Woodworking and carpentry thread

[javadog]

Of all the stuff on your list, this is pretty much all I used on the remodel of my last house:

circular saw
12” sliding miter saw
table saw (sawstop or old, then a good fence)

jig saw
cordless drill
corded drill/driver
belt sander
palm/orbital sander
sawzall
oscillating cutting tool

AIR
air compressor
finishing nail guns

HAND
coping saw
Squares of some sort or multiple sorts?
level
prybars

The rest never got used much. Most didn't get used at all.

Never needed a workbench. Two old sawhorses did just fine. I'd build an infeed or outfeed table for the table saw before I'd build a woodworking bench.

Dust collection meant doing most of the sawing in the garage or outdoors. A shopvac was used some indoors to clean up.

If you have a table saw, miter saw and SawZall, you'll never need the skillsaw.

Keep in mind, you can get started on a house remodel with nothing more than hand tools for a lot of the tasks. You don't have to buy all this crap on the front end.

[MBAtarga]

Regarding the pipe clamp vs. Bessey K body (parallel jaw bar clamps like your picture above) -
the flat Bessey style clamps are fantastic - and would definitely be preferred over the pipe clamp style that have been in use for possibly 100 years. However, pipe clamp capacity is ONLY limited by the length of the pipe. If you've got a clamping situation where you need to clamp something that is 8.5' long/wide - pipe clamps are going to be the ticket. And it's very easy to take 2 6' pipe clamps - and put a $2 coupling between the pipes to make a 12' clamp. There might be ways to work around the bar clamp limitation - but pipe clamps are quick in that scenario.

Edit: As for bar clamps I've probably got about four 5', six 3' and a couple others, but I've also got three 8' pipes and about five or six other shorter length pipe clamps.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by javadog

Of all the stuff on your list, this is pretty much all I used on the remodel of my last house:

circular saw
12” sliding miter saw
table saw (sawstop or old, then a good fence)

jig saw
cordless drill
corded drill/driver
belt sander
palm/orbital sander
sawzall
oscillating cutting tool

AIR
air compressor
finishing nail guns

HAND
coping saw
Squares of some sort or multiple sorts?
level
prybars

The rest never got used much. Most didn't get used at all.

Never needed a workbench. Two old sawhorses did just fine. I'd build an infeed or outfeed table for the table saw before I'd build a woodworking bench.

Dust collection meant doing most of the sawing in the garage or outdoors. A shopvac was used some indoors to clean up.

If you have a table saw, miter saw and SawZall, you'll never need the skillsaw.

Keep in mind, you can get started on a house remodel with nothing more than hand tools for a lot of the tasks. You don't have to buy all this crap on the front end.

Have to disagree. Cutting plywood at an angle is a job for a circular saw. Skilsaw, equivalent, or sidewinder. There are some very good sidewinders available. I use a Makita on a dedicated track set up. Has plenty of power.

Funny story: I spent a year in Talladega AL and worked as a carpenter. For my first job I showed up, took the boss out to my truck and showed him my tools organized in a very secure low roll out drawer box the length of the truck. He never asked a question, just said you're hired. It was a job to convert and old Southern mansion to a B & B. And restore the charm as it had been cut up into rentals.

On my first day I showed up (on time) with about a dozen other guys (you hire half again as many as you need in AL because of spotty attendance). They all had tools belts and hand tools from Walmart. And a WM circular saw with a skinny 16 ga. extension cord. Some weren't bad but others....

[javadog]

OK, I guess a Skilsaw is useful if you ever have to make an angled cut like that or if you have to break down a sheet of plywood because you don’t have two more hands to help you with the tablesaw.

Thinking back to when I remodeled my house, I don’t recall ever needing to make an angle cut like that, but maybe I did.

When I moved, I gave one of my Skil saw’s to my youngest kid then sold the other one. Haven’t missed it.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by look 171

Here's my take on the work bench, Steve. Do you want to play and take three months to make the bench that's so nice that you are afraid to scratch it? Its a tool but a lot of real craftsmen will jump me on that. What the fook is the real need to dovetail a work bench? With just that, you will get a hundred opinions but at the end, its a flat surface used to hold up your projects. Typical boy answer "but, but it has to hold up to a category 5 typhoon just in case". Who posted that workbench that won the award? That's not a bench, its an art object.

