woman completes and passes ranger training

[cockerpunk]

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/west-point-graduate-first-woman-complete-army-ranger-competition-rcna201526?fbclid=IwY2xjawJ0lEFleHRuA2FlbQIxMABicm lkETFnejFMeUhyTm9CdnVHOUhXAR4Ib864ylGUnxiiFc7EowKN YufzMXisKgyOtyfgWf2_LqN1EE9vcjr_biPYEA_aem_u_l5JTS fjE5bmZ79bl6ojg&_branch_match_id=1225955372154297656&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=NBC%20News&utm_medium=social&_branch_referrer=H4sIAAAAAAAAAwXB226CMAAA0L%2FZozj ijSVmYaRVdOgmoOJL09YWWtvCCljYw75951Rd17RvnmcINcy1E 9w0EyXMw3viFJs4GqKUvHNClbivY1f4g8RuN1UAKrY99aEPFfm OhyT8EFSrB8igYRImLK%2FGTAfR3Zy3x7y6hqdZTFaL2ag2uRm EgHQJarc%2FFD3%2FTa6i3ZfjsRt5eeE%2B%2Bvw5vAIQPKm0i IivAoQIM416pOa7LOUSzIm%2BLQOiFrUsX%2F4s48xaYUpEbO1 aZtdRZWvN%2FgFv5W9%2B2QAAAA%3D%3D

pretty awesome.

[Bob Kontak]

I salute the newscaster at the end saying "proves that there are women who can meet these standards" instead of something preposterous.

Congrats to First Lieutenant Gabrielle White.

[Steve Carlton]

Congrats, First Lt. White!

[wilnj]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

I salute the newscaster at the end saying "proves that there are women who can meet these standards" instead of something preposterous.

Congrats to First Lieutenant Gabrielle.

The thread is mislabeled. The news isn't that she completed Ranger school, over 100 women have. The news is that when her and her teammate went head to head against 51 other teams, her team completed the mission ahead of 36 others.

But to your point, I don't think any reasonable person would disagree that there are women who can compete at the highest levels but it's a numbers game. Of the women with the physical and mental skill set necessary to be a top performing Ranger, how many are even interested in a military career?

As long as one isn't playing with the criteria to arrive at a desired result, let the numbers play out as they will.

I had a similar conversation with someone about F1 drivers and whether we'll ever see a female F1 driver and I said no. For similar reasons, in that you need a combination of the will to do it, the opportunity and the financial backing to get into it as well as the physical and mental skill set to do it at the highest levels and the number of women that would possess all 4 of those is likely nil.

[Dixie]

Opening this thread to the absence of bitter, hateful, ugly posts brightens my day. Still, I suspect this'll make PARF by page 2.

[Steve Carlton]

Why?

[fintstone]

I am not sure what your point is here. That only one woman could even make it to the competition or that one was able to complete it? That her team finished behind 26 men (but ahead of many others)? Was her partner so strong that any man or woman would have completed the competition with him (or did she carry him)? Is it a coincidence that the first female that competed did so after they reduced rucksack weights for the competition?

Whatever the point is...she is obviously better than most men or women at this. I don't know if it means she is better than most Rangers or most soldiers. The details are not quite all there.

[LWJ]

I have a nephew who is a Ranger. He lost something like 20 lbs on a remote training. They push you very very hard.

Congrats to anyone who is in this level of performance.

[Reiver]

She was already Ranger qualified.... she is one tough lady, the exception. This is not Ranger Training but the yearly competition held by the RTB.
Candidates often do nothing but train for the events and are non deployable and taken off of duty rosters.
It is a damn tough series of events.

[Dixie]

Originally Posted by fintstone

I am not sure what your point is here.

I believe the point is, it's amazing some women are capable of achieving this. See, you look at these women's achievement and compare it to men. But I compare it to other women. That these women can hold their own against men who are genetically stronger, bigger, and much more aggressive, is worthy of recognition.

Think of it like this. If some guy gave birth, that would be a huge event worthy of recognition. I wouldn't just say, "meh, women do that every day."

[afterburn 549]

I think back to just Basic in 1970.
So far, I don't think I have met a woman who could have done that, so yes, I am more than suspicious, maybe dubious.
The bigger guys had a harder time sometimes, esp on the forest marches.
Some of the men were sent home from basic.
Quite a few got the redo slip.
So could a woman do this without cooked results?
Anything is possible, but she would have to be a very rare woman.

[wilnj]

Originally Posted by afterburn 549

I think back to just Basic in 1970.
So far, I don't think I have met a woman who could have done that, so yes, I am more than suspicious, maybe dubious.
The bigger guys had a harder time sometimes, esp on the forest marches.
Some of the men were sent home from basic.
Quite a few got the redo slip.
So could a woman do this without cooked results?
Anything is possible, but she would have to be a very rare woman.

