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Quote:

Originally Posted by vash (Post 11478361)

but seriously, i do not like the people aspect of supervising. hahhaha..discipline, $$hitty performance, etc. BLEECHHHH. it's awful. i am a public employee, so you could imagine. .

I now work for myself but there was a time where I was the boss. Mixed results. The rewards for being part of the organization and finding my stride in advice on matters in my lane was great.

But the people under me (not literally) could be a challenge. I remember arriving to an assignment in the Army where I was replacing no one because the unit had relocated from another installation and deployment. My #2 was a total pain to deal with. She was horribly behind in her work, inefficient, lacked experience, and did not understand the supervisor - supervisee dynamic. I would challenge her to get her work up to standard and offer assistance based on my expertise in the main area she was lacking. Her response was usually something along the lines of "you make me uncomfortable". The typical defense mechanism for this generation.

My .02, be happy with what you do and your decision. Being miserable is not a fun place to be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by matthewb0051 (Post 11479280)

...
My .02, be happy with what you do and your decision. Being miserable is not a fun place to be.

^^^ + .02

Shoot.... now that's almost a whole nickle's worth of free advice ;).

Only vash knows the answer... best to ya bud!

My wife is an elementary school principal. When she first started, she had a mentor who had served as superintendent of some large school districts. One of the first things he told her was the kids wouldn't be a problem, it would be the adults that would cause almost all of the problems. She sure found out that to be true.

Quote:

Originally Posted by asphaltgambler (Post 11479000)

^ ^^^ I've watched that negotiator guy, his name slips my mind right now. His motto: never split the difference. The goal is not to get people to say yes, but rather they say: 'That's right' - and have that mind set in management to have your people agree with your plan, rather than just them saying 'yes'......

You nailed it.

It's easy to get overwhelmed with work when one is a manager. Not a lot of companies properly prepare people for it.

One important thing is to learn how to delegate effectively. However, no matter how good you are at delegating and managing your people, there is a level of "administrative overhead" that is unavoidable. The science fiction that was our budgeting process is one example, another is monthly reports (at one point I had 3 very similar presentation-format reports going "up the ladder" via 3 different paths - to the CTO, to QA and to "line" management), yet another was the annual review process (which HR liked to change every year).

Despite being management (senior staff) in a medical device/equipment company, I continued to focus on new IP and new product development, acting more as teacher & coach with a bit of "hands on" when it was appropriate & necessary. And like a coach, sometimes I had to be honest with people about their performance (both positive and negative) and willing to cut someone off the team if absolutely necessary. To be honest, I was also a bit of a "workaholic" - working typically 12 hour days and also time doing reports & admin stuff over the weekend.

One important thing was the additional $$$$ made it easier to retire early.

Vash, getting to know you a bit through the board and hearing about your experience as a supervisor makes me think you need to do some self reflection. Not on whether you should be a supervisor - you know in your heart you want to continue to grow. Rather, you need to take a good hard look at whether you’re handing the supervisor role correctly. I suspect you’re putting too much on yourself and doing things that should be done by the people you supervise. If done right, supervision should be easier, although not less demanding than a line job. You need to learn how to delegate and who to delegate to, and how to hold people accountable for their position. One of the great insights I received as a young pup was an old guy (he was in his 50s!) told me my job was to reflect well on my supervisor because his supervisor evaluated him on the simple proposition that if he can’t get people to do what needs to be done, he’ll find someone who can. The implication being that the supervisor is telling his people that if they can’t get the job done the supervisor will find someone who can.

I suspect you’re taking on more responsibilities and doing more work than you should, and you’re uploading work from your employees that you should be downloading. Their job is to work for you, not the other way around.

Think about what I’ve written and consult an older mentor who’s been a supervisor or manager for a while. Tell them you feel overwhelmed and aren’t sure you want the extra work of being a supervisor and ask if there are any techniques for making the job manageable. You might be surprised there is a way of doing your job in a way that makes your life enjoyable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vash (Post 11478361)

holy hell.

i am successfully trudging thru my stint as temporary supervisor. i just got extended until end of Nov. they are piling on work like i have never seen before. we have Webex meetings to schedule more WEbex meetings.

the interview for the permanent position is gonna happen any week now. i have been studying. i got this. my boss is hopeful for me. i have cleaned up my two areas like a rockstar. my budgets are balanced and my projects are staffed beautifully.

but seriously, i do not like the people aspect of supervising. hahhaha..discipline, $$hitty performance, etc. BLEECHHHH. it's awful. i am a public employee, so you could imagine. i go to bed at 8:00 PM!! like a senior citizen. hell, when i shut my lights off, i can see the lights of my 92 old neighbor and she is still awake!! i am awake by 4:00 am to get ready for my commute.

my wife calls me worried about me. i told her this morning i am 80% gonna turn down the promotion if it is offered to me. i am not gonna follow a life of stress. i have no kids, so i dont need the money. i admire the people chasing more and more. not me. i dont think i am that guy.