Here's how we make them at the shop (drawing). We abuse the hell out of them and they last a very, very long time. When the top has seen better days, top get replaced only. We have the typical heavy duty solid maple top work benches too, but those were bought used and I think they must be 50 years old. They sure need new tops but I am not spending money for new Maple tops, that's for damn sure. For your house, and my own at my home, I say spend a few bucks and use a hardwood, not 2x4 like that vid. Get 8/4 Beech or Birch. Its hard enough to hold up to a lot of abuse. Its still in very , very good shape but the ones at the shops, no way. At the shop, ours are build with 1" MDF, for heft, glues and screwed to a 3/4 P lam (formica top) with oak edges for durability. Its not on casters. Those tops must be 15 years old. The reason I like Formica is very easy to clean. Wood glue doesn't stick to it and large pieces assembled can easily slide across it without scratching the finish piece. No clamps are on those. Our lower assembly bench are made the same way.

I wouldn't spend too much time with a hand plane on a work bench unless you like to play. Cut it off with a cross cutting guild and edge it with a solid piece of lumber. Screwed and glued and go make furniture on it.

Forgot to add. It dosen't have to be that big. 3.5' x 6' would ideal imo.

Lots of good info. I definitely don't want to spend crazy time or money making a workbench, but I do want a good solid workbench. I've worked on a door slung over saw horses and a couple of B&D workmates and I've also worked on a cheap workbench that was maybe 3'x5' made out of 2x6s. That last one was the nicest to work on because it was big and didn't move around much, but was still super crude.

I'm not looking to spend a ton of time with a hand plane for sure. I've got some and would like to be able to set them up and use them well, but when getting the job done is an issue, then I suspect power tools mostly rule.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by look 171

Personally, I would take out the following:

Hand, coping, and back saw (unless you are planning to cut a lot of hand cut dovetail joints. Must siimple joints can be cut on the table saw)
I don't think I have used a coping saw since I was 12. Take a jig saw to it and be done with it in 1 min and a hell of a lot more accurate too.

I have used a hand saw when I needed a quick cut or two on something, and didn't need to move cars out of the way and get a saw setup, etc.... I've used a coping saw when doing the corner joints for moulding instead of using a miter saw. It created better looking results for me when dealing with walls that aren't square. A jig saw is probably much faster and does the same basic job.

Try to get the steel I-beam bar clamps but they are lots more money then pipe clamps. I love these old fashion ones and they just work and work. Nothing fancy. Steel, and indestructible. Don't buy those alum square tube junk. Bessy have them too, maybe rebranded?https://www.amazon.com/Jorgensen-7272-72-I-Bar-Clamp/dp/B0000224CK/ref=sr_1_6?dchild=1&keywords=jorgensen+bar+clamps&qid=1605772118&s=power-hand-tools&sr=1-6

My second choice and they have their place for a certain glue up application https://www.amazon.com/Bessey-KRE3540-REVOlution-Parallel-Clamp/dp/B07BTPLQ3R/ref=sr_1_25?dchild=1&keywords=bessey+bar+clamp&qid=1605772273&sr=8-25

You will need some of these https://www.amazon.com/Bessey-Clutch-Clamp-Set-4-Piece/dp/B00P9G1LCQ/ref=sr_1_8?dchild=1&keywords=bessey+bar+clamp&qid=1605772405&sr=8-8 We bought a large amount of some expensive ones for a large hillside deck build that required lam. bend rim joist that ran 50'. Clamps had to be left overnight for glue to dry. I will see about digging some of them out and get you a few so you can get started. There's a bit more room in that box. Man, that's going to be a big bill on shipping

Thanks. When I started buying more and better clamps it was a revelation over trying to work with no clamps or inadequate clamps.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by javadog

Of all the stuff on your list, this is pretty much all I used on the remodel of my last house:

circular saw
12” sliding miter saw
table saw (sawstop or old, then a good fence)

jig saw
cordless drill
corded drill/driver
belt sander
palm/orbital sander
sawzall
oscillating cutting tool

AIR
air compressor
finishing nail guns

HAND
coping saw
Squares of some sort or multiple sorts?
level
prybars

The rest never got used much. Most didn't get used at all.

Never needed a workbench. Two old sawhorses did just fine. I'd build an infeed or outfeed table for the table saw before I'd build a woodworking bench.

Dust collection meant doing most of the sawing in the garage or outdoors. A shopvac was used some indoors to clean up.

If you have a table saw, miter saw and SawZall, you'll never need the skillsaw.

Keep in mind, you can get started on a house remodel with nothing more than hand tools for a lot of the tasks. You don't have to buy all this crap on the front end.