She did it in full view of her peers. Are you saying the other Rangers who finished behind were sandbagging?

And in 1970, sure, not likely any woman had the training to even come close. Today? Absolutely.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by Dixie

I believe the point is, it's amazing some women are capable of achieving this. See, you look at these women's achievement and compare it to men. But I compare it to other women. That these women can hold their own against men who are genetically stronger, bigger, and much more aggressive, is worthy of recognition.

Think of it like this. If some guy gave birth, that would be a huge event worthy of recognition. I wouldn't just say, "meh, women do that every day."

I cannot argue that at all. Few women can even come close to these standards. But I do not believe that was the point of the OP. I could be mistaken.

Physical standards for women in the AF were very much lower than those for men.
When I was in officer's training, we (men) had to physically carry some of the women for the last mile or so of our longer runs (the distance was not that great, and we had no weapon or ruck at all). Admittedly, I did not find the runs easy myself as I was out of shape. I had no time to prepare prior to going and was about 10 years older than most (but if I had not been able to make it, no one would have carried me). Of course, my next assignment was school/training and then a sedentary 4-year gig in a missile launch control center with only about 10 feet of walking room total.

[Dantilla]

Originally Posted by Dixie

That these women can hold their own against men who are genetically stronger, bigger, and much more aggressive, is worthy of recognition.

This^
She's way tougher than me. Congrats are in order.

[Evans, Marv]

^^^^ Thinking back to basic in early 1964 (Ft. Ord), I think lots of women in good/decent shape and not over weight could have made it through basic training easily. For me, it was a breeze and a fun experience and it definitely wasn't physically demanding. And yes, I agree larger guys had more difficulties than others. I remember thinking during that time, if I ever got into a tight spot I'd much better have around me a bunch of scrappy little guys. I have the impression there are more women now days in better physical shape than back then, though there are still a lot of men & women who are overweight.

[fintstone]

Most of the women I served with in the 70s simply did not have the physical strength to do the job and were a liability (although popular). I was in aircraft maintenance, and they simply could not lift the equipment or even the tools. Two women could not do the work of one man. If you ended up on a team with more than a token female, it was brutal as you and to do almost all the work. Much has been reengineered now for lower strength and height requirements...so that is less of a problem.

Another issue was if they became pregnant (many did...over and over), they could not even come onto the flightline for 9 months and you had to pick up the slack. If there were several and they were a large part of your team, it was really painful. They sat around in the office for 9 months and studied for promotion tests. So, they often were promoted much faster than the men who were on the flightline in the hot sun for 12 hours a day.

It was the same when I was a missile officer. The number of 24hr alerts you pulled each month was based on how many people they were distributed among. If a few were pregnant, it doubled the number you had to do, and no one could take vacation/leave for many months. Some stayed pregnant the entire 4-years assigned.

For most AF jobs, physical condition really doesn't matter...even though we pretend it is and there is a fairly tough test you have to take every 6 months, and it impacts your career. The requirements are much less for women. Of course, most of my AF career, you were expected to do all physical training on your own time after 8-12 hours of work. It was a real challenge for me from my late 40s until my 60 to work long hours and still stay in good enough shape to pass the tests.

[Bob Kontak]

Originally Posted by Dixie

That these women can hold their own against men who are genetically stronger, bigger, and much more aggressive, is worthy of recognition.

They can hold their own in this set of challenges.

[wilnj]

Originally Posted by Bob Kontak

They can hold their own in this set of challenges.

I don't see the reason for the qualifier. No one is saying that all women could hold their own as a Ranger.

If we trust Google, there are 7 active duty, female rangers out of approximately 3,500 in total. Is it so hard to believe that 0.2% of a population are absolute specimens?

[herr_oberst]

Originally Posted by fintstone

Most of the women I served with in the 70s simply did not have the physical strength to do the job ...... most of my AF career, you were expected to do all physical training on your own time after 8-12 hours of work. It was a real challenge for me from my late 40s until my 60 to work long hours and still stay in good enough shape to pass the tests.

Don't know if you're aware, but the Rangers are Army not AF.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by wilnj

The thread is mislabeled. The news isn't that she completed Ranger school, over 100 women have. The news is that when her and her teammate went head to head against 51 other teams, her team completed the mission ahead of 36 others.

What I saw including the linked article says that she completed the Ranger competition, not that she became a Ranger (which has been open to women since 2015).

For the first time in Army history, a female service member completed the grueling Best Ranger Competition.

First Lt. Gabrielle White, a 25-year-old West Point graduate, became the first female Ranger ever to compete in the annual three-day, 30-event marathon, which unfolded Friday to Sunday at Fort Benning, Georgia.