Being poor is very expensive.

[Rick Lee]

Oh, and plenty of "my people" have those extended car warranties they bought by phone.

[pwd72s]

This thread points to a crying need for high schools to teach basic money management skills.

But who am I kidding? Oregon's governor just signed a bill eliminating basic reading, writing, and math skills as a requirement for a high school diploma.

[Rick Lee]

Originally Posted by pwd72s

This thread points to a crying need for high schools to teach basic money management skills.

The gov't. wants more dependents, not fewer. They will never lift a finger to help people stay off the gov't. dole.

[GH85Carrera]

Back when cell phones were fairly new, and really expensive I was too damn cheap to pay the average $40+ for phone plans and just calls only. No smart phone, just a telephone. I remember sitting in traffic and watched as a very obese female was waiting at a bus stop for the bus to arrive. She and everyone else at the bus stop had a cell phone. I felt left out. It was a few years more before I got my phone and only because AT&T had a special of $25 per month for a candy bar type Nokia phone.

My wife did not get a cell phone for a couple of more years.

[sammyg2]

How about the people who refinanced their mortgage 3 or 4 times, pulling money out for new cars and credit card bills, and now owe many times more than the original purchase price?
Nothing like having a house payment forever and still paying for cars 20 years after they are gone.

It's expensive to be poor but it's more expensive to be poor and live like you are not.

[wdfifteen]

Some people never have a chance. A guy who worked for me a couple of years ago was a year out of prison and doing odd jobs, didn't have a car or a place to live. In the course of working with him one day I asked him about his family. He said, "I never knew my dad." I asked how about your mom and he very matter-of-factly said, "She sucks dick over in Indianapolis." I was in a bit of shock, but he explained, so someone not of the streets would understand. "She's prostitutin'." Last time he saw her was about 8 years ago, when he was 16.

He took the route of so many men in his situation and hooked up with a woman with section 8 housing and kids from other men. It was a place to stay. He told me he was disgusted about having to have sex with her, but it was a free place to live. He was a hard worker and obviously intelligent, but ignorant of so many things you need to know to get by.
He got a job at a place that hires felons for well under going wage, but he has stuck with it for over 2 years now. He bought a car at a Buy Here Pay Here place that he lives in when he can't find a bed. It was an old Toyota Highlander, worth about $10,000 but he'll pay $24,000 for it by the time he pays out his contract. This is a place where the poor really get screwed. He can't get a loan anywhere, and if he wants a car, this is his only option. I haven't seen him in a few months. I hear he got an apartment. I wish him well. He started life in a deep hole and he seems to be managing to claw his way out.

[Z-man]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

We all know the predictors of future or never breaking out of poverty - teen pregnancy, out-of-wedlock kids, brushes with the law, not graduating high school, etc. Those aren't ironclad and plenty of folks have had them all and still done well. But the one constant I see that is a 110% guarantee of lifetime poverty is going on SS disability. I run into a ton of these folks too. Plenty of them could do something, maybe not be on their feet all day, but something. But no, while watching tv game shows and sucking down cigarettes and malt liquor, they are bombarded by tv commercials from law firms promising to get their SSDI approved. AND, the longer the process is dragged out, the bigger the lump sum retroactive payment they get. It's really sad, but the gov't. wants dependents and SSDI will continue to grow like The Blob.

The success sequence is a study that showed the following three things differentiate the majority of those who are poor vs. those who are wealthy. If someone who is poor following these three simple steps, their path out of poverty is greatly increased:
1. Get a high school diploma
2. Get a job
3. Get married before you have babies.

More info on the “Success Sequence: can be found here:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-sequence-is-the-secret-to-success-1522189894

I would add three points to those steps:

1. Learn about finance. Teach children in schools basic finance. Simple stuff like how to balance a checkbook. The importance of paying bills on time. How compound interest can help you. What a mortgage looks like. How to pay off debt. But none of these concepts are taught in school. So the kids rely on learning this from their parents and peers. And as seen in Rick’s examples - a lot of these parents aren’ good examples, and aren’t equipped to teach their kids about finances!

2. Live below your means: I have lived by a simple rule: live below your means. If you an do that comfortably, I would venture to say that you are wealthy. I know many lower to mid middle class families that live below their means. I consider them to be more wealthy than the person who makes $250k a year, but spends $300K on lavish items like summer homes, fancy cars, fast boats, and luxury items. If Mr. Richie Rich were making $400K a year, then that’s a different story! But no matter how much you make, if you live above your means, you are setting yourself up for financial disaster!

3. Practice delayed gratification: Start putting money into long term savings as soon as you can! This holds true especially if your place of employment has some type of 401K plan. But if it doesn’t, it is still advisable to put money into long term investments. Even with mediocre returns, over time, that money can grow into something that can help support you! At least Rick’s customer’s kinda understand this notion, but had they learned about basic finance in school (see point #1), they would understand how they can make their money grow better for them!

So in my opinion, these six steps can be a springboard into helping get out from below the poverty line.

Getting off my soapbox…

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

The gov't. wants more dependents, not fewer.

Why do you think that?

[biosurfer1]

Back in the day, I watched one of my friends take a cash advance on his credit card so he could continue at the BJ table... it was a 28% fee and he only took out $100. I tried to tell him what a crazy thing that was to do, but he wasn't having any of it.