Lots of good info, JD, thanks. It's great to see thought from different experienced folks since many folks work differently and therefore have different requirements/wants/needs.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by MBAtarga

Regarding the pipe clamp vs. Bessey K body (parallel jaw bar clamps like your picture above) -
the flat Bessey style clamps are fantastic - and would definitely be preferred over the pipe clamp style that have been in use for possibly 100 years. However, pipe clamp capacity is ONLY limited by the length of the pipe. If you've got a clamping situation where you need to clamp something that is 8.5' long/wide - pipe clamps are going to be the ticket. And it's very easy to take 2 6' pipe clamps - and put a $2 coupling between the pipes to make a 12' clamp. There might be ways to work around the bar clamp limitation - but pipe clamps are quick in that scenario.

Edit: As for bar clamps I've probably got about four 5', six 3' and a couple others, but I've also got three 8' pipes and about five or six other shorter length pipe clamps.

Thanks, that's what I was thinking. Parallel jaw = better, more expensive, more limited on length. Pipe clamp, quick, easy, cheap, not as good/secure, more flexible on length.

[look 171]

Originally Posted by masraum

Thanks, that's what I was thinking. Parallel jaw = better, more expensive, more limited on length. Pipe clamp, quick, easy, cheap, not as good/secure, more flexible on length.

The parallel jaws keep the clamping pressure even and do not cause the glue up boards to warp. It will stay warp as it dries. Alternate clamps to get rid of that problem. One up and the other down and so on for a large, long glue up.

[look 171]

Originally Posted by masraum

I have used a hand saw when I needed a quick cut or two on something, and didn't need to move cars out of the way and get a saw setup, etc.... I've used a coping saw when doing the corner joints for moulding instead of using a miter saw. It created better looking results for me when dealing with walls that aren't square. A jig saw is probably much faster and does the same basic job.



Thanks. When I started buying more and better clamps it was a revelation over trying to work with no clamps or inadequate clamps.

We cheat when it comes to coping stain grade joints on large crown.

Cut angle on sliding shop saw. Instead of using a coping saw, turn the molding upside down and take a small grinder with a course grit sanding pad with rigid back and sand away up to the profile. Its very quick and accurate because you can see exactly where to stop and have crisp joints. If needed, take that grinder to remove more materials to get a better fit in seconds.

Old world craftsmen will turn over at their graves when they see us doing this or maybe they will say, where the hell is that tool when we were doing this.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Zeke

Have to disagree. Cutting plywood at an angle is a job for a circular saw. Skilsaw, equivalent, or sidewinder. There are some very good sidewinders available. I use a Makita on a dedicated track set up. Has plenty of power.

Funny story: I spent a year in Talladega AL and worked as a carpenter. For my first job I showed up, took the boss out to my truck and showed him my tools organized in a very secure low roll out drawer box the length of the truck. He never asked a question, just said you're hired. It was a job to convert and old Southern mansion to a B & B. And restore the charm as it had been cut up into rentals.

On my first day I showed up (on time) with about a dozen other guys (you hire half again as many as you need in AL because of spotty attendance). They all had tools belts and hand tools from Walmart. And a WM circular saw with a skinny 16 ga. extension cord. Some weren't bad but others....

I've used circular saws quite a bit. I've never had/used a worm drive. I wasn't certain about the term "sidewinder" since I'd never heard it. I understand now that what you're calling a sidewinder is what I've always thought of as a "circular saw" aka direct drive. It's interesting, I had a cheap sidewinder. Then at some point I inherited a better sidewinder. It felt odd the first time or two that I used it before I realized that the motor was on the opposite side of the blade. I guess maybe it was for lefties.

It looks like the worm drives are heavier, shaped differently, have more torque and lower RPMs and are more expensive.

I found the following article https://www.protoolreviews.com/news/sidewinder-vs-worm-drive-circular-saws/31386/ which I thought was interesting because it says that the preference for one over the other seems to be segregated by coast. East coasters more frequently use sidewinders while West coasters mostly prefer worm drive. That's the oddest thing about it to me.

[look 171]

Yep saw horses and a piece of plywood goes a long way on the job site but its nothing like a workbench you are used to with a big old vice to hold things down when needed. On the large jobs where we know we will be there for months, a smaller 4x6' removable work bench top with a vice set up is the norm for us, along with longish outfeed tables and gang stops for the sliding chop saw. I make them do that for safety and accuracy. If not most will just cut on the floor with their foot holding up materials.

