Gas prices curtail Porsche enjoyment again-

[rickeolis]

Last month a Pelicanite was trying unsuccessfully to defend the oil companies in their need to raise gas prices. I blamed these companies of screwing the average consumer by jacking up these prices in order to simply make more profit for themselves, and in today's IWON news website, there is more proof of that:

http://money.iwon.com/ht/nw/bus/20031030/hl_bus-n30158172.html?PG=home&SEC=news

Personally I say what I said before, that the politically backed oil industries are crooked, and are a great example of the rich getting richer, while the poor get poorer-

[surflvr911sc]

Originally posted by rickeolis
the rich getting richer, while the poor get poorer-

Anarchy for the UK?

I do not doubt that the supply and demand is manipulated to the benefit of those that profit from fuel sales, but as far as curtailing my Porsche enjoyment, I don’t think so.

Most do not realize that to date the US has enjoyed the lowest fuel prices in the world. I don’t think necessities such as fuel should be taxed the way they are, but IMO until the prices come close to the rest of the world we have a lot larger concerns that grasp at our wallets.

[boyo]

Gas isn't addictive...I can stop buying it any time I want!

-Boyo

[cowtown]

So how much is a gallon of gas in New Mexico? If you're upset now, I bet you'd have a breakdown if you lived in CA

I have a hard time getting worked up about this subject. Given the instability of the countries that supply us, and given that many of us spend, oh, $8 a gallon for drinking water, and given what the Europeans pay, it's just not high on my list of things to get upset about.

[singpilot]

Travelling internationally for 25 years makes me appreciate our gas prices here. Was $4+ a gallon in Italy last month for regular.

Makes me wince when I put $2 a gallon of supreme in the p-cars here in California. Only because I remember how cheap it used to be.

[Rick Lee]

I doubt any guy who drives a Porsche is gonna get much sympathy from the folks who really have a hard time paying for gas. It amazes me how people always accuse "Big Oil" companies of gouging consumers, when the federal gubmint could make the price drop overnight by a good $.50 per gallon by dropping their gas tax. State gov't. takes their cut too. And they all tax the profits of the companies that refine and distribute the gas, tax the trucks that deliver it, the gas stations who sell it - taxation every step of the way from the ground to your car's gas cap. Rent a car in Europe or Japan and then complain that we pay too much for gas. And "politically backed" oil companies? I think Mobil-Exxon is one of, if not, THE largest employers in the US. I guess that means they're a "special interest", eh? If I were a pol, you're darn tootin' I'd pay attention to the concerns of one of the nation's largest employers and tax payers.

[echrisconnor]

Gas prices are the last thing to keep us from enjoying our cars. Even the idea that we're not going to drive becauase gas is $0.25 per gallon more expensive is rediculous.

Now, if prices here were the way they are in Europe, I think we'd see a lot better usage of resources overall. Alternative fuels would suddnely be more interesting and cost effective. Fewer 5.7 liter engines used to drive down the block to get groceries, or as single occupant commuters.

I realize that most of us on this board are enthusiasts and enjoy to drive. We have moderately expensive cars which cost money in every way for us to appreciate. As with every industry, there may be some corruption involved, but we've still got it pretty damn good. Don't let a few cents affect your driving pleasure.

c

[rickeolis]

I appreciate the feedback, but I think you guys are missing the point I am trying to make.
(To answer the question, gas is reasonable in N.M compared to the rest of the country.)

OUR U.S. gas prices could be much cheaper if these companies weren't spanking us so hard. These huge profits they're posting are a direct result of the jacked up prices they're making us pay.

What I'm hearing here is "Yeah, they're screwing us a bit here, but they're really getting spanked in Europe, so let's not bitc#" This is exactly what these companies want us to feel so they can keep on getting away with it. I for one have a hard time biting my lip when someone is abusing me.





(By the way, glad to see you escaped danger Singpilot-)

[Rick Lee]

Good!!! I want them to make a profit!!! Would you rather they lose money and lay off workers, pay no taxes, creating less competition and poorer quality so someone else can come along and raise the prices for lack of competitors? What socialist la-la land did you grow up in? Any company's profit margin should be as high as the market will bear. If you're willing to pay it, I'm willing to charge it. Buy high, sell low and then tell me that's how corporations should operate too. Geeze!!!!

