Carbon Monoxide leak

[Mike80911]

Last night I started to feel nauseous and had a headache I just thought I was getting sick so sat down to rest. About an hour later my CO alarm at the top of my basement stairs went off. Not putting 2 and 2 together I thought maybe it was an error, and I cleared it and put it back about 10 minutes later it went off again but this time the one in my basement also started beeping. I shut the boiler down opened up the windows and called 911. The fire department responded and found high levels throughout the house even on the second floor. They were great and extremely helpful they stayed until the levels went down to an acceptable level. Of course, had to happen on a Saturday night so now I am trying to find a boiler repair person to come here on a Sunday as we are without heat or hot water and it's 19 degrees outside.
If I did not have CO detectors (I have 5) or they were not working I am convinced my wife, and I would be dead. Please make sure you have working reliable CO detectors in your home and even your business. I even bought a CO reader like the FD uses from Amazon last night it gives a digital level readout. I figure after they repair it, I can check to make sure there is no leak.

[stealthn]

Glad you and yours are OK!

[RNajarian]

Thank Goodness you had the foresight to have several working CO monitors.

Great Advice. Glad everyone is OK

[William930t]

Thanks for sharing your incident, glad you are ok. With gas heat and hot water, I have several CO detectors in the house and plan to order the digital reader per your request. Let us know what caused the rise in CO levels. My guess: has to be a bad heat exchanger or exhaust venting issue.

[Erakad]

Similar happened to me a couple years ago. CO detectors kept going off randomly. We'd check, open windows (not fun in winter), replaced batteries, but still random. Finally got the plumber out to check the boiler, again, nothing, all checked out. Then he happened to give the exhaust flue a squeeze and his thumb went through! After that, more squeezes and it crumbled. We were lucky

[fintstone]

I had the same happen with a tenant once about the same time of night. I am glad I had added functioning CO detectors to the older home a few months earlier. The fire department indicated deadly levels of CO in the house. The system needed replacing and since I did not trust the tenant to keep batteries in the detectors (unreliable tenant), I changed the system to electric heat (heat pump). disconnected the gas log, and got rid of the propane tank.

I sure am glad to hear that you/your family are all right. That was a close call.

[Mike80911]

Thanks guys. Willam, I believe you are right I have not had anyone here yet but I have a direct vent gas boiler, and I think the silicone that seals the flue joints got old and started to leak causing the CO to enter the basement. Should hopefully be an easy fix. my boiler is 30 years old so I guess the silicone lived it's life span.

[Mike80911]

Originally Posted by fintstone

I had the same happen with a tenant once about the same time of night. I am glad I had added functioning CO detectors to the older home a few months earlier. The fire department indicated deadly levels of CO in the house. The system needed replacing and since I did not trust the tenant to keep batteries in the detectors (unreliable tenant), I changed the system to electric heat (heat pump). disconnected the gas log, and got rid of the propane tank.

I sure am glad to hear that you/your family are all right. That was a close call.

You did the right thing especially as a landlord. I could not imagine someone dying in my rental property because I did not have CO detectors. I was thinking I should maybe add some electric slit units in the future

[fintstone]

I had another rental (with an oil furnace) that I was renovating, and the workers doing the demo felt sick. It turned out it was the chimney/flue. The house (built in the 20s) had originally had a coal burner in the basement and a wood stove (cooking) on the main floor. When they converted the furnace to oil in the 70s, they simply replaced the coal burner with an oil furnace in the basement and used the same flue. They patched over the hole where the main floor wood stove entered the same block chimney used by the oil unit (no liner) and installed a small electric stove (boxed in the flue). It was leaking very badly.

I had the flue/chimney torn out and a heat pump with electric strips installed there as well. The oil tank was an eyesore, and the new system was much smaller (inside) so it worked out well. A heat pump also added A/C which was not totally necessary in that climate, but really nice for a couple months each year.

[wdfifteen]

Originally Posted by Mike80911

Please make sure you have working reliable CO detectors in your home and even your business.

Glad you're OK!
Good reminder. Thank you. To tell the truth, don't know if our smoke detectors sniff CO or not. Is CO heavy or does it float to the ceiling?

[KFC911]

Whew ... !

I've just purchased a new 2-pack Smoke/CO combined for my parents.

Ya want the smoke up high and the CO down low ...

These are primarily for smoke ... they will go up. Along with an existing CO down low in their bedroom.

[Mike80911]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

Glad you're OK!
Good reminder. Thank you. To tell the truth, don't know if our smoke detectors sniff CO or not. Is CO heavy or does it float to the ceiling?

