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-   -   Bots .... the more ... the merrier? (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/off-topic-discussions/1155765-bots-more-merrier.html)

KFC911 02-04-2024 02:52 AM

Bots .... the more ... the merrier?
 
Nope! Approx 2500 just showed up ... the forum becomes slooooow.

Does anyone else even know .... or care?

And wtf are they up to?

Enquiring minds .... meh :D

masraum 02-04-2024 05:20 AM

Huh? How do you know? Was the list of logged on folks huge when you posted?

KFC911 02-04-2024 06:07 AM

I posted a thread some time back about "active users", and how it was artificially extremely high at times.... as that is something that I notice when I access the site via mobile view. I still see older threads revived by "suspicious users" outta the blue.... same old stuff.

This morning, when I first visited ... the total count was around 650 active users, and the site was "working fine" ... within a few minutes, the site became VERY sloooow, and not even responding. So I took another peek ... all of a sudden it had jumped to 3300 (abnormally high for ANY time of day). This is at 6:30 am EST ..... it's an "attack" and not by REAL users .... could be bots or just bogus "connections" ... I dunno. I only see the impact ... and it just cripples the site's performance.

But old threads being revived appear to be bot-like....

I'll get over it :D

edit: They are still here as of this post.... but latent imo.

HobieMarty 02-04-2024 06:24 AM

What are bots and what do they do?

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

masraum 02-04-2024 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911 (Post 12186511)
I posted a thread some time back about "active users", and how it was artificially extremely high at times.... as that is something that I notice when I access the site via mobile view. I still see older threads revived by "suspicious users" outta the blue.... same old stuff.

This morning, when I first visited ... the total count was around 650 active users, and the site was "working fine" ... within a few minutes, the site became VERY sloooow, and not even responding. So I took another peek ... all of a sudden it had jumped to 3300 (abnormally high for ANY time of day). This is at 6:30 am EST ..... it's an "attack" and not by REAL users .... could be bots or just bogus "connections" ... I dunno. I only see the impact ... and it just cripples the site's performance.

But old threads being revived appear to be bot-like....

I'll get over it :D

edit: They are still here as of this post.... but latent imo.

Yeah, I've seen the old threads bumped for no apparent reason by bots. I think it's been theorized that they bump the threads, wait a while, and then go back and edit a post with an image or some code to help various sites/products with search engine placement.

I rarely notice the active member count. But wow, 3300 is crazy. They are basically DoS the site (intentionally or not).

KFC911 02-04-2024 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HobieMarty (Post 12186520)
What are bots and what do they do?

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

Short for "robots" ... programs than might do "virtually anything", but not a real person... just "code".... and then ya have the "real people" who are scammers or spammers mixed in.

If a "techie" (that knows stuff) wanted to cripple a web site ... it wouldn't be too difficult for most imo.... except REALLY secure sites.

And those sites have the brain power on the "inside" to see it and intervene.....

I nose stuff .... well .... at least I used too :D

pwd72s 02-04-2024 08:47 AM

Thanks for the education. I've often wondered the why of old threads being brought back.

HobieMarty 02-04-2024 09:52 AM

Thanks. I wonder what would be the intent of such "bots", just to wreak havoc and cause trouble within a website?

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pwd72s 02-04-2024 10:02 AM

I did see a bit on Fox news about cyber threats from China. probing our infrastructure. Power, water, transportation, you name it. An "expert" mentioning that our cyber security guys are outnumbered 50 to 1 by Chinese hackers...

masraum 02-04-2024 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HobieMarty (Post 12186651)
Thanks. I wonder what would be the intent of such "bots", just to wreak havoc and cause trouble within a website?

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

Most of the time the goal is to spread ads/spam.

For instance, a lot of bots will register and create posts with a link to some product.

THere's also the theory that if they post about some item enough on the Internet so that search engine crawlers find it that it will be placed higher in search results.

If you're selling junk, you would want your junk to be at the top of the first page when people search for that particular junk. If there are 10,000 websites that have links to your junk, but the next nearest similar junk is only on 2,000 websites, then your junk will feature more prominently in search results for "junk".

