Yo Tabs...Auction rules advice please

[pwd72s]

Tabdullah should know better than a non collector like me. Is a 25% Buyers premium on collectable normal? Kind of following this one...I have a cue & case like the one listed top center. I'll never sell mine...can't, it has my name in the clear plastic ring. It goes to my honorary nephew when I croak.

But I am wondering..is the auction result plus the 25% premium a good basis for determining an insurance value? Meaning, say it goes for the estimated $4k. This means the buyer actually pays $5k? Should I insure it for that?

Since you're gonna ask...I paid $125 for mine back in the day, after being talked into it by a buddy. He said he could buy wholesale if he bought 2 cues. I remember thinking it was a hell of a lot for a cue, but I eventually caved. I played with it a bit, but after finding myself married with a biz to run, a child to raise, the cue went into the closet, not to see light for decades..so..mine like this auction one. Not refinished, both original shafts sporting original tips.
Actually, it plays like shooting with a length of pipe. My current playing cue, a Keith Josey, is a much better playing cue.

https://www.liveauctioneers.com/catalog/207379_collection-of-palmer-pool-cue-sticks-and-cases/

[MRM]

Yes. 25% buyer’s premium at auction is pretty standard. You can check Leslie Hindsman, Skinner, Grogan or any of the other popular auction houses to see that’s their premium. The auction price plus buyer’s premium would be the minimum insured value. The auction price plus buyer’s premium approximates wholesale value. It should be what a dealer would pay and still make a profit selling retail, but in practice enough private individuals have gotten into auctions that the auction price represents kind of a middle ground. Usually it’s too high for a dealer to make a profit retailing it but the final price is lower than a private individual could get anywhere else.

Also, a careful collector like Tab’s would only buy if the auction price was significantly lower than his evaluation of the real market value, so they would never insure an item for what they paid for it. They would always insure it for much higher because that would be the actual replacement cost.

[pwd72s]

Thanks for the education. More than the cue value...which I got a very good clue about back when retired & daughter grown and gone. Cindy & I thought playing again might be fun, so we took the old cues out of the closet, and drove to a nearby pool hall. Opened the case, and got much more attention than I wanted...

But it was the "premium" that fascinated me. A biz that offers 25% markup with zilch spent of inventory? Just..wow!

[Bill Douglas]

An art auction place I know is something like that. Because they (sort of) guarantee the stuff as being authentic, they print up a glossy catalogue, they have a nice building in town, the staff look like they are paid well. So all this has to be paid for.

Whereas a gun auction I goto. It's mainly staffed by volunteers, they rent the hall for the weekend... they are only about 7%.

[biosurfer1]

Auction premiums sure have made this guy financially comfortable

[pwd72s]

A suggestion to the youngsters here...look into the auction biz...

[tabs]

You need people to show up for the auction to make a go. For that you need premium stuff to sell. To entice sellers you offer low sellers comish for big ticket items. Then comes good accurate descriptions. If a guy is gona drop say 5k or more he has to be confident in the item.

Unfortunately 25% is becoming common for Buyers permium. Often in the house bidders get a little lessor comish and for cash instead of credit. That puts internet.bidders at a big disadvantage.

There are some auctioneers i do not trust. Buyer beware. Including a mid west one that just did a 30m spoon sale. I find that their stuff goes expensive so i dont bid often.

There are a few things that i chased. To my regret. The stuff that i have mostly done well with has been where i went one over what i wanted to bid. It seems everybody.has the same line in the sand. For the past few years you are not getting a real deal..butare paying about the going rate. Too many eyes with the internet. Sometimes through things fall through the cracks. So the idea is too find a high.condition.item if you are paying the going rate. No substitute for knowledge

Btw i have even strategitized the bid sequence to position my high bid..as the next bid higher would be in the deep end. 2 years later it is apx 40%.higher.

[tabs]

There are floor bidders, phone bidders, absentee.bidders and internet bidders.

With cv some auctioneers find.they dont.need floor bidders. It cuts overhead down.

Many auctioneers place a good percentage of their own stuff in the sale. I have even.seen them buy at other auctions for their sale. I have seen stuff sold at an auction.in nh put up for sale a week later by a dealer in Houston. Conversely a dealer will lay off stuff that he has been sitting on at auction. Over a period of years you see an item reappear..to get sold again. Little John in Orange has sold stuff 3 and 4 times. So he knows a lot of stuff. He can tell a fake colt walker from across a parking lot.

[pwd72s]

A cutthroat game, eh?

The cue looks original to me..but I'd need to be hands on to tell. There are counterfeits out there now...but one giveaway is the marbled plastic and the foil with the original owner's name embossed. That foil and plastic no longer made...won't say it can't be replicated enough to fool an expert, but would be mighty tough. At the time Gene Balner made these, he alone knew the trick to the wavy inlays. The original Courtland linen wrap also tough to find. Like the early 911, original, not restored, is worth a premium. Palmer went out of biz shortly after Gene died...son Pete carried on for a while using Japanese made cue blanks but it just wasn't the same.

Gene Balner himself is quite a tale...a Hungarian freedom fighter, got asylum in the USA. Was a furniture maker in Hungary. Turned his wood working skill into making cues in the USA. His cues popular with serious players back in the days of the slower napped table cloth used back then. Didn't figure his name would sell cues, so he kind of stole the Palmer name from the golf star.

Anyway, thanks Tabs...and thanks MRM as well. Quite an education on the collectables auction world.