Electric vehicle lease

[Alan A]

I loathe the current crop of electric vehicles. I’m a range and refill time monkey and they don’t have any of either. I’ll say that up front - so someone can accuse me of confirmation bias. I’m also hoping this stays non-partisan.

It seems that there are some massive incentives for leasing electric vehicles right now. Polestar started with that $299 a month deal, but a quick look-see shows Toyota, Subaru, Lexus and Acura all have 5 digit cap cost reductions.

I know some of it is a tax credit, but still…

Is the gloss finally off electrons, or something else driving this?

[Sooner or later]

Overall sales are still increasing though at a slower rate. Hybrids are taking a fair piece of the pie (good).

The real problem is that everyone is producing an ev when just a few years ago the choices were very limited. Tesla's market share has dropped below 50% for the first time. Tesla had 79% in 2020. Competition is fierce.

https://caredge.com/guides/electric-vehicle-market-share-and-sales

[Sooner or later]

Speaking of hybrids. The 2025 Civic Hybrid can be had for 30k including destination. 200 hp. 232 torque. 14.9 quarter mile, faster than a 2024 Civic si. And still gets an estimated 50/47/49 mpg city/highway/combined.

[Steve Carlton]

I think some current issues with EVs are: too many were built and too many are more high end (expensive) than the buyers would like. Also, people are realizing that charging away from home isn't often good. I think the pricing has over-compensated for this lull.

There's been ridiculous deals on EVs since near the beginning. The Fiat 500e, the BMW i3, the Chevy Bolt. The Polestar deal was outstanding and there was an additional $2,000 if you belonged to Costco. I took one of those Polestar deals (0.264% APR equivalent), but on a dual motor, which was actually a few dollars less. 421hp, 546 lb/ft of torque for cheap- I'm happy, and I'm getting 106 MPGe combined.

If range and charging aren't a problem for you, EV leases can be awesome.

[1990C4S]

Multiple issues. Market saturation, most people that want to buy an EV have done so. Used EV's are dirt cheap. Ford and GM are pulling back and reformulating their EV products, so the market is waiting for 'something better'.

If you want an EV, a cheap lease might be a good way to bridge the gap and wait for longer range/better batteries.

[stealthn]

Agreed, Porsche is going to find out to late (can’t believe they don’t see it now) that their move to EV’s will crush the company…

[Dixie]

Originally Posted by Sooner or later

Speaking of hybrids. The 2025 Civic Hybrid can be had for 30k including destination. 200 hp. 232 torque. 14.9 quarter mile, faster than a 2024 Civic si. And still gets an estimated 50/47/49 mpg city/highway/combined.

Good to know, thanks.

[Deschodt]

I'm leasing a polestar actually...not for $299 sadly, the dual motor performance one... I did this as an experiment after 2x $100/mo E-golf leases that were totally adequate but "yawn" (but hey, cheap)

I wanted to experience the 480 hp AWD take off, the instant teleportation in traffic, the free power from my solar panels, the pre-heating of my seats and steering wheel on those cold mornings, but who am I kidding, most of all the power.... Done.

Will I buy the car at lease end? are you crazy? Values are plumetting to 60-70% of buyout. Those things are iPhones... The are really cool but need a monthly reboot, constant OTA upgrades, infortainment restarts... sometimes a feature works, sometimes "better luck next time". The tech progresses so fast those things make no sense to purchase. Dealers are few and far between and repairs slow. Luckily I needed none so far and also zero maintenance in 18 mo. It's fast as F. It's unreal...

That said my next car will be a used ICE because those electric things are either affordable and "meh", or super cool but exorbitantly priced. And not having a home charger is just not a usable model for people... charging outside on a 100F day in a parking lot is a no go for me. I have a real 240 mi range (using it like a race car) so that is 120mi to and back... Not enough yet...

So what was the Q again? Have the electrons lost their gloss? no, it's a "horse for course" situation. For around town or within 120 miles from home, it's great. And you need a second "real" car. But they can be fun. The Polestar2 is super fun when you teleport on an onramp and manages weight very well...No oil changes, no brake pads, no dirty gas station pumps, no "warming it up". No hate, no promoting here, it does the job it's made to do, whether that fits your needs and situation is up to you.

Me, I'd get a good mild hybrid or a regular gas car. This 2035 mandate isn't happening, it cannot (and I say that after 3 electrics in a row and I like them!). The infrastructure to go above and beyond current market saturation of people with home chargers does not exist here. (that said Europe has some interesting things coming up, the new Renault 5 / Alpine version looks like a tasty treat for reasonable $, but I don't want a leaf or Bolt thanks)

[cockerpunk]

Originally Posted by 1990C4S

Multiple issues. Market saturation, most people that want to buy an EV have done so. Used EV's are dirt cheap. Ford and GM are pulling back and reformulating their EV products, so the market is waiting for 'something better'.

If you want an EV, a cheap lease might be a good way to bridge the gap and wait for longer range/better batteries.

na, tesla is tanking because cybertruck sucks, and everything else they make is now old, and elon is a moron attacking his own fan base. now that the resale on teslas is deprecating like normal cars ... why would you ever buy a new tesla?

everyone else, literally everyone else, in the market is growing. just that tesla was so big, it has single handedly dragged the rest of the EV market down.

i partial to the ionic 5 and 6 myself. i wanna love the polestar but something about it ... just isnt right.

[Steve Carlton]

The Ionic 5 N is Car and Driver's EV of the year...

[WPOZZZ]

I wanted a Hyundai EV because of the range and they had really good lease deals. Unfortunately, since they are all independent dealers, they screw around with adjusted market value and other add ons. So a lease at $239 based on a $7500 cap reduction ends up at $500 because of adj market value ($5000) and their add ons.

Fed up, I walk into Tesla and it was a breath of fresh air. No pushy sales people. Take the car out for a test drive by yourself and come back in 30 minutes. Came back, ordered a new Model 3 and it was here in a week.

[Skytrooper]

My last 2 rental cars were hybrids. I like the both. I would never go full EV. At least not until the proper infrastructure was in place, but still the short distance and long charge times precludes that....at least in my lifetime

[Arizona_928]

Originally Posted by Sooner or later

Speaking of hybrids. The 2025 Civic Hybrid can be had for 30k including destination. 200 hp. 232 torque. 14.9 quarter mile, faster than a 2024 Civic si. And still gets an estimated 50/47/49 mpg city/highway/combined.

Those estimates are comical. Live in a cold northern region and the real life mpg will be quite a bit lower.


My Cummins gets better mpg on the highway than a hybrid suv when it’s negative…

[Steve Carlton]

Originally Posted by Deschodt

it's a "horse for course" situation.

Exactly. Either the application and its limits work, or not so much.

Leasehackr is a good resource on ICE cars, hybrids, or EVs. The truly amazing deals are usually unicorns or maybe lies. There's a pre-negotiated deal section that will give you a quick idea. Sometimes a Costco incentive, or loyalty, or conquest, or employment, or affiliation can make a big difference.

https://pnd.leasehackr.com/

[Alan A]

Ok so it's not just me. Looks like the gloss IS off these things...

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/bad-news-for-evs-consumers-less-likely-to-buy-one-compared-to-last-year-190654330.html

In its latest Mobility Consumer Index (MCI), consulting firm EY found that only 34% of US consumers plan to purchase an electrified vehicle (meaning fully electric, plug-in hybrid, or hybrid) as their next car. That's down from 48% in EY’s 2023 survey.

Looking specifically at fully electric vehicles, the number drops to a paltry 11% from 22% a year ago.

A paltry 11% are thinking they'll get one.
Not a high number is it...

Maybe we'll get some better V8s instead. That would be nice.

[Deschodt]

I think another partial reason, at least for $ conscious shoppers, may be insurance !
Like for like an EV is way more expensive to insure... Apparently initially Ins.co. claimed they did not have enough data on repair costs and played it safe (what my agent told me), but now ? by and large they total them more vs repairing ICE cars, the battery cost is a large part of the car.. I would also not be shocked if 500 HP 600 ft-lb electric cars crashed more, but no data there, just a guess.. It's kinda shocking to me anyone off the street car buy a Lambo Huracan - no training required - but some of these electric beast are even faster and way cheaper, I imagine that doesnt always end well.

[Steve Carlton]

Getting insurance on non-Tesla EVs through Tesla saved me 1/3 of what I was paying, which was high. But Tesla only sells insurance (on any kind of car) in 12 states.

I had a girl 5 car lengths in front of me almost certainly texting. She drifted almost completely out of her lane, swerved back, crossed the double yellow line and hit a van coming the other way. She hit him in the back have, rotating the van to come across the road and knock me off, and down a small hill. There was $20,900 of damage to my XC40 EV and it was going to be fixed until the body shop noticed the battery had been dented slightly. A $21,000 battery replacement resulted in it being totaled. But it gave me the opportunity to get the Polestar 2 (I had one before) for a much lower payment than the equivalent car I had in the Volvo.

[1990C4S]

^^^ Battery damage costs are what drive the insurance cost up. If it gets a dent, it needs to be replaced.

[Steve Carlton]

It's like insuring a Rolls Royce! I finally made it. Sort of.

[WPOZZZ]

Originally Posted by Deschodt

I think another partial reason, at least for $ conscious shoppers, may be insurance !
Like for like an EV is way more expensive to insure... Apparently initially Ins.co. claimed they did not have enough data on repair costs and played it safe (what my agent told me), but now ? by and large they total them more vs repairing ICE cars, the battery cost is a large part of the car.. I would also not be shocked if 500 HP 600 ft-lb electric cars crashed more, but no data there, just a guess.. It's kinda shocking to me anyone off the street car buy a Lambo Huracan - no training required - but some of these electric beast are even faster and way cheaper, I imagine that doesnt always end well.

I couldn't believe what my 24 Model 3 cost for insurance. $2500 a year, but perhaps that is because it is a lease and a brand new model? Then I got a 22 Model Y Performance and the insurance is half of the Model 3. The MYP was about the same as my 2018 Alfa Stelvio's insurance.