[singpilot]

Rickeolis,

After I read my post, I realized it sounded as you described it. Not what I meant. I agree, why is there such a discrepancy between prices? I know we have all heard it's because of the California blend stuff. I am talking about how quickly the price goes up (responding to some event) and how slowly it goes back down, and then never seems to go back down to where it was before the 'event'. Gas in SoCal is still hovering around $2 a gallon.

[Wil Ferch]

Consider this:
When in France on business travel in 1996-97 ( think about the time frame, also), here's what I found on gas prices:
- gasoline... $6.00 / gal
- diesel ..... $ 4.00 / gal.

And to think that 13 years ago I paid $1.35 / gal... and sometime within the past two years it has wildly fluctuated...but still between $1.00 and $1.80 a gallon for regular unleaded....13 years of inflation later. Certainly, I can understand the issue on an "US-based" view.... but stand back and look at it also from a global perspective, with or without governement taxation added.

---Wil Ferch

[CHILI]

I spent $2,280 on gas last year! That was between both of my cars, not just he P-car. I've stated it over the past few years. Don't know why, but it's interesting to know.

Think of what I could have bought! I should ride a bike. Hehehehe

[island911]

Originally posted by Richard LeSchander
. .. What socialist la-la land did you grow up in? Any company's profit margin should be as high as the market will bear. . . ..

I know what you're saying, but. . .

"max market bearing prices" only works when competition is allowed. (absent of price fixing)

For example; If your water district started to charge 5$/gal, they would certainly raise their profit margine. . . .would that be okay?. . .your pipe doesnt go anywhere else.

[Rick Lee]

Originally posted by island911
I know what you're saying, but. . .

"max market bearing prices" only works when competition is allowed.

If your water district started to charge 5$/gal, they would certainly raise their profit margine.

Sadly, I don't think it would raise their profit margin, though it should. Such monopolies are so inefficient that the extra revenue would find some crevace to seep into and would never morph into more black ink.

[nostatic]

Originally posted by CHILI


Think of what I could have bought! I should ride a bike. Hehehehe

EXACTLY. I think gas prices should be HIGHER, and the extra money should pay to make bike travel safer, and provide more mass transit. Especially the bike part...America is going to go broke supporting an aging population that has myriad health problems, most related to obesity and lack of exercise. Childhood obesity is on the rise, and diabetes will reach epidemic proportions in the next 10 years. You think gas is expensive? Try health care in a few years...

I love to drive my car as much as anyone, but there are too many cars, and not enough bikes, trains, and subways.

[island911]

Dr. No, I used to ride to work. . .we have some great bike paths around here. However, artificially rasing the cost of energy has costly repercussions that are in no way going to cover the benifit of a few more people pedaling around. (not everyone lives in warm California, youknow)

[emcon5]

The price of fuel in Europe has NO relation to the cost of fuel in the US, because most of the higher prices in Europe is taxes.

A quick Google search turns up this:



lifted from here:
http://www.pcf.ab.ca/quick_answers/gasoline_pricing/international.asp

Looks like gasoline in France actually costs less than in the USA, they just charge almost 7 times more taxes on it.

California's higher gas prices comes in part from this as well. Part of it is Oil companies screwing us.

Tom

[Halm]

Down and dirty: Who make the most profit?

Exxon P/E= 14.1
GE P/E = 20.6
IBM P/E = 22.8
Kimbery Clark P/E = 16.9

Base on the P/E ratio, I don't see Big Oil totally out of line.

And by the way, "profit" is not a four letter word.

[echrisconnor]

I'm with Nostatic on this one. Higher prices could probably do us some good. It would certainly jump start some change.

As for being "abused" by taxation of fuel prices. This country does a lot to see that fuel prices remain affordable. Hell, if they tried to shoot up, we'd even go to war over them. Now, the base prices are still very good here, and taxation is minimal. I think I saw something in the paper today about a $20 billion aid package going to Iraq which won't directly be paid back. Where do you think that money will come from; taxes. Tell me that bill isn't related to ensuring stability of our cost per gallon.

We ***** about lower taxes and increased services all the time now. We ***** about paying more for gas, our healthcare... Things cost money and our deficit is just getting bigger and bigger. As a country, we're living on credit. We need to all step up and pay for what we use, and work on conservation at the same time.

c

[masraum]

If you consider the price of gas as compared to years ago and then take inflation into account hasn't the price of gas gone up less than eggs, milk, butter, drinking water, beer, etc...

I don't understand why anyone in the states complains about gas prices, oh wait, sure I do, we're spoiled.