Pine tree help

[flatbutt]

I know there are plenty of gardeners here but this question is more of an arborist issue.

So, I have a dozen or so evergreens on my lot. White, Scotch, Blue etc. They ALL are exhibiting something odd which may be a fungus but for all of them to exhibit it at the same time is odd,.

The inner needles on a limb/ twig are turning brown while the tips of the same limbs are still green. It seems odd to me that ALL of my trees are exhibiting the same thing.

I'll get a pic when it stops raining.

anybody ever seen this?

[masraum]

Hopefully, this is the issue which I think is good news.
https://awaytogarden.com/when-inner-conifer-needles-turn-yellow-or-brown/

https://www.gardenbetty.com/brown-conifer-needles/

[stevej37]

No expert here...but mine do somewhat the same. Every year at this time they are easy to see because they get golden brown and then fall off when the colder weather comes.
I just figured it's part of the natural shedding process.
Every spring I have to rake the brown needles up before mowing. I typically get 5 or more wheelbarrows full.

[flatbutt]

Originally Posted by masraum

Hopefully, this is the issue which I think is good news.
https://awaytogarden.com/when-inner-conifer-needles-turn-yellow-or-brown/

https://www.gardenbetty.com/brown-conifer-needles/

Thanks Steve. My searches missed those. I never noticed this shedding before.

I was thinking of going to Rutgers for a Master Gardeners certification, but I'll just pose my questions here instead.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by flatbutt

Thanks Steve. My searches missed those. I never noticed this shedding before.

I was thinking of going to Rutgers for a Master Gardeners certification, but I'll just pose my questions here instead.

LOL!

We do have Baz. I'm sure he could hook you up!

[Crowbob]

The area along the length of each branch of a conifer between the trunk to near the end or tip that is green is called the dead zone. It’s not really dead. But there will never be any (or very, very little) new bud growth along that length. If you were to prune a branch in the dead zone, that entire branch will likely die and be ‘isolated’ from the trunk to eventually dry out and break off, leaving a hole.

Some conifers, such as spruce particularly, may form new buds along the length if they are exposed to sufficient sunlight as long as there is even a little terminal bud on the end or tip. These will eventually fill in.

Interestingly, there are deciduous conifers. Deciduous meaning they lose all their leaves every year such as maples, oaks and abuncha other shade trees and conifers, meaning a plant that bears ‘cones’. Larches are one such deciduous conifer. They lose every needle every year.

On the left in the photo below is a weeping European larch losing its needles. Each branch will become totally devoid of leaves (needles) and grow back every year. The Colorado Blue Spruce, on the right, shows the ‘dead zone’ along each branch going into the trunk. I am in the process of pruning that spruce in the Japanese technique of niwaki whereby, eventually, each branch will be bare, exposing the trunk, with ‘clouds’ at the terminus of each branch. Do an image search of niwaki for more info. However, that spruce will develop new buds along each branch that will need to be ‘rubbed off’ each spring. Otherwise, new branches will form.

[Crowbob]

The photo below is another conifer (arborvitae) also in the style of niwaki. The exposed trunk will never attain new buds but will always be ‘bare’. That plant is almost 30 years old about three feet tall and six feet wide:

[Crowbob]

This is an Eastern White Pine volunteer (meaning I didn’t plant it but rather it sprouted on its own) which is about 9 years old. EWP will grow to over 100’ easily. This one is being trained to grow horizontally and will eventually be subjected to niwaki pruning. Niwaki results in stunted length (or height) with very large trunks so I’ll be able to keep it under control.

[Crowbob]

These are Venus (left) and Pandora (right) couched within Dwarf Alberta Spruce which are 20 years old and about 5 feet tall. If DAS are pruned anywhere proximal of the tips, the branches will die. They HATE anything touching them so the fallen leaves will be removed before the snow falls.

Pandora’s box is behind her feet, obscured by the Albertas. She had just opened the box and suddenly discovering her nakedness, displays her modesty. Pandora is the loosely pagan representation of Eve.

[Crowbob]

Below is a weeping Colorado Blue Spruce which, unless staked, will want to grow downwards. There are two horizontal stakes forcing the branches to grow horizontally. The upper most stake is holding the former central leader which is the habit of most pines causing the typical pyramidal form of the plant. On this one, however, I am forcing a new leader to grow upright to give the plant more height. I am letting the plant tell me what pruning technique I will use in a few years. This plant is 10 years old or so and 5’ tall:

[stevej37]

[QUOTE=Crowbob;11830275] If DAS are pruned anywhere proximal of the tips, the branches will die. They HATE anything touching them so the fallen leaves will be removed before the snow falls.