RobFrost 02-04-2024 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911 (Post 12186511)
I posted a thread some time back about "active users", and how it was artificially extremely high at times.... as that is something that I notice when I access the site via mobile view. I still see older threads revived by "suspicious users" outta the blue.... same old stuff.



This morning, when I first visited ... the total count was around 650 active users, and the site was "working fine" ... within a few minutes, the site became VERY sloooow, and not even responding. So I took another peek ... all of a sudden it had jumped to 3300 (abnormally high for ANY time of day). This is at 6:30 am EST ..... it's an "attack" and not by REAL users .... could be bots or just bogus "connections" ... I dunno. I only see the impact ... and it just cripples the site's performance.



But old threads being revived appear to be bot-like....



I'll get over it :D



edit: They are still here as of this post.... but latent imo.

I don't know what hosting you have in place but if you buy a cloudflare account and install it as a CDN you can analyse the bot traffic and put filters in place to mitigate their impact. Additionally it will cache pages and serve all your images for you, making the site faster even with or without bots.

Maybe you have something like that already.

Sent from my SM-G988B using Tapatalk

RobFrost 02-04-2024 06:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HobieMarty (Post 12186520)
What are bots and what do they do?

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

Some scrape your content so they can build their own site to attract search engine traffic, on which they can show ads to make money.

Some search for emails to which they can send spam.

Some find your website forms so they can spam you through your forms.

Some search for vulnerabilities and exploits so they can install malicious code on your server.

The malicious code can be used to: try to hack other websites, send email spam to others, send form spam to others, encrypt your server contents so they can demand a ransom to decrypt it, or display messages from Islamic fundamentalists bragging that they hacked it.

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Bill Douglas 02-04-2024 09:57 PM

Bots.

I had a website called lyallbaybeach.co.nz and I'd get about 2,000 hits per month. When I put in the key words tits and kardashians on the site the hit rate went WAY up. A big percentage of the hits were from bots. I had a pic of a girl on a cafe racer Ducati that got a lot of hits from some Italian motorcycle group.

Gogar 02-05-2024 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HobieMarty (Post 12186520)
What are bots and what do they do?

They vote everything 1-star and senior citizens lose their mind

KFC911 02-05-2024 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gogar (Post 12187264)
They vote everything 1-star and senior citizens lose their mind

Still have mine .... I don't see 'em on mobile :D.

FWIW ... most of 'em aren't even on a forum ... just parked on the main forum page I assume. Like Steve alluded ... much like a DoS at a network layer... oh well.

And tho' I haven't been on PARF in a long time ... the really "star struck" reside there, and it just spills over to here for some .... that's a real person(s) ... not bots.

Steve F 02-06-2024 06:07 AM

Clean up on aisle 5:rolleyes:

https://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-356-technical-forum/

stevej37 02-06-2024 07:26 AM

Lol.....takeover by the Abu Dhabi Call Girls!

Alan A 02-06-2024 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HobieMarty (Post 12186651)
Thanks. I wonder what would be the intent of such "bots", just to wreak havoc and cause trouble within a website?

Sent from my SM-S916U using Tapatalk

Lots of them currently are training generative AI to pass as human - so they can post {whatever they are paid to do}

masraum 02-07-2024 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve F (Post 12187910)

Alina5 also spammed the 964/993 forum with the same crap.

Zeke 02-10-2024 02:38 PM

I was reading another forum and it's owned and administered by an individual. He has at least as many members as Pelican. He stated yesterday that 60% of the bots were Russian based.He mentioned something about bots "indexing" his forums (he owns a few) and that at times they really slow down his servers.

So he banned all of Russia. Now, IDK about VPN's and all that. Maybe due to the volume of data VPM's are not financially feasible for bots.

I just thought this was interesting being a tech luddite.

masraum 02-10-2024 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeke (Post 12191304)
I was reading another forum and it's owned and administered by an individual. He has at least as many members as Pelican. He stated yesterday that 60% of the bots were Russian based.He mentioned something about bots "indexing" his forums (he owns a few) and that at times they really slow down his servers.

So he banned all of Russia. Now, IDK about VPN's and all that. Maybe due to the volume of data VPM's are not financially feasible for bots.