[herr_oberst]

My dad lived on an Airpark. There was one old guy, Cliff, who literally had the answer to any aircraft related problem, but absolutely no sense of money management. He was in his 80's, and was in the last months of a reverse mortgage with a Cessna in his hanger, enough parts to build at least one more Cessna, all the tools you could want and who all knows what else, plus a hoarders ransom of crap in his house and hanger. Packed to the gills. The bank was starting to hound him to get ready to get out of their house, because they were about to take it over. He outlived his reverse mortgage - probably by a long shot.

My dad died before Cliff had to vacate, and we had cleaned out and sold dads property and real estate so I never heard what became of him. Felt really bad for his family.

[1990C4S]

Originally Posted by masraum

When I buy at grocery stores or Amazon, I usually/often look at the price per unit. The big containers are usually cheaper, but not always.

Therefore you are poor for another reason. Prolly the fancy cars and expansive Texas ranch...

[1990C4S]

Originally Posted by biosurfer1

Back in the day, I watched one of my friends take a cash advance on his credit card so he could continue at the BJ table... it was a 28% fee and he only took out $100. I tried to tell him what a crazy thing that was to do, but he wasn't having any of it.

My buddy used to withdraw $100 at a time at the strip joint ATM. There was a $20 fee per withdrawal. He often made three cash withdrawals of $100 instead on a single $300 withdrawal.

[1990C4S]

Originally Posted by pwd72s

This thread points to a crying need for high schools to teach basic money management skills.

But who am I kidding? Oregon's governor just signed a bill eliminating basic reading, writing, and math skills as a requirement for a high school diploma.

This thread points to a crying need for a people not to be stupid. Nothing here needs to be taught to a person of reasonable intelligence.

I knew what I could afford long before I finished high school.

[GH85Carrera]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

Some people never have a chance. A guy who worked for me a couple of years ago was a year out of prison and doing odd jobs, didn't have a car or a place to live. In the course of working with him one day I asked him about his family. He said, "I never knew my dad." I asked how about your mom and he very matter-of-factly said, "She sucks dick over in Indianapolis." I was in a bit of shock, but he explained, so someone not of the streets would understand. "She's prostitutin'." Last time he saw her was about 8 years ago, when he was 16.

No doubt the best thing my parents ever gave me was a stable home environment. They were married for 50+ years till death do they part. Mom and dad both taught me the value of hard work, and get a job.

I bought my first home in the days when my 12.5% mortgage was a bargain rate. I bought a couple of years before I really should have. That is a long story and unimportant now.

In the end, I was working two jobs, and no vacations, no frills and lots of beans, rice and potatoes for food, and rarely a steak and never sea food. I got out of my debt hole and paid 100% of all my bills. I will never get there again.

[Geronimo]

Whoa whoa whoa.... I was told it was rich peoples fault people are poor... you know the rich make people make poor choices.

[p911dad]

One of my still-favorites after all these years: I was working on getting emergency housing for residents of Niagara Falls affected by the Love Canal. They needed to be moved out immediately. We were working on a housing project (Packard Court) and a man came in all upset because he had not received a voucher for hotel and restaurant use. I looked up his name and he was not there on the rent role. He got really excited and says he's been living with his wife and kids for years in the same unit, under the same roof. Nope, not there. "I wants my benefits and I wants them now!" he says while pounding on the desk! Nope.
It turns out he and she were never married, he was the father of the kids (at least he didn't run off) and he was not on the lease for the unit, therefore no relocation benefit. He worked at a local chemical plant making mountains of overtime. She was on welfare with "no" income with multiple kids all getting state allowances. They had 2 cars, etc. It was a very cozy deal that I later learned was (is) quite a common scam. And they had no money saved, nothing, living week to week. They will always be poor, even as they burn through all the cash that passes through their hands.

[1990C4S]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

In the end, I was working two jobs, and no vacations, no frills and lots of beans, rice and potatoes for food, and rarely a steak and never sea food. I got out of my debt hole and paid 100% of all my bills. I will never get there again.

Living like that leaves a lasting impression on you. I lived on almost no net income for ten years. I never take having spare money for granted.

[ckelly78z]

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

A bandmate of mine got a French Bulldog for $2500 because there were no papers. But he can easily afford it.

It's funny(and timely) that the subject of French Bulldogs came up, because this same girl I work with is currently whining about spending $200 to get her French Bulldog's eye fixed from a case of "Cherry eye", and that she just spent $1600 on to buy 2 months ago, and $1200 on a problem that her cat had.

[Seahawk]

Originally Posted by 1990C4S

Living like that leaves a lasting impression on you. I lived on almost no net income for ten years. I never take having spare money for granted.

Absolutely.

Every six months my wife and I review our actual expenditures for the farm business and our household budget looking for savings, not because we need to but because I like to.

Saving $100 a month is $1200 a year after taxes.

I don't need the money, but I like the money since I remember when $100 bucks was a lot of money to me. A lot.

I spent a significant amount of time when I was in the Navy doing taxes and budget planning (no investment advice ever) for both officers and enlisted. Just the f'ing basics.

The level of financial illiteracy was incredible...95% male related. The women were great and on solid ground.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by GH85Carrera

No doubt the best thing my parents ever gave me was a stable home environment.

+1000
That was one of the many blessings in my life. My folks didn't pay a lot of attention to us, but Dad came home with the paycheck every Thursday and was home every night, steady as a rock. Mom put dinner on the table every evening and every morning. I always had a stable platform to launch from.
From the time I was a kid I was taught to work, and as a teenager I was told, "You are going to college. We don't know how you're going to pay for it, but you're going."
I was the first one in our family to start college. My little sister was the first one to graduate.