Death of Open Wheel Racing

[brawlins]

I read an article recently that said Open-Wheel Racing (IRL, F1, etc) is practically dead in the USA. What gives?

I like racing of all kinds, and I have to admit I am a huge NASCAR fan. (Attended five races last year.)

Advantages of NASCAR racing over Open-Wheel: Tight passing, aggressive competition (since the wheels are protected during collision). Also, it seems that you can relate to the racers as human beings (even if they say "Dadgum, whar's my beer?) The IRL / F1 guys seem to snobby and distant. NASCAR has done a great job at marketing its drivers. And NASCAR's popularity and attendance keep going up.

What'll it take to pull open-wheel racing out of the ditch?

[Sponge]

IRL thinks the solution is to make it more like NASCAR - restrict all of the cars for close racing - focus on the drivers not the cars....

CART thinks it needs to be more like F1 (ref CART chairman visits to talk to F1 director last year)...

F1 only has one race a year in the US... with as little as the normal US population cares about Europe (or the rest of the world) it would take a lot to spark widespread interest (plus if you are on the east coast you have to get up at 6AM to watch it live on speed channel.

I think open wheel will continue to live... partly becasue of NASCAR... NASCAR has caused a large segment of the population to watch racing -- some sort of racing. Some segment of this will wonder what else there is and find series that interest them... though they might never appreciate the technology and precision of F1 - everyone likes a good race... look for the series to change to encourage it (F1 point scheme?)... with F1 being the last to put strict limits on the cars to decrease the differencial and make the racing closer.... in my opinion, a sad day...

[motion]

NASCAR is a dumb-downed racing series that's just perfect for the average American fan. IRL is almost as dumbed-down. CART is too complex, so the average guy just doesn't get it and therefore doesn't watch. F1 is too complex in the extreme. Nobody here in America watches F1 or knows anything about it.

Its a shame. I pray that CART will live on as OWRS, but we'll have to wait until Jan 28th to find out. In the mean time, DEATH TO TONY GEORGE!!!

[cegerer]

One thing's for sure, NASCAR has done a great job convincing their fans that their drivers are accessible. I read this all the time. As if somebody's going to walk into the paddock (do they use the word 'paddock" in NASCAR ) and walk up to Dale Bobby Jo Gordon and strike up a casual conversation ..... don't THINK so. Even if ya got close, there'd be 200 other fans stampeding each other to get a look ....

[Zeke]

Some thoughts on the subject: IRL racing at Texas is as close as NASCAR is, there's just less cars in the race, i.e., 21 vs. 43. It takes a brave group of men (and woman) to drive that close because when they do touch, it's disaster like Kenny Brack'd deal.

I think the suspension setups are very sosphisticated in IRL and CART and that neither are dumbed down. Dumbed down is IROC.

Racing has become too much of a business. I remember the early Long Beach Grand Prix days post F1. There were actually spaces on the grid for walk on's. Our own local PIG Racing was one of them. It was almost an extension SCCA. If it weren't for the Indy champ car roots, it might have been. And Indy too, invited drivers and teams from all walks of life. Many went home instead of qualifying year after year. Now, It takes 4 million dollars to get to the track and make one lap. you can't start that program out of your backyard garage, where many of the early cars came from.

I remember Dick Simon's CART operation down in San Clemente CA back in the early '80's. Not even 2000 sq. ft. of shop. The man could run the operation from his back pocket if he had to, and on occasion, he did. Who could do that now? Few, that's who, and they won't. They're not real racers in my mind. Sportsmen, maybe. And that has a lot to do with why racing is what it is today.

Open wheel going away? Could happen, it happened to CanAm and that was one of the best racing we've ever seen. And were there big billboard signs on the side of the Chaparal's and Lola's. No.

[cegerer]

Ironically, it was the CART open-wheelers that wiped out the CanAm in 1979!

And who says open-wheel isn't accessible. I took this photo without any type of credentials or special pass. And yes, this is Indy and I'm on the hot side of the pit wall. And that's NASCAR star Robby Gordon doing his rookie orientation back in the CART days. Try getting a similar shot at a NASCAR race.

[Sponge]

Outstanding picture -- I know IRL lets some people on pre-race to look at the cars... (Phoenix race last year... I was visiting...) though I am not a big IRL fan (go fast turn left...) - the series is in the business of trying to generate fan base...

Anyone come up with a good system yet for a F1 pool?

[GrindingGears]

TV coverage? U.S. sponsorships?

When I lived in Europe (8 years) I was into or followed a totally different set of sports than what I do here. Why? Because I watched the sports that the Euros broadcasted on TV. Get this, I consistently watched/followed, track and field, F1, 500cc moto racing, and cycling. Do I follow these now? NO. Why not? They're not broadcast in the U.S., or if they are at 2am. I think it comes down to the tv coverage. Who buys the TV coverage in the U.S.? Tide, Viagra, Bud, blah blah blah.

How many american drivers are there to root for in F1? Better yet, how many american sponsors are invovled with F1 (when compared to NASCAR)? It's kinda like the Tour de France, americans wouldnt give a $hit about the TDF if Armstrong or Lemond weren't there to win it. Oh you know who Lance is? Thank you, USPS, Subaru, Nike, and Comcast.