I just thought this was interesting being a tech luddite.

Yep, that's exactly what KC911 mentioned in one of the other "forum hit by bots" posts.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911 (Post 12190258)
I've pointed out the number of bots recently... this morning ... they aren't active.... yet.

If someone doesn't "nip it in the bud" like Barney Fife then this site could very well be in jeopardy imo.... they already cripple it at times.

Serious suggestions here .... for anyone who GAF ;)....

Over 20 years ago in my last corporate gig, our site was constantly under "attack".... although we had global interests .... we simply blocked ALL IP connections that originated out of Russia or China .... eliminated a huge percentage of the daily attempts .... thousands of them. Of course there are ways to circumvent this by a sophisticated hacker.... but most aren't and don't.

Don't know how much $$$ is generated for Pelican from these two places (and some areas in Africa).... but it's not worth it .... is it?

I dunno .... it's their call.

Just a penny's worth of experience, observation, and advice.... take it fwiw.


sc_rufctr 02-10-2024 02:53 PM

The stats right now - "1204 (39 members & 1165 guests)". :confused:

KFC911 02-10-2024 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sc_rufctr (Post 12191315)
The stats right now - "1204 (39 members & 1165 guests)". :confused:

That's prerty normal :). But suddenly jumping by 1500-3000 even more guests is not.... and sometimes they just "hang around". It's pretty obvious when the site stops responding at 6:15 am EST and the count is suddenly 3300.

An analysis of the IP connections is called for .... or not. Just blocking Russia and China IP traffic will likely do it .... and looking to see if a bunch are from the "same IP address" would be prudent too.

BTDT .... a loooong time ago ;)

LEAKYSEALS951 02-10-2024 03:18 PM

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1707610710.jpg

stevej37 02-10-2024 06:02 PM

How about a new sub-forum.....The Pelican Parts Abu Dhabi Call Girls.
Rule #1...Pics are mandatory.

I've always thought they were hot...esp with the hijab.:)

masraum 02-16-2024 07:23 AM

LOL, Steve!

The board has been SLOOOW this morning. I did notice that at one point there were ~300 guests, and then later there were ~600 guests. I haven't seen the crazy numbers that KC saw, but maybe those were the instances when I couldn't refresh or get the page to respond at all.

KFC911 07-03-2024 01:23 AM

Only 98 active users this morning (a "reset" must have just ocurred) ... we all used to get knocked off at 6:30 EST years ago ....

I've been seeing 9-10K active users the past few days...

BotsR'Us :(

masraum 07-03-2024 04:07 AM

Wow, crazy! I never notice the amount of users.

stealthn 07-03-2024 05:43 PM

It’s AI scraping the Internet to learn everything ever written, and commented on.

Nothing to see here…

KFC911 07-04-2024 12:25 AM

I'm not obsessed with this .... I just notice stuff :D....

Don't think it's AI scraping for info because the active users aren't on a forum ... they just park on the main page. More like a DoS attack ... and yep, they cripple the site at times.

I PM'd Nostatic and Z-man ... I'm sure they care :(.

The 9-10K "active users" for several days was twice the previous "high water" counts I have ever observed.

As a former IT "infrastructure" guy ... this crap annoys me ....

But not that much ;)

rockfan4 07-30-2024 08:52 AM

There was an article the other day from a guy having the same problem.

https://about.readthedocs.com/blog/2024/07/ai-crawlers-abuse

AI crawlers need to be more respectful

Steve Carlton 07-30-2024 09:05 AM

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/0BcFHvEpP7A?si=5kqaJKpRjGCFaBlW" title="YouTube video player" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; clipboard-write; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture; web-share" referrerpolicy="strict-origin-when-cross-origin" allowfullscreen></iframe>

KFC911 08-11-2024 02:05 AM

17,800 at 6am est on a Sunday morning....

A new Olympic bot record :D

masraum 08-11-2024 06:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KC911 (Post 12300721)
17,800 at 6am est on a Sunday morning....

A new Olympic bot record :D

that's crazy! I guess i'm never on early enough to notice. I'm OK with that.


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