[look 171]

Originally Posted by masraum

I've used circular saws quite a bit. I've never had/used a worm drive. I wasn't certain about the term "sidewinder" since I'd never heard it. I understand now that what you're calling a sidewinder is what I've always thought of as a "circular saw". It's interesting, I had a cheap sidewinder. Then at some point I inherited a better sidewinder. It felt odd the first time or two that I used it before I realized that the motor was on the opposite side of the blade. I guess maybe it was for lefties. It looks like the worm drives are heavier, shaped differently, have more torque and lower RPMs and are more expensive.

I found the following article https://www.protoolreviews.com/news/sidewinder-vs-worm-drive-circular-saws/31386/ which I thought was interesting because it says that the preference for one over the other seems to be segregated by coast. East coasters more frequently use sidewinders while West coasters mostly prefer worm drive. That's the oddest thing about it to me.

Yep, its an east coast thing to use a sidewinder. I can't use that thing with a damn. I do everything with a "Skillsaw" including many finish work but I only use a newer, cleaner saw for that. Portable CAble have a 6" finish saw with the blade on the left that we often use for cutting finish trim and such. Its collects dust in my shop. It rarely gets used.

You lefty? Skill use to make a right hand blade saw for lefties.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by look 171

We cheat when it comes to coping stain grade joints on large crown.

Cut angle on sliding shop saw. Instead of using a coping saw, turn the molding upside down and take a small grinder with a course grit sanding pad with rigid back and sand away up to the profile. Its very quick and accurate because you can see exactly where to stop and have crisp joints. If needed, take that grinder to remove more materials to get a better fit in seconds.

Old world craftsmen will turn over at their graves when they see us doing this or maybe they will say, where the hell is that tool when we were doing this.

My guess is that you'd get a mix of both responses.

And there's probably a time and place for both. Sometimes, you want to do a good job, but also get the work done. Sometimes you're doing the work as much or more for the process as you are the end product. You may not be in a hurry to get finished and just want to enjoy the work, kind of like a zen thing.

Good to know, thanks again.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by look 171

Yep, its an east coast thing to use a sidewinder. I can't use that thing with a damn. I do everything with a "Skillsaw" including many finish work but I only use a newer, cleaner saw for that. Portable CAble have a 6" finish saw with the blade on the left that we often use for cutting finish trim and such. Its collects dust in my shop. It rarely gets used.

You lefty? Skill use to make a right hand blade saw for lefties.

Nope, I'm a righty, which is why the other saw felt weird. I think I used the lefty saw because it was a better saw. I got used to using it.

[look 171]

Originally Posted by masraum

My guess is that you'd get a mix of both responses.

And there's probably a time and place for both. Sometimes, you want to do a good job, but also get the work done. Sometimes you're doing the work as much or more for the process as you are the end product. You may not be in a hurry to get finished and just want to enjoy the work, kind of like a zen thing.

Good to know, thanks again.

Yeah, the whole thing for me is using a fine tune hand plane. We found coping crown with the grinder much more accurate then using the coping saw.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by look 171

Yeah, the whole thing for me is using a fine tune hand plane. We found coping crown with the grinder much more accurate then using the coping saw.

I can see that, at least, from my novice point of view. I have a heck of a time cutting smooth curves with ANY kind of saw.

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by look 171

We cheat when it comes to coping stain grade joints on large crown.

Cut angle on sliding shop saw. Instead of using a coping saw, turn the molding upside down and take a small grinder with a course grit sanding pad with rigid back and sand away up to the profile. Its very quick and accurate because you can see exactly where to stop and have crisp joints. If needed, take that grinder to remove more materials to get a better fit in seconds.

Old world craftsmen will turn over at their graves when they see us doing this or maybe they will say, where the hell is that tool when we were doing this.

I do this too but I have used a Collins Foot on crown successfully. My CM installations dwindled to once every six months to none so I'm out of practice. It's an art for sure and not like getting on a bicycle after a few years.

[1990C4S]

No one has mentioned the lowly scraper. A couple of flex paint scrapers for cleaning and patching. Plus a multi-tool that cleans rollers and scrapes.

If you have to strip a bit of paint, this is the tool:

https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/hand-tools/scrapers/20094-carbide-tipped-scrapers

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Zeke

I do this too but I have used a Collins Foot on crown successfully. My CM installations dwindled to once every six months to none so I'm out of practice. It's an art for sure and not like getting on a bicycle after a few years.

To me that looks like the perfect tool for me to screw up some moulding really quickly!