I need a better application tool for several rooms.

This one is less than $20 and seems like it would work better than the bag.
https://www.ebay.com/i/143452857863?rt=nc&_trkparms=aid%3D1110001%26algo%3DSPLICE.SIM%26ao%3 D2%26asc%3D20160908110712%26meid%3Df0172c854a134ef ab077400a74b97e00%26pid%3D100677%26rk%3D5%26rkt%3D 30%26mehot%3Dnone%26sd%3D153877242281%26itm%3D1434 52857863%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2386202%26algv %3DDefault


A powered one for $225.
Buy the RocKit Grout Gun Online


The Quikpoint is $265 for just the hopper. Drill not included.
https://www.quikpoint.com


A knockoff for $160.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Mortar-Grout-Electric-Gun-Patio-Brick-Pointing-Grouting-Applicator-Machine-WCV-/322727708214


Any experience with these tools?

[Seahawk]

Please, the right tool for field stone mortar? Captain and Mrs. Ahab Jr...not even a horse race

Interesting project that I have zero frame of reference...pics?

[Captain Ahab Jr]

Ah ha, a thread I can contribute to!

Can you post up a picture of the stone wall?

I just use a 5: mix of local sand and cement, using a small builders trowel to spread/squeeze it into to the joints making the mortar flush with the stone.

The secret is leave it for a few hours until it dries out a bit, not too much but slightly crumbly so you can wire brush off the excess to clean back the the stone without it being so wet it just smears over the stone surface

Wire brush diagonally across the joints so you don't remove too much, then followed up with a stiff brush and then finally a softer brush so the mortar is under flush to the the stone.

If you want a more defined mortar edge I the head and point of nail to scrape it back, spending on how wide each joint is.

If you can wait until next week I'll be doing exactly this to the front of my house and would be happy to post up some destruction's with pictures of each stage.

No builder I know uses the mortar guns as sand/cement is so cheap it's quicker/cheaper to trowel it on and brush off the excess.

The cartridges on the the guns will take longer to fill with mortar than it would to fill the joints between the stone so they won't save you any time.

[john70t]

Originally Posted by Captain Ahab Jr

If you can wait until next week I'll be doing exactly this to the front of my house and would be happy to post up some destruction's with pictures of each stage.

No builder I know uses the mortar guns as sand/cement is so cheap it's quicker/cheaper to trowel it on and brush off the excess.

Captain, Sir, The work that you have done is absolutely amazing.
I think many others here have deservedly given a virtual "pat on the back".
Stunning. Perfect. Comfortable. Words do not even begin to describe. You have built a beautiful home.
(and thank you for sharing)

My project is a little different from newer construction.
It's an old family property with many 'quirks', shall we say, and many memories both good and bad.
I didn't just want to cover it all up to sell at peak value as was recommended and already acknowledged.
Call my stupidity sentimental or a labor of love. Whatever.

Most of the foundation walls are in good shape despite it's age.
At some point before, there was a lot of work done already.
The first thing as manager I was able to do was protect it from uphill surface water drainage.

A few years ago I started working on a few spots which needed touch-up and took my time.
But being thorough I didn't get far. Much more need to be done.



(WARNING: WHILE YOU ARE IN THERE SYNDROME AHEAD)
This is the room which turns Dante into a Japanese amine princess.

I initially only wanted to underpin the foundation sitting in dry dirt, tuck-point the stone, and drywall it in.
Drywall=15 min fire barrier and makes it a legal storage room according to city code.
Tenants need space..

Outside looks perfect but I also wanted to make it better.
I can't legally convert it into livable area and rent it for profit because this city only allowed certain zoning zip codes (cough political bs) to be converted into "accessory dwellings units or ADU". Those are known as the "In-Laws" rentals. But I still paid twice the taxes as the place next door which had almost twice the units. Our local city rules seem to be uh flexible depending to ownership. But enough said of that muck..

The basement floor needed to come down and underpinned same as the other side to give proper head space.
Due to extensive local building, finding contractors has been a chore.


Everything on my schedule was lined up to be restructured from the ground up and ready to go. It should be halfway done right now if things were perfect. If the world schedule hadn't turned to muck my great tenants would now be enjoying a more comfortable space. That didn't happen.



So now I'm looking to get a head start on the project.
The basics. One small piece at a time.
Mortaring walls sucks. Not sure why it shares the same name as a military weapon.
I'm just looking to do some construction rehab.

[dad911]

Those joints are big, you don't need a bag or cookie shooter.

Use a mason trowel, load the back side, then push it in with a tuck-pointing or gauging trowel. Mix on the stiff side to keep the stone clean.

https://marshalltown.com/cat-1328-gauging-trowels
https://marshalltown.com/cat-1253-tuck-pointers

edit: Re-read your first post. I've used a grout bag quite a bit. Mix needs to be on the soft side, well mixed, and I don't use the little metal funnel in the bag. Mix with a mixer on a heavy duty drill, in a 5 gallon bucket.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/ANVIL-Eggbeater-Mixer-57485/300960444

[john70t]

Thanks dad911, good call for most applications, but it probably needs deep penetration between the rocks.
More than a surface trowel.

[DanielDudley]

I use a grout bag. I make the hole as big as I want, and I put it in wet. I use use masonry cement if I am mixing with sand, and sometimes I fortify pre mixed with acryl 60, which makes it creamier, and sets up better. Masonry cement has lime in it, which is sticky on a surface. Portland cement does not, and it won't stick as well or have as nice of a consistency.

As has been said, shoot it in wet, let it sit for a while before hitting it with steel. as far as penetration goes, you want it deep, you don't have to fill every void. If you can prep an eight foot section, you can use the grout bag and go along, then go back as it gets more firm and trowel it out. When you use the grout bag, roll up the open end of the bag to seal it, and squeeze it out like frosting. Keep kneading the grout bag near the tip, to keep the mortar flowing and pliable. Don't let it sit in the bag. Use it now and keep using it or empty it. Keep Kneading, and don't be afraid of juicy mortar mix or a larger hole in the bag. You don't need the metal tip that comes with some bags, it only prevents you from kneading near the tip and keeping tings from setting up. Keep stirring your mortar periodically when it is in the bucket or wheel barrow. Setting up occurs faster if you don't. Keep it moist.

[dad911]

Originally Posted by john70t

Thanks dad911, good call for most applications, but it probably needs deep penetration between the rocks.
More than a surface trowel.

Grout bag, wet. let it start to set, then trowel over. Like Daniel said. Get a good grout bag, and don't use the metal tip. Hard to describe, but I fill the bag maybe 1/2 full, grab and twist the back forcing it out. not rolling like tooth paste tube, twisting. Probably can find a decent youtube video.