I hate to knock NASCAR, but give me a ****** break, compared to F1 it's like watching cars go around and around in circles. Oh wait...

Disclaimer: Is this post poorly written and thought out? Yes. Please forgive me, I'm at work and just letting things flow.

[Sponge]

Budwiser is now a sponsor of the Williams team (right on the air intake) - of course they are trying to get a larger international stake...

Additionally Red Bull is specifically targeting young US drivers in an attempt to get a US F1 driver...

Just some thoughts... I think they will fail... 0600 on Speed channel will not bring a large neilson rating....

[Reg]

Speed does run the races at primetime later on that day in most if not all cases. That in my mind is better than head to head on Sunday afternoon when there is usually a NASCAR race. I say give them credit for that.

F1 would certainly gain more clout if there were a great American driver (who was established) go and clean house. Is that ever going to happen?


Quotes read today:

"My hope is that Champ Car goes away and we become one series"

"If open-wheel racing is going to start going where we want it to go, that's what's going to have to happen. If Champ Car continues on, it's just going to drag all of open-wheel racing down. It would be a shame for that to happen."

&

"I'm sick of talking about whose fault this was and whose fault that was. Who cares? Let's just fix it."


.... from Michael Andretti

[cegerer]

I might have been slightly misleading ....... I was on a business trip and figured I'd stop by the track to see if anything was happening. It was 'rookie orientation' day. Not many people there. It was the year that Nigel Mansell (injured and didn't run), Nelson Piquet, Robby Gordon, Stefan Johannson, John Morton and several other notables were taking their tests. I just walked in with a couple of Nikons around my neck. Must have looked like a pro or something because I never got checked once. Was even out at the guardrail with the cars at speed! Here's a few more from that memorable day:

[motion]

That Michael Whinedretti guy is a traitor... in my book, he's right up there with Jack Newtown. A wasted talent who exited with his tail between his legs.

As to why F1 isn't popular here... its really just because we Americans have *extremely* short attention spans. NASCRAP is easy to understand and recognizable... hell, they even use jacks just like the one in my garage.

F1 on the other hand, takes a serious investment in one's time in order to appreciate the drivers, history and cars. Its 100 times as complex as NASCRAP. I just don't think many Americans are willing to get off their fat asses and get into it.

[brawlins]

Not sure I see the reason for the animosity to NASCAR.
Have you ever been to a race? It's really electric. I wonder if there's a little bit of P-Car snobbiness out there because many NASCAR drivers have a Southern Drawl?

I like F1 as well as NASCAR. I enjoy watching F1 on TV, but I don't find it "100 times as complex" as NASCAR. A lot of the same issues: Pit strategy, watching the gas mileage.

Here's the part about F1 that I don't like: The passing is not aggressive enough and really can't be because of the open wheels.
But I enjoy it anyway. Just need to get some good competition for Schumacher.

[SteveStromberg]

Round and Round They go. Boring , Yellow flag with 9 laps to go lets bunch them up. Why dont the just race Five 10 lap sprints. Then declare the winner that would be more interesting. If Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Round and Yellow Flag
Round and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round and BIG CRASH IN TURN THREE Yellow Flag Round and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round andRound and Round and Round and Round and Round and Taking the Checekrd Flag is ROBBIE GORDON IN THE PREPARATION H Monte Carlo

WOO HOO

[motion]

Don't forget about the yellow flag for "debris in turn three", LOL. But of course, they only throw that when John Andretti or Robby Gordon are leading

[motion]

Diggety, diggety, diggety!!!!!!!

[brawlins]

Hey - You guys missed the original question - How do you get Open-Wheel Racing out of the ditch?

Mock NASCAR all you want as they make billions of $$$.

Put your thinking cap on and save Open-Wheel Racing in the USA!

[Sponge]

I think it depends on what you mean by save.....

If you want to have open wheel racing, no matter the format, then get CART and IRL together and make rules much more like NASCAR to decrease inititive, increase closeness in cars and focus on the drivers as personallities. Run a lot of Ovals, get advertisers -- maybe find a link with NASCAR (swap some drivers for some races - gimicks like that).

If you want to keep street circut type racing -- it is more complex... I am not sure there is a way to get the attention back. There is just too much competition from all forms of sports now that we have so many channels to tune into. This year with my Digital Video Recorder, I just set it to tape all F1 and could watch all of the races when I wanted-- meaning, I do not have to watch the events the networks put on TV when I am awake, or can watch -- I can watch what I want.

So long story short... either get on the NASCAR strategy for marketing, or accept a smaller US market share while trying to optimize international participation and races.

[power]

Originally posted by brawlins
What'll it take to pull open-wheel racing out of the ditch?

Swaying public opinion for less Nascar coverage and more open wheel coverage.

To achieve this, may I suggest sending speedchannels Dave Despain thousands of unsolicited emails complaining about all the Nascar coverage on speedchannel?

[brawlins]

Sponge - Great post.

- Bill