Supervising can be very difficult, but it's one of the most rewarding aspects of many positions I've been in. To see the people you've lead, coached, mentored (occasionally yelled at), succeed in life and move on with their own careers is what I love to do. The "real" work, they do. My job is making the people better.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Seahawk (Post 11478543)

Ok. First of all relax. You have two strikes against you walking to the batters box and you know what I am referencing. Maybe three if I think about it.

I am very much an introvert away from work. I have close friends I have known since HS, poke and tickle stuff still on the phone. I laugh just thinking about the knuckleheads. In the past 40 years, maybe 5/6 I am really close with.

I say that because I have managed, still manage, small and large organizations, which I am really good at. I had a female colleague, one of the first female Naval Aviators, Test Pilot, engineer like you, ask me how I make this whole managing people thing look so easy.

I have written this before: Acting Classes in college, the hardest course I took and I am not even sure why I took them. But I learned to pretend to care.

Don't get me wrong: I do care about the important stuff, but my GAS meter is broken on the whiners.

Here is what I would do if I was you: Take the promotion if offered then learn how to set a tone for the ENTIRE office, the people you manage. You will regret it if you don't.

I ran a 450 person program office, billions of dollars a a year, for five years. When I was selected for the job I brought the senior team leads in individually, handed them a list of requirements I expected them to abide by (cleared by legal, remember this was a government job), things that were important to me.

I then brought the contract support companies in one at a time, gave them the same sheet.

I worked down the line from there, everyday, ten minutes before lunch, after lunch etc...I met every single person individually or in small, focused groups.

Set the tone. Lead. You can do this.

Quick Sea Story.

I met with a retired Navy Seal, E-9 last month. He is working some complimentary projects to ours in the Virginia Beach area and we had lunch, butt sniffing like all small companies do.

There is a point where we both realize we are introverts just making sure we tend to our respective companies.

He tells me: "I always feel like I carry 25 coins into a room, a day, an operation, a conference. Every interpersonal meeting takes a coin away from me. At the end of the day, coin less, I am exhausted."

"An extrovert shows up without coins and comes home with more than 25, refreshed."

You can do this. You will be pissed if you don't try. Trust me.

My Psych classes had a similar effect for me (and are doing so for my daughter, too). We were talking the other day and it's interesting to "know" what people are feeling, and why (thanks to the psych classes), but not be able to "feel" it. It's one trait of mine I really wish she hadn't inherited.

I didn’t hear you say anything good about being the manager. I say, go back to your old job and be happy.

I've tried managing people, responsible for a design team of 15, our group designed nearly everything you can see on a F1 race car other than the wheels, tyres, brakes and driver

Wouldn't say I was a great manager, could do the job as we never missed a deadline or failed to deliver. Found keeping people happy a lot harder than solving engineering problems

Wasn't my favorite job by a long way as my happy zone is project managing a group of 3 or 4 which still gives me hands on design time and time for developing/mentoring young engineers which I really enjoy

Just this week a young engineer I've been working with earned his 1st promotion on his companies career ladder. Couldn't have been more pleased for him as being in a foreign country with COVID working restrictions he's not had an easy ride

I did. I think Vash wants to grow in his career. This is his opportunity. I think he wants to excel as a supervisor.

If you take the job, you will basically have kids as supervision is just adult day care. Teach your employees what to do, treat them fairly, support then, listen to them and hold them accountable.

I always tried to get the promotion as quickly as possible. Not out of greed or ambition, but because I knew I didn't want to work for any of my peers.

I was an IT guy .... a super techie if I do say so myself... not bragging. That's a whole different skill set from the "management carrot" that was dangled in front of me in my mid-20s, turned it down flat and I did what I loved most of my career. The $$$ weren't really tempting... I did just fine (retired from the corporate bs @ 48), and I would have sucked at it too :D.

Some techies & engineers can do both .... not I, I did NOT want to do that, so I found my techie niche and thrived.

Not one of "our" personal experiences matter tho' .... only Cliff knows what's the right choice for "him".

No regrets....