I did not know this. I will pay more attention during the leaf clean-up now because I have several young DAS. I planted them because it's one of the few evergreens that the deer won't strip in the winter. (along with Spruce)

Also...nice pics.

[Crowbob]

And finally, this is a weeping Black Spruce after allowing the leader to grow downwards along the ground forming a ground cover. Visible on the lower right is part of the plant flowing over the rock. Not visible is more foliage obscured by the yellowing Japanese Irises. The groundcover created by the spruce is meant to mimic flowing water complimenting the fountain-like growth habit of the main tree. As an aside, one ‘rule’ of Japanese gardening is to mimic water, either still or flowing, if real water is not available. The pebble beds of Zen gardens are raked to form concentric ridges representative of ripples.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Crowbob

The area along the length of each branch of a conifer between the trunk to near the end or tip that is green is called the dead zone. It’s not really dead. But there will never be any (or very, very little) new bud growth along that length. If you were to prune a branch in the dead zone, that entire branch will likely die and be ‘isolated’ from the trunk to eventually dry out and break off, leaving a hole.

I've had shrubs that were overgrown, and then trimmed. They had a dead zone so that they never filled back in. That's a pain.

Interestingly, there are deciduous conifers. Deciduous meaning they lose all their leaves every year such as maples, oaks and abuncha other shade trees and conifers, meaning a plant that bears ‘cones’. Larches are one such deciduous conifer. They lose every needle every year.

My first experience with bald cypress was pretty confusing. My conifer experience prior to was that they were all evergreen.

Originally Posted by Crowbob

The photo below is another conifer (arborvitae) also in the style of niwaki. The exposed trunk will never attain new buds but will always be ‘bare’. That plant is almost 30 years old about three feet tall and six feet wide:

Originally Posted by Crowbob

This is an Eastern White Pine volunteer (meaning I didn’t plant it but rather it sprouted on its own) which is about 9 years old. EWP will grow to over 100’ easily. This one is being trained to grow horizontally and will eventually be subjected to niwaki pruning. Niwaki results in stunted length (or height) with very large trunks so I’ll be able to keep it under control.

Very cool, essentially giant bonsai.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Crowbob

And finally, this is a weeping Black Spruce after allowing the leader to grow downwards along the ground forming a ground cover. Visible on the lower right is part of the plant flowing over the rock. Not visible is more foliage obscured by the yellowing Japanese Irises. The groundcover created by the spruce is meant to mimic flowing water complimenting the fountain-like growth habit of the main tree. As an aside, one ‘rule’ of Japanese gardening is to mimic water, either still or flowing, if real water is not available. The pebble beds of Zen gardens are raked to form concentric ridges representative of ripples.

Thanks for your posts. Super interesting. I love the Japanese aesthetic, and most things Japanese, so this stuff is great!

[Crowbob]

There is a common misconception regarding the term bonsai. Most people think bonsai means ‘small’. Truth is bonsai does not have to be small. Miniature Bonsai was developed for gardeners who did not have the luxury of outdoor gardening space. Bonsai, both conifer and deciduous must be placed outdoors in winter in order to set and maintain their growth cycles. Hence, the bonsai pots.

Westerners use the term topiary meaning to form shapes, such as animals, etc. usually with boxwood (which deer LOVE). The English are expert topiariists*. Formal Italian gardens use a lot of stone, masonry and concrete. Many European estates with large expanses of garden landscapes will have installed faux ancient, decrepit-looking structures or building to mimic ruins. They are called ‘follies’ because they have no real function other than for decoration. Many an heir has bankrupted himself creating these elaborate structures. Hence the term, folly.


*methinks a made-up word, this is.

[Crowbob]

You are very welcome!

I have been known to push the envelope ending up being called a braggart. My exuberance takes over, sometimes.

BTW, those densely planted enormously colorful flower gardens growing every which way, including up the sides of cottages and walls, upon which your eyes can feast interminably are called exuberant gardens.

[Crowbob]

The ladies in winter past.

[flatbutt]

Very nice CB. I am always pleasantly surprised by how many things this group has in common.

I have about two dozen evergreens in pots that I will start training in spring 23. I have a red oak and a maple that I have been messing with by braiding new branches and training others to take "unnatural" growth patterns. I have another oak that I have been consistently cutting back to keep it dwarfed but with a fairly thick trunk.

This may be a good topic to keep going as these suckers grow.