They say CO is heavy and the detectors should be within about 14 inches of the floor. But the first detector to go off was the one at the top of the basement steps and the boiler is in the basement. There was also a high level all the way up on the 2nd floor. I have a detector in the basement that is close to the floor that one did not go off until the upstairs one went off twice. I have both combo detectors and the specific CO detectors the first one that went off was the combo.

[fintstone]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

Glad you're OK!
Good reminder. Thank you. To tell the truth, don't know if our smoke detectors sniff CO or not. Is CO heavy or does it float to the ceiling?

Most do not do both, but you can certainly buy those that do. If all yours are the same/match, it is likely that they are not as the ones that do both are usually more expensive and people usually do not send the extra money. Just google the part number off of one and the specs will tell you. I have one in each level of my home as there is a gas log in each...but the rest of the detectors are just for smoke/fire. Mine are mounted low upstairs but on the ceiling downstairs.

I bought all new detectors for my vacation home when I bought it (they are only good for 10-12 years...some less). I used the combination CO/fire ones throughout as I was able to get a good deal due to volume (hardware stores sell builder packs) and i liked that they all matched and operated the same, mounted the same, used the same batteries, etc. I chose not to use them for my monitored alarms (just regular smoke/fire detectors, as it is really only an issue when you are there...and they are reportedly more prone to false alarms.

[KFC911]

If you have natural gas heat here, code requires CO at floor levels and how many depend upon house layout. The Smoke/CO combos which were common at the big box recently... up high at basement stairs, and upstairs, etc. Overkill and redundancy beats the theory of high & low .... or low & high or ???.

They will detect burnt toast..
after the house is gone

[fintstone]

Smoke detectors were wired everywhere in my newer homes (pretty much every room and hallway) and replacement combination CO/fire were designed to swap right in with same base/wiring. It takes a bit more thought for the older homes and the wiring is not there. In most places, the requirements for detectors in existing homes in general (and more so for CO) are quite low (although you can add ones that work on battery alone (wired ones use a battery backup). I have had to meet code for rental homes (when I changed the use of the home) ...but usually try to far exceed the minimum. I like the redundancy theory...even in totally electric homes (which I greatly prefer for rentals).

Most folks should check the expiration dates on theirs as they lose effectiveness. It is usually on the back or in the battery compartment.

[rfuerst911sc]

Our dual fuel heat pump/LP furnace is vented outside via PVC pipe . I am thankful for that . I am glad the OP and family are OK . Very scary .

[cabmandone]

Originally Posted by Mike80911

Thanks guys. Willam, I believe you are right I have not had anyone here yet but I have a direct vent gas boiler, and I think the silicone that seals the flue joints got old and started to leak causing the CO to enter the basement. Should hopefully be an easy fix. my boiler is 30 years old so I guess the silicone lived it's life span.

Typically the heat exchanger gets soot buildup and needs cleaned. If the system is venting properly, the silicone is pretty much for looks from my experience. Odds are if you're able to see the burner flame, it'll be lazy and yellow. I didn't do much with boilers but worked on a few for friends. Each time there was a problem I had to take the metal outer panels off where the vent pipe connected to the boiler and vacuum the soot out of the heat exchanger.

[porsche930dude]

The pipe shouldnt need to be sealed at all there should be negative pressure in it. If it is blowing out there is a clog

[Mike80911]

Originally Posted by cabmandone

Typically the heat exchanger gets soot buildup and needs cleaned. If the system is venting properly, the silicone is pretty much for looks from my experience. Odds are if you're able to see the burner flame, it'll be lazy and yellow. I didn't do much with boilers but worked on a few for friends. Each time there was a problem I had to take the metal outer panels off where the vent pipe connected to the boiler and vacuum the soot out of the heat exchanger.

Thanks for the reply Nick. So you are saying if I remove the elbow where the vent connects to the boiler there might be soot built up in there. Here is a picture I should remove the elbow circled, correct?

[VINMAN]

Originally Posted by Mike80911

They say CO is heavy and the detectors should be within about 14 inches of the floor.

Very untrue. CO is the same or just slightly lighter than air. It does not settle.
Detectors are better off placed closer to the ceiling. Especially around sleeping areas.
You should have a CO detector on every level of a residence.

Also, if your CO alarm goes off, DO NOT open up and try to air the house out. That makes it extremely hard for us to get the actual levels and source of the leak. Leave doors and windows closed , get your family outside and wait for us